APCOA Parking Charge - Have I shot myself in the foot?

tttttt18887

Hi all,

On Sunday 9th January 2022, I received a windscreen parking ticket on Station Approach, Chislehurst (Chislehurst Train Station) - where apparently the whole road is private land and requires you to purchase a ticket.

I didn't realise this and got a windscreen parking ticket a long with 4 other vehicles. Just as a bit of a background I was visiting the local pub and the waitress said I could park there no issues (clearly not the case). I tried to phone them to complain but the pub never answered their phone and I am not local.

Location/ Route: I entered Station Approach from Chislehurst Road, where there are no signs at any height to indicate the road is private parking. I parked on the left hand side of the road and there was no sign whatsoever to mark you need to pay for parking nor opposite me. 



I've appealed directly to APCOA and submitted my appeal here, but this was before I researched and found this forum so I've used the language "I" and essentially alluded that I was driving.  

 .dropbox.com/s/o1vb9fxd0tsb98i/Challenge%20-%20ACPOA%20.pdf?dl=0

I've appealed on the basis that there is no clear signage at all to indicate the whole road is private and requires payment. I drove further into the road, and found a sign on the opposite side that payment is required but was 30 metres from where I was originally parked. Although the sign doesn't state how much you have to pay.



I was stressing and returned to the location before work at 5.30am in the morning and I could see there was one small sign on the right hand side of the fence, but that was hidden by other vehicles that where parked there, especially as the sign is at chest height and the sign is very small. Definitely wouldn't of seen it as I wasn't crossing the road. 

This was the sign on the right hand side:

As expected, I got a rejected appeal straight away  .dropbox.com/s/qgal2784zxwwhtl/Challenge%20Response%20APCOA%20.pdf?dl=0 and they sent the letter to my address.

I was thinking about appealing on the basis of:

• Railway Land Is Not ‘Relevant Land’.
• APCOA Using Railway Bye law for claims.
• Non-compliant signage.
• Lack of standing / authority from landowner.

However I don't know if I have a case and should just pay the £60 as I've appealed and identified as the driver? 

Any advice, greatly appreciate this.

Coupon-mad

Yes you shot your toes off, sad to say.  You had 100% appeal win as keeper, that you now can't use.

But no paying it!

APCOA never sue anyone and cannot, if this is a PENALTY charge rather than a parking charge.  And if it is the former, it times out in 6 months and will naturally go away.  Which is it?

You can't use either of these, if your first appeal gave away who was driving:

• Railway Land Is Not ‘Relevant Land’.
• APCOA Using Railway Bye law for claims

Redx

It was a slam dunk win for a keeper appeal , but 2 toes were blown off when you shot yourself in the foot , the 2 toes mentioned above by coupon mad  😜😜. Blabbing about who was driving can cost money !

A popla appeal is based on the remaining toes

No landowner authority
Poor and inadequate signage , breaking Lord Dennings red hand rule , especially at the road entrance !
Any BPA CoP failures

Definitely not POFA or non relevant land or bylaws , not if it was a parking charge notice and not a penalty notice !
Bylaws require a penalty notice , contract law requires an invoice , a parking charge notice

D_P_Dance

IMO  those signs amount to unfair terms and conditions under the CRA 2015.  Read this and complain to your MP.   

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/5972164/parking-eye-signs-oxford-road-reading/p1

tttttt18887

Coupon-mad said:

Yes you shot your toes off, sad to say.  You had 100% appeal win as keeper, that you now can't use.

But no paying it!

APCOA never sue anyone and cannot, if this is a PENALTY charge rather than a parking charge.  And if it is the former, it times out in 6 months and will naturally go away.  Which is it?

You can't use either of these, if your first appeal gave away who was driving:

• Railway Land Is Not ‘Relevant Land’.
• APCOA Using Railway Bye law for claims

It is a Penalty Charge on the ticket. Thanks Red X and Coupon Mad for confirming, I did figure I really did shot myself in the foot.

Also couldn't find any planning permission plans for the signs that have been erected either.

Can I really win based on:

• No landowner authority
• Poor and inadequate signage , breaking Lord Dennings red hand rule , especially at the road entrance !
• BPA CoP failures

I'll be honest, I've spent too much time on this stressing and just thinking of paying so this goes away.

Redx

tttttt18887 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Yes you shot your toes off, sad to say.  You had 100% appeal win as keeper, that you now can't use.

But no paying it!

APCOA never sue anyone and cannot, if this is a PENALTY charge rather than a parking charge.  And if it is the former, it times out in 6 months and will naturally go away.  Which is it?

