On E7 Electricity Tariff, but without storage heaters - is it worth to remove it?

schnegge_london

We've moved houses in October into an all-electric flat. I know it's the most expensive way of heating, but we got the contract in August just shortly before the new price cap was announced and the prices started to rise even further and we signed for 2 years without a breaking clause - so moving is not an option. 

After figuring out that EDF first put us on an overpriced fixed tariff by completely understating the expected monthly direct debit, we are now at the default tariff for the following parameters:

- Daytime: 24,96p per kWh
- Nighttime: 11.48 per kWh

We got our first electricity bill covering 3 months from mid-October to mid-January, and the usage is 1504 kWh at daytime (= £375) and only 134 kWh (= £15) at nighttime.
We don't have storage heaters, so we basically only use the nighttime tariff to heat up the boiler to have hot water in the sinks and sometimes to run the dishwasher. 
I'm worried to run the dryer over night time as the fire brigade is clearly advising against it. Unfortunately I need the dryer at least for the towels and the bed sheets as they otherwise simply won't dry in our flat. 

From my understanding for an E7 tariff you pay more for the day tariff and therefore get the cheaper night tariff. I would expect the normal default tariff (without E7) to be around 21p from what I googled. So if I do the maths and add them together and assume 21p I come to (1504+134) *21p = £344 instead of £390 which would have saved me already roughly £50 for just three months (okay, in the expensive heating months, but this should sum up to at least £100 per year)

Can you confirm the normal default tariff should be around that (at least until April) and does anyone know if energy companies let you switch from E7 to a non E7 - I mean in my case it is just useless for me. 

I just try to save as much as I possibly can and I'm honestly worried where my energy bills will go if the new price cap kicks in from April. 

Astria

You MAY need an electrician as they might need to move your hot water (which is currently on an E7 circuit) to your normal day time circuit. I'd also have a chat with EDF and some seem reluctant to move people from E7 to non-E7.

schnegge_london

We just use the boiler overnight to at least save a bit of money and not run it on the daytime tariff. We can switch it off and on via a socket in the kitchen, and when I look on the smart meter it seems to be on two different rates then.
Also we only need it for the sinks to warm up the water in the kitchen and the bathroom sink, as our shower is electrical. 

But it would be interesting to know if any other forum members have experiences in switching from E7 to non E7?
These energy companies are just squeezing every penny out of you  

Gerry1

schnegge_london said:

I would expect the normal default tariff (without E7) to be around 21p from what I googled. So if I do the maths and add them together and assume 21p I come to (1504+134) *21p = £344 instead of £390 which would have saved me already roughly £50 for just three months (okay, in the expensive heating months, but this should sum up to at least £100 per year)

Don't assume anything.  As the old saying goes, it makes an a s s out of u & me !  You must find out the exact prices for single rate, and don't forget 5% VAT.  Similarly for the daily charge, don't assume it will be the same as for E7.

schnegge_london said:

We just use the boiler overnight to at least save a bit of money and not run it on the daytime tariff. We can switch it off and on via a socket in the kitchen, and when I look on the smart meter it seems to be on two different rates then.

Presumably you mean the immersion heater in the hot tank?  At any given moment you can only be on one rate with E7, it's either on the standard (day) rate or the lower (overnight) rate.  Some E7 areas have two hours of day rate in the middle of the low rate periods.  The standard and lower rates may be labelled Rate 1 and Rate 2, or vice versa.  Make sure they're not transposed on the bill.

schnegge_london said:

But it would be interesting to know if any other forum members have experiences in switching from E7 to non E7?

I have an E7 meter but GCH.  In normal times I change between E7 and single rate depending on which is cheaper.  Even with night use at only 20% E7 can sometimes be cheaper, it varies.  My region low rate times are 2230 - 0030 and 0230 - 0730 GMT so that can be useful for double dipping, getting the lower rate last thing at night and first thing in the morning, especially during BST.

It's a doddle to change.

Robin9

schnegge_london said:

.....................

We got our first electricity bill covering 3 months from mid-October to mid-January, and the usage is 1504 kWh at daytime (= £375) and only 134 kWh (= £15) at nighttime...................

The very low night -- time usage would suggest that your hot water is not being heated at night at all - has it got its own timer?

134kWh is likely to be solely fridge and freezer.

schnegge_london

Robin9 said:

schnegge_london said:

.....................

We got our first electricity bill covering 3 months from mid-October to mid-January, and the usage is 1504 kWh at daytime (= £375) and only 134 kWh (= £15) at nighttime...................

