Holidays during Gardening Leave

getmore4less

A nuance of employment law is you don't need to agree/sign any changes

actions are sufficient (like not turning up) and getting paid you in effect agree unless you specifically disagree.

Reading the first post you did not refuse, just ignored.....

By not turning up for 6 months you agreed the change

Pianoman23

getmore4less said:

A nuance of employment law is you don't need to agree/sign any changes

actions are sufficient (like not turning up) and getting paid you in effect agree unless you specifically disagree.

Reading the first post you did not refuse, just ignored.....

By not turning up for 6 months you agreed the change

Thanks, GetMore. 

Are you sure you’re right about the ‘nuance to Employment Law’? I’m not sure you are - when a company wants to change any fundamental  T’s and C’s I’d always understood that they must seek agreement of the employee. If the employee disagrees then they would need to terminate their employment and re-appoint on new contract terms?

I know that conduct (such as not turning up) can imply agreement but implied agreements are very much nuanced matters in the law of contract. 

getmore4less

The issue here is from what you said you did not disagree you just went on GL as requested (that had the holiday clause)

They only need to terminate contracts and issue new ones if the employee disagrees. if they just work to the changes that enough.

As a follow up the other termination option is PILON,

With PILON it can be assumed that any holiday accruing during the notice period can always be taken with the relevant notice had the employee actually work, therefore the compensation for lack of notice does not need to include additional holiday pay for the holiday that would have accrued during that period,  any previous accrued unused would need to be paid.


If you keep on at then with your argument that you did not agree they may back down.

You do accrue holiday on garden leave so does the10 days include the 1/2 year of holiday that accrued while on GL,

if not you should be claiming that as well if you believe you needed to agree to take it.
 

Undervalued

getmore4less said:

I don't believe garden leave needs consent unless in the contract.

Even then GL  does not replace the contract it only modifies certain parts.

These may include, but may not be limited to, things like

The requirement to attend the office
The requirement to do work
A restriction of contacting other employees, customers and suppliers
Be available to come off garden leave and attend/work(often agreed notice like next day)
...

you are still fully employed under contract

I don't think it would replace the holiday rules unless specifically mentioned.

Does the holiday policy have addition terms for during notice, many have a you may be required to take holiday to override the statutory notice periods.

Indeed.

With so called "garden leave" you are still employed and are subject to all of the terms of your employment. It is just that the employer does not require you to turn up and work at that moment in time. Crucially however they can change their minds at any point and call you back in without prior notice. Hence the term "garden" leave. i.e you are no further away than your garden!

However they made it clear that they wanted you to choose ten days during that time as holiday. They could have specified which days but, as a favour, they gave you the choice which you ignored. Had you said which days then you would have been entitled to go away or, at the very least, not be available at a moments notice for those ten days.

Basically you are trying to "have the penny and the bun" here and I think that is the way any court will see if if you don't pay the money back and they sue you.

Brie

not addressing the question but just as an aside....when I was overpaid holidays in error by a former employer I did agree to pay them back.  At £1 a month.  Because I was that annoyed and I'm that petty.

Undervalued

Brie said:

not addressing the question but just as an aside....when I was overpaid holidays in error by a former employer I did agree to pay them back.  At £1 a month.  Because I was that annoyed and I'm that petty.

Which they didn't have to accept. If they had taken you to court you would have been ordered to pay either if full or, at best, at a rate the judge felt you could reasonably afford! Plus of course the court fee would have been added to the total. 

Just because somebody makes a mistake doesn't mean you have a right to be unreasonable.

Pianoman23

Jillanddy said:

@ pianoman23
"I’m guessing from your responses that you’re an HR professional?"

No I am not. And I wouldn't believe half of what people claim to be on anonymous websites either. If you want legal advice, there are things called lawyers and you pay them money to give you advice. 

@Brie
"not addressing the question but just as an aside....when I was overpaid holidays in error by a former employer I did agree to pay them back.  At £1 a month.  Because I was that annoyed and I'm that petty."

That might ne all true, but it doesn't mean anything. Your former employer agreed to that term, for whatever reason they agreed. They didn't have to. They could have gone to court anyway, and depending on your income they may or may not have got more (although I think £1 a week is usually the lower limit for those with very limited income). And if they had done that and been petty about it too, they'd have added claim / court fees too. You got away with it. That's no guarantee anyone else would. 


OP, I appreciate that you are not arguing wit anyone. You are also not listening to anyone. Every single person has told you what the law says, and you still insist on your own unsustainable interpretation of it based on what you want rather than facts. That's fine, carry on with that. But I'd suggest that arguing here with people is pointless - go argue with your former employer. They might just get so fed up of you that they give up just to end it. Or they might take you to court. Or get some proper legal advice  although - and I am rarely 100% certain of much, but on this I am - they are going to tell you what everyone here has told you, charge you for the advice, and then your employer may still take you to court for the debt. One thing is certain... arguing with people here is getting us and you nowhere, and you will still owe them the money whether you like what you are being told or not.

Thanks again - I’d never have thought to consult a lawyer….🙄 Are you always so patronising?  

As you acknowledged, I’m not arguing merely trying to see the whole picture - which appears a little too nuanced for you.

TELLIT01

Jillanddy, I'm afraid we have a situation where the OP has made their mind up that they are right and only wants comments which support their opinion, no matter how wrong they may be.