Cowboy tradesman

Doozergirl

Bendy_House said:

Aero, do you have Legal Protection on your house insurance? If 'yes', call them up for guidance, and for action later on if it's needed.

If you don't have it, then call them up anyway - there's a fair chance they'll advise you on the correct approach, but then you'd be on your own to sort it.

Do this properly. Don't just get someone else in to sort it and then try and reclaim of this guy - that's unlikely to work. You first need to outline to this guy what is going to happen.

You'd normally need to allow this issue to be resolved - fixed, made good - by the person before then (if they fail) getting someone else in to do so, and then suing the original person for the cost. However, and based on what you've described I'd suggest it is the case here, if they are of such incompetence that you suspect they are simply incapable of doing a good enough job, and/or the relationship between you has broken down to where no trust remains, (ditto - their threats make that clear), then you can go straight to the 'getting someone in to make good the work, and then the 'sue them' stage. But, you need to follow the correct path, and have a clear trail leading to your decision. That's why you need guidance, either from LP or CAB, for example.

And I would do this. The cost and hassle is minimal, and the guy will end up with a CCJ against him at the very least. And - unless he does something to evade paying up (and that isn't quite as easy as some folk think) - you can then set in motion the 'Sheriffs', and that will be most pleasing.

You can upload photos on here, but there's some size limit - not sure what it is. You'll have 'Photos' on your Win 10 - open the photos in that, go to the three-dots menu and choose 'Resize'. Pick 2MP or so.

I'm not sure the OP is in the position to be suing.  They've paid £1,600 for a £4,000 (£4,500)  job that has been grouted, so must be close to 'finished'.  

Yes, there's money to be spent to get it right but they have withheld money that will
enable them to do a lot of that.  There is a small question of the point at which you decide that someone is entirely incompetent - is the end the correct point?  Because it should be somewhere very close to the beginning if the value of their work is genuinely zero. 

The best outcome here, in terms of stress, is that their person gives it up as a lost cause and allows the OP to get on with finding someone else.  

bris

The law states you need to give him a chance to fix the work.

If he refuses then withhold the payment and get 3 quotes to put it right. This will come from what you owe him and if it doesn't cover the cost you can sue him for the balance.

It's also illegal to add interest to a consumer debt. 

Also £4500 for a fit only? 

Doozergirl

bris said:

The law states you need to give him a chance to fix the work.

If he refuses then withhold the payment and get 3 quotes to put it right. This will come from what you owe him and if it doesn't cover the cost you can sue him for the balance.

It's also illegal to add interest to a consumer debt. 

Also £4500 for a fit only? 

£4,500 is pretty normal for a proper job when the room gets stripped back.  A full bathroom fit is a significant building job that involves many different skills/trades and time.  

Bendy_House

Doozergirl said:

I'm not sure the OP is in the position to be suing.  They've paid £1,600 for a £4,000 (£4,500)  job that has been grouted, so must be close to 'finished'.  

Yes, there's money to be spent to get it right but they have withheld money that will
enable them to do a lot of that.  There is a small question of the point at which you decide that someone is entirely incompetent - is the end the correct point?  Because it should be somewhere very close to the beginning if the value of their work is genuinely zero. 

The best outcome here, in terms of stress, is that their person gives it up as a lost cause and allows the OP to get on with finding someone else.  

Yes, I agree with this.

I'd read the opening post wrong; I thought the quote was £1600 for the tiling, which sounds as tho' it needs redoing, and that the guy was adding the further amount to this! So if the OP had spent - wasted  - £1600 on tiling that needs to be redone, then they'd be pretty much £1600 out of pocket.

If, instead, they've had around £1600's worth of total bathroom work from this guy, then he can go whistle.

Bendy_House

bris said:

The law states you need to give him a chance to fix the work.

I understand there are circumstances where this is not the case.

If the work is of such a poor standard that the person doing it is clearly incompetent, or if the work is dangerous, or if the customer-tradesperson relationship has completely broken down (threats, arguments, lies, etc), then I understand the customer can effectively terminate the contract and not allow them a further chance to put things right.

But I'd suggest they get good advice so they know they are protected from a claim; they cannot just tell the fellow to sodoff and leave it at that.

Aero79

Doozergirl said:

Bendy_House said:

Aero, do you have Legal Protection on your house insurance? If 'yes', call them up for guidance, and for action later on if it's needed.

If you don't have it, then call them up anyway - there's a fair chance they'll advise you on the correct approach, but then you'd be on your own to sort it.