The very low night -- time usage would suggest that your hot water is not being heated at night at all - has it got its own timer?

134kWh is likely to be solely fridge and freezer.

That's what stated on our bill - I always check before I go to bed that the smart meter isn't counting anything (i.e. forgetting to switch of the heating). And in the nights we don't run the boiler when I wake up it is usually a bit more than the standing charge, which makes me believe the boiler isn't running accidentally in the background.

I fear our boiler is a bit faulty anyway, the needle which shows how full it is only moves to a certain point. We run it every other night for 3 hrs via a timer. That's enough to fill it up for 2 days as it only powers the sinks in the kitchen and in the bathroom with hot water (and we don't take baths, and the shower is electrical.)

schnegge_london

Gerry1 said:

schnegge_london said:

I would expect the normal default tariff (without E7) to be around 21p from what I googled. So if I do the maths and add them together and assume 21p I come to (1504+134) *21p = £344 instead of £390 which would have saved me already roughly £50 for just three months (okay, in the expensive heating months, but this should sum up to at least £100 per year)

Don't assume anything.  As the old saying goes, it makes an a s s out of u & me !  You must find out the exact prices for single rate, and don't forget 5% VAT.  Similarly for the daily charge, don't assume it will be the same as for E7.

schnegge_london said:

We just use the boiler overnight to at least save a bit of money and not run it on the daytime tariff. We can switch it off and on via a socket in the kitchen, and when I look on the smart meter it seems to be on two different rates then.

Presumably you mean the immersion heater in the hot tank?  At any given moment you can only be on one rate with E7, it's either on the standard (day) rate or the lower (overnight) rate.  Some E7 areas have two hours of day rate in the middle of the low rate periods.  The standard and lower rates may be labelled Rate 1 and Rate 2, or vice versa.  Make sure they're not transposed on the bill.

schnegge_london said:

But it would be interesting to know if any other forum members have experiences in switching from E7 to non E7?

I have an E7 meter but GCH.  In normal times I change between E7 and single rate depending on which is cheaper.  Even with night use at only 20% E7 can sometimes be cheaper, it varies.  My region low rate times are 2230 - 0030 and 0230 - 0730 GMT so that can be useful for double dipping, getting the lower rate last thing at night and first thing in the morning, especially during BST.

It's a doddle to change.

I'm more or less new to this whole E7 and stuff - I was always on central gas heating before and didn't even think about that there is something like an E7 on and that was the only tariff that EDF offered me when I moved in. I wasn't even able to choose from a non E-7 one. 

Well, after 1hr in the waiting line at EDF, I was able to confirm that they are able to switch the tariff to a non E-7 one at 20.87p per kWH. I hope this will bring my bills down at least a little bit, I'm happy about every penny in the current situation. 

maisie_cat

We have 2 meters because this house had storage heaters. We have had both on a single tariff for 3 suppliers now  We only use 1 kwh at night and 10 day though as we now have biomass heating.

Gerry1

maisie_cat said:

We have 2 meters because this house had storage heaters. We have had both on a single tariff for 3 suppliers now  We only use 1 kwh at night and 10 day though as we now have biomass heating.

Make sure you're only paying one daily charge.

QrizB

schnegge_london said:

After figuring out that EDF first put us on an overpriced fixed tariff by completely understating the expected monthly direct debit, we are now at the default tariff for the following parameters:
- Daytime: 24,96p per kWh
- Nighttime: 11.48 per kWh
We got our first electricity bill covering 3 months from mid-October to mid-January, and the usage is 1504 kWh at daytime (= £375) and only 134 kWh (= £15) at nighttime.
We don't have storage heaters, so we basically only use the nighttime tariff to heat up the boiler to have hot water in the sinks and sometimes to run the dishwasher.

Typically you need to use at least 25% of your electricity on the night rate for E7 to be cheaper than single rate. In your case you're only using 8% at night and so you'd be better off on a single rate tariff.
As others have said, 134kWh for ~90 days is only 1.5kWh per day. Either you're extremely light users of hot water or you have a *very* small HW tank.

maisie_cat

Gerry1 said:

maisie_cat said:

We have 2 meters because this house had storage heaters. We have had both on a single tariff for 3 suppliers now  We only use 1 kwh at night and 10 day though as we now have biomass heating.

Make sure you're only paying one daily charge.

We do only pay daily charge, it never occurred to me that there would be anything else