How to live without heating - save £000s

John464

Herbyme said:

 presumably the big builders have chums in high places 

Well they hire enough Members of Parliament
Since we are paying MPs several times our average pay they should be working for us, not someone else.
But they choose a leader like Johnson or Truss who will even change the law to get them off when they are caught like Patterson.

Markc0011

I had an experiment last year of trying different ways to keep warm. Because landlord puts on the radiator on a timer, so outside those times it's cold and I didn't want to buy an expensive fan heater.  Big helpers were thermal wear, merino wool- and I repeat merino wool, I would put a merino wool t-shirt and it was so good. Hot water bottle every so often. Good socks.
I think there's a time of day when you suddenly notice it's starting cold and thats about 3pm. 

Mstty

Markc0011 said:

I had an experiment last year of trying different ways to keep warm. Because landlord puts on the radiator on a timer, so outside those times it's cold and I didn't want to buy an expensive fan heater.  Big helpers were thermal wear, merino wool- and I repeat merino wool, I would put a merino wool t-shirt and it was so good. Hot water bottle every so often. Good socks.
I think there's a time of day when you suddenly notice it's starting cold and thats about 3pm. 

I presume your bills are covered in your rent for the scenario where your landlord controls your heating/thermostat?

Markc0011

yes. Mstty said:

Markc0011 said:

I had an experiment last year of trying different ways to keep warm. Because landlord puts on the radiator on a timer, so outside those times it's cold and I didn't want to buy an expensive fan heater.  Big helpers were thermal wear, merino wool- and I repeat merino wool, I would put a merino wool t-shirt and it was so good. Hot water bottle every so often. Good socks.
I think there's a time of day when you suddenly notice it's starting cold and thats about 3pm. 

I presume your bills are covered in your rent for the scenario where your landlord controls your heating/thermostat?

Yes, so it's a cheap rent for having this arrangement of timer-controlled radiators.


Another point to the thread by the way. In 1996-1997 there was 50,000 excess deaths due to the winter, so Labour introduced Winter heating allowance I think. (for the elderly) It wouldn't surprise me if the Tories bump that figure up this year with the rise in energy prices.

But the key point I want to make. Covid. It negatively impacts the circulation. With covid around, it might be twice as important to keep warm.

John464

QrizB said:
Pensioners are relatively well supported already.

Relative to who?
Relative to the rest of the Western world the basic UK state pension is about the lowest - (and many pensioners pay rent.)
Relative to the unemployed pensioners are well supported.
But if you could afford to raise unemployment pay you can take away the incentive to work (if better off on benefits than in work. Just been reading of a guy doing 2 full time jobs and still needing the foodbank.)

brewerdave

Mstty said:

@brewerdave

One in four pensioners are millionaires.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/pensions-retirement/news/number-millionaire-pensioners-quadruples/

They will be alright .

I suspect the next two in four are decently well off as only the bottom 11% actually get pension credit.

The targeted help required will be those on pension credit. That's apparently 1.4million pensioners

Did you know there are over 12 million pensioners in the UK so when someone broadly says pensioners will die or pensioners need help they may need to qualify that with the bottom 10-25% need help and they imo should get it.

Eh ? So a lot of the people I know ,are hiding a fortune under their mattress ! LOL
As @Alnat1 said it's mainly to do with people (PROBABLY in the SE of England) living in houses valued at ££0000s. I can assure you that the number of "millionaire" pensioners in South Wales is a lot less than 1 in 4!!
The pension credit figure is an underestimate because a lot of pensioners are too proud to claim even tho' they are entitled or are put off by the paperwork required to claim. I believe there are ~ 40% of eligible pensioners missing out which could be at least a further 1 million households.

deano2099

in_my_wellies said:

Alnat1 said:

Many of the pensioners who are "millionaires" will live in a house that's worth a lot. Asset rich, cash poor.