Do this properly. Don't just get someone else in to sort it and then try and reclaim of this guy - that's unlikely to work. You first need to outline to this guy what is going to happen.

You'd normally need to allow this issue to be resolved - fixed, made good - by the person before then (if they fail) getting someone else in to do so, and then suing the original person for the cost. However, and based on what you've described I'd suggest it is the case here, if they are of such incompetence that you suspect they are simply incapable of doing a good enough job, and/or the relationship between you has broken down to where no trust remains, (ditto - their threats make that clear), then you can go straight to the 'getting someone in to make good the work, and then the 'sue them' stage. But, you need to follow the correct path, and have a clear trail leading to your decision. That's why you need guidance, either from LP or CAB, for example.

And I would do this. The cost and hassle is minimal, and the guy will end up with a CCJ against him at the very least. And - unless he does something to evade paying up (and that isn't quite as easy as some folk think) - you can then set in motion the 'Sheriffs', and that will be most pleasing.

You can upload photos on here, but there's some size limit - not sure what it is. You'll have 'Photos' on your Win 10 - open the photos in that, go to the three-dots menu and choose 'Resize'. Pick 2MP or so.

I'm not sure the OP is in the position to be suing.  They've paid £1,600 for a £4,000 (£4,500)  job that has been grouted, so must be close to 'finished'.  

Yes, there's money to be spent to get it right but they have withheld money that will
enable them to do a lot of that.  There is a small question of the point at which you decide that someone is entirely incompetent - is the end the correct point?  Because it should be somewhere very close to the beginning if the value of their work is genuinely zero. 

The best outcome here, in terms of stress, is that their person gives it up as a lost cause and allows the OP to get on with finding someone else.  

Hi

he has progressively got worse as he’s gone along and  once advised we weren’t happy with the tiling/grouting he said it will look better it needs to dry then the following day sanded it down also there is cracking starting to appear in the grouting in a corner and along the beading of the boxed in section he has also now sent us an amended bill adding £500 for extras which was for plastering the ceiling and one wall and extra for putting a small piece of ply under our shower riser kit which we supplied.our floor tiles were meant to be staggered but he done then just standard block as he said he thought they would look better 🤦🏻‍♂️He has also damaged our door by cutting to much off as he said the floor was out,but he was the one that self levelled it and tiled it we can now get another 3 floor tiles under the door where he’s cut it

what he had left to do was some more pipe boxing,fit shower tray trim what he say we now need to buy as he put the ply under some existing trim dosent fit,the shower cubicle needs to be fitted,sink needs to be secured,shower and sink needs to be sealed once the cubicle is fitted,ceiling to be painted and one wall to be painted then a towel radiator to be put on the wall.He has also now said he won’t of painted it as he never priced for that.

so is £4000 now £4500 for a full bathroom quote or a partial quote 

Aero79

Hi

he has progressively got worse as he’s gone along and  once advised we weren’t happy with the tiling/grouting he said it will look better it needs to dry then the following day sanded it down also there is cracking starting to appear in the grouting in a corner and along the beading of the boxed in section he has also now sent us an amended bill adding £500 for extras which was for plastering the ceiling and one wall and extra for putting a small piece of ply under our shower riser kit which we supplied.our floor tiles were meant to be staggered but he done then just standard block as he said he thought they would look better 🤦🏻‍♂️He has also damaged our door by cutting to much off as he said the floor was out,but he was the one that self levelled it and tiled it we can now get another 3 floor tiles under the door where he’s cut it

what he had left to do was some more pipe boxing,fit shower tray trim what he say we now need to buy as he put the ply under some existing trim dosent fit,the shower cubicle needs to be fitted,sink needs to be secured,shower and sink needs to be sealed once the cubicle is fitted,ceiling to be painted and one wall to be painted then a towel radiator to be put on the wall.He has also now said he won’t of painted it as he never priced for that.

so is £4000 now £4500 for a full bathroom quote or a partial quote  the bathroom is only 2mx1.5m

Risteard

bris said:

It's also illegal to add interest to a consumer debt.

No it isn't. It's automatic for commercial debts, as in the law explicitly states that it applies. However I can still contractually include interest for consumers (and do).

outtatune

Have you got that threat of 20% per week penalty in writing? That would not impress a district judge in the slightest if it went to court.

Aero79

outtatune said:

Have you got that threat of 20% per week penalty in writing? That would not impress a district judge in the slightest if it went to court.

Hi

yeah sure have as he added to the bottom of his invoice 

Regards