First Party Fraud

3card

I am a landlord of a couple of residential properties.
In the last few days one of my tenants should have paid their rent. When it was late i dropped her a message to ask about it because its not the 1st time there has been payment problems.
She has text to say her bank account was blocked the day before and sent me a screenshot of the message she had received and it says its a first party fraud

I have googled this and it says its not a type of ID fraud. Has anyone got any experience regarding this type of fraud? The more i read up the more confused i get and i dont expect to get a truthful explanation from my tenant

Yesterday she was telling me that she was emailing the bank to sort it out but she has no idea of the timescale

Thanks for any advice

born_again

1st party fraud is when the account holder is being accused of being party to fraud.
So that could be one of many scenarios. 

They are correct there is no timescale for a resolution. 

Although it is very odd that bank has stated the reason why, when they have only just blocked her account. All that is normally stated is account is under investigation. As anything else can be classed as tipping off.

Maybe time to look at the tenancy agreement.

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born_again said:

1st party fraud is when the account holder is being accused of being party to fraud.
So that could be one of many scenarios. 

They are correct there is no timescale for a resolution. 

Although it is very odd that bank has stated the reason why, when they have only just blocked her account. All that is normally stated is account is under investigation. As anything else can be classed as tipping off.

Maybe time to look at the tenancy agreement.

It looks like you are correct.
I have just looked at the screenshot a little closer and the 1st line does actually say "thank you for your email" so it looks like there is more to this than she is telling

I will chase up the situation tomorrow

I already have things going round in my head with regards to the TA

Thanks

PRAISETHESUN

From the perspective of the bank account, there is nothing you can do - I'm suprised the tenant even knows what is going on as these sort of things usually end up with the bank stonewalling all inquiries whilst things get investigated.

At the end of the day, the tenant has an obligation to pay rent on time as outlined in the TA. As a LL you can choose to exercise some goodwill by offering a grace period on the late rent or not. I'd probably post on the Mortgages and Home board if you're after advice on how to deal with the tenant.

cx6

https://www.cifas.org.uk/insight/fraud-risk-focus-blog/tackling-first-party-fraud

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PRAISETHESUN said:

From the perspective of the bank account, there is nothing you can do - I'm suprised the tenant even knows what is going on as these sort of things usually end up with the bank stonewalling all inquiries whilst things get investigated.

At the end of the day, the tenant has an obligation to pay rent on time as outlined in the TA. As a LL you can choose to exercise some goodwill by offering a grace period on the late rent or not. I'd probably post on the Mortgages and Home board if you're after advice on how to deal with the tenant.

Just to let you know my goodwill is waining.
During the lockdowns i agreed to a greatly reduced rent with the make up to be agreed once she was back on her feet. She volunteered a figure to make this up and this stopped after a couple of months and her promises to start this again have never materialized.
On top of this she paid a lower figure last month with the promise that she would pay the full rent this month.

I think my goodwill has flew the nest 

My main reason for posting this was for someone to explain the first party fraud definition and i think thats been explained

Thanks you

canaldumidi

So exactly how much in arrears is she, including the historic ones and this latest? Have you got a proper rent schedule?

A few days late this month is not worth taking action over than writing politely pointing it out, enclosing a rent schedule, and requesting payment. "Dropping a message" is not the professional way to do this.

If late payment is repeated, consider a S8 G10 or G11.

If total arrears are 2 months +, consider S8 G8.

Schedule 2 (17 S8 Grounds a LL can use)

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canaldumidi said:

So exactly how much in arrears is she, including the historic ones and this latest? Have you got a proper rent schedule?

A few days late this month is not worth taking action over than writing politely pointing it out, enclosing a rent schedule, and requesting payment. "Dropping a message" is not the professional way to do this.

If late payment is repeated, consider a S8 G10 or G11.

If total arrears are 2 months +, consider S8 G8.

Schedule 2 (17 S8 Grounds a LL can use)

Yes we do have a proper rent schedule which itemizes all received and outstanding monies
The total figure outstanding including this months rent is £1150 and the rent due per month is £650 

The 'dropping a message' was just an informal enquiry as to the situation

For a S8 G8 do the arrears have to be full months or can the arrears amount to the value of 2 months rent?

robatwork

3card said:

During the lockdowns i agreed to a greatly reduced rent with the make up to be agreed once she was back on her feet. She volunteered a figure to make this up and this stopped after a couple of months and her promises to start this again have never materialized.

Years of avid Judge Judy watching has taught me one thing (and I'm sure it applies both sides of the pond). Actually 2.
If you make a contract verbally (or via text) to vary her rent then this won't necessarily override the written signed contract. Also, if you agreed to rent reduction "until she's back on her feet" then she certainly isn't, and possibly never will be, and therefore entitled to stay on the reduced rent.

I suspect you'll need to start eviction sooner rather than later and kiss your arrears goodbye.

MaryNB

When the grounds for an S8 G8 are met, issue an S21 at the same time in case she pays enough to reduce the arrears below 2 month's worth of rent. If she does so before the court hearing she may be able to stop the eviction process.
There are a lot of requirements to be met for an S21 to be valid so make sure you cover everything. 

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Amixo3032 said:

She’s taking you for a ride 

As much as i hate to say it i tend to agree with you