Many will be reluctant to give up the home they've lived in for years, even if it is much too big for their needs and is costing a fortune to heat. They also see home improvements as not worth it as they won't get ROI in their lifetime.

My neighbour is 91. Alone in a six bed house. She worked out it would cost £25,000 to downsize to a property more suited to her needs. A large percentage of that is stamp duty. If she were to be exempt from stamp duty because she downsized she would move and free up her house for a family. As it is she says £25,000 will buy a lot of heat. 

And if she has access to that £25k in cash somehow to actually pay for the heating bills that's fine. The problem is where people don't, but also don't want to take that loss of £25k stamp duty by downsizing to a small £700,000 property.

Mstty

brewerdave said:

Mstty said:

@brewerdave

One in four pensioners are millionaires.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/pensions-retirement/news/number-millionaire-pensioners-quadruples/

They will be alright .

I suspect the next two in four are decently well off as only the bottom 11% actually get pension credit.

The targeted help required will be those on pension credit. That's apparently 1.4million pensioners

Did you know there are over 12 million pensioners in the UK so when someone broadly says pensioners will die or pensioners need help they may need to qualify that with the bottom 10-25% need help and they imo should get it.

Eh ? So a lot of the people I know ,are hiding a fortune under their mattress ! LOL
As @Alnat1 said it's mainly to do with people (PROBABLY in the SE of England) living in houses valued at ££0000s. I can assure you that the number of "millionaire" pensioners in South Wales is a lot less than 1 in 4!!
The pension credit figure is an underestimate because a lot of pensioners are too proud to claim even tho' they are entitled or are put off by the paperwork required to claim. I believe there are ~ 40% of eligible pensioners missing out which could be at least a further 1 million households.

No one mentioned geography or to suggest than any area only got a % of help so I faile to see your arguement here. The statistics point towards targeted pensioner help(not geographically bound) which I agree with.

What I took exception to is bunching all pensioners/elderly together as sitting at home in the freezing cold with no options but to freeze to death. The statistics simply do not back this up. 

It's just a balance for people to remember when saying "what about the elderly/pensioners" where the majority will be absolutely fine this winter, just a little less in the bank, reducing energy usage like the rest of the population.

I covered your missing 1 million with the range of 10-25%👍

aoleks

flippin heck, a cave is warmer than your house at 2 degrees.

brewerdave

Mstty said:

brewerdave said:

Mstty said:

@brewerdave

One in four pensioners are millionaires.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/pensions-retirement/news/number-millionaire-pensioners-quadruples/

They will be alright .

I suspect the next two in four are decently well off as only the bottom 11% actually get pension credit.

The targeted help required will be those on pension credit. That's apparently 1.4million pensioners

Did you know there are over 12 million pensioners in the UK so when someone broadly says pensioners will die or pensioners need help they may need to qualify that with the bottom 10-25% need help and they imo should get it.

Eh ? So a lot of the people I know ,are hiding a fortune under their mattress ! LOL
As @Alnat1 said it's mainly to do with people (PROBABLY in the SE of England) living in houses valued at ££0000s. I can assure you that the number of "millionaire" pensioners in South Wales is a lot less than 1 in 4!!
The pension credit figure is an underestimate because a lot of pensioners are too proud to claim even tho' they are entitled or are put off by the paperwork required to claim. I believe there are ~ 40% of eligible pensioners missing out which could be at least a further 1 million households.

No one mentioned geography or to suggest than any area only got a % of help so I faile to see your arguement here. The statistics point towards targeted pensioner help(not geographically bound) which I agree with.

What I took exception to is bunching all pensioners/elderly together as sitting at home in the freezing cold with no options but to freeze to death. The statistics simply do not back this up. 

My "argument" is that a headline of "1 in 4 pensioners is a millionaire" is grossly unfair because it WILL be geographically biased! And cause more resentment against ALL pensioners regardless of where and how they live.
 Nothing to do with targeting help - that I agree with - but maybe the Govt. should drive greater uptake of existing benefits first.,