You can't use either of these, if your first appeal gave away who was driving:

• Railway Land Is Not ‘Relevant Land’.
• APCOA Using Railway Bye law for claims

It is a Penalty Charge on the ticket. Thanks Red X and Coupon Mad for confirming, I did figure I really did shot myself in the foot.

Also couldn't find any planning permission plans for the signs that have been erected either.

Can I really win based on:

• No landowner authority
• Poor and inadequate signage , breaking Lord Dennings red hand rule , especially at the road entrance !
• BPA CoP failures

I'll be honest, I've spent too much time on this stressing and just thinking of paying so this goes away.

Only Popla or a judge can answer that !  You can but try !

Coupon-mad

Whaaat?  This is APCOA!  Nothing will happen.

Why would you pay when it times out in just 6 months and you can get half way there by appealing on day 33 (the last day) to POPLA?

D_P_Dance

IIMU that APCOA flee at the first sign of a winning POpla appeal.

BellaCassie17

D_P_Dance said:

IIMU that APCOA flee at the first sign of a winning POpla appeal.

Coupon-mad said:

Whaaat?  This is APCOA!  Nothing will happen.

Why would you pay when it times out in just 6 months and you can get half way there by appealing on day 33 (the last day) to POPLA?

Redx said:

tttttt18887 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Yes you shot your toes off, sad to say.  You had 100% appeal win as keeper, that you now can't use.

But no paying it!

APCOA never sue anyone and cannot, if this is a PENALTY charge rather than a parking charge.  And if it is the former, it times out in 6 months and will naturally go away.  Which is it?

You can't use either of these, if your first appeal gave away who was driving:

• Railway Land Is Not ‘Relevant Land’.
• APCOA Using Railway Bye law for claims

It is a Penalty Charge on the ticket. Thanks Red X and Coupon Mad for confirming, I did figure I really did shot myself in the foot.

Also couldn't find any planning permission plans for the signs that have been erected either.

Can I really win based on:

• No landowner authority
• Poor and inadequate signage , breaking Lord Dennings red hand rule , especially at the road entrance !
• BPA CoP failures

I'll be honest, I've spent too much time on this stressing and just thinking of paying so this goes away.

Only Popla or a judge can answer that !  You can but try !

Hi all, I’m in the exact same situation but different train station apparently it’s permit holders only before 9:30 I paid and displayed and I asked an employee to show me the ticket machine and she failed to tell me I shouldn’t have been there without a permit

i too used “I” in my appeal, to clarify is your advice here ignore it until it goes away in 6 months time? Can I complain to network rail/south eastern rail? Can I also complain to POPLA?

many thanks in advance x

Umkomaas

BellaCassie17 said:

D_P_Dance said:

IIMU that APCOA flee at the first sign of a winning POpla appeal.

Coupon-mad said:

Whaaat?  This is APCOA!  Nothing will happen.

Why would you pay when it times out in just 6 months and you can get half way there by appealing on day 33 (the last day) to POPLA?

Redx said:

tttttt18887 said:

Coupon-mad said:

Yes you shot your toes off, sad to say.  You had 100% appeal win as keeper, that you now can't use.

But no paying it!

APCOA never sue anyone and cannot, if this is a PENALTY charge rather than a parking charge.  And if it is the former, it times out in 6 months and will naturally go away.  Which is it?

You can't use either of these, if your first appeal gave away who was driving:

• Railway Land Is Not ‘Relevant Land’.
• APCOA Using Railway Bye law for claims

It is a Penalty Charge on the ticket. Thanks Red X and Coupon Mad for confirming, I did figure I really did shot myself in the foot.

Also couldn't find any planning permission plans for the signs that have been erected either.

Can I really win based on:

• No landowner authority
• Poor and inadequate signage , breaking Lord Dennings red hand rule , especially at the road entrance !
• BPA CoP failures

I'll be honest, I've spent too much time on this stressing and just thinking of paying so this goes away.

Only Popla or a judge can answer that !  You can but try !

Hi all, I’m in the exact same situation but different train station apparently it’s permit holders only before 9:30 I paid and displayed and I asked an employee to show me the ticket machine and she failed to tell me I shouldn’t have been there without a permit

i too used “I” in my appeal, to clarify is your advice here ignore it until it goes away in 6 months time? Can I complain to network rail/south eastern rail? Can I also complain to POPLA?

many thanks in advance x

Please don't jump in on someone else's thread. We can only deal with one parking charge per thread, even though it may be the same parking firm involved. There are too many other variables that will result in advice becoming complicated, confusing and potentially costly to the OP, you, and/or any other random who joins in with their issue, in an uncontrolled free for all. 

Single threads with multiple cases isn't how the forum operates. So would you please start a new thread of your own so you can receive bespoke advice about your case.