Martin Lewis: The rise in the energy price cap next April will still be cheaper than any fixed deal

bagand96

wild666 said:

bagand96 said:

donny-gal said:

So in effect, when our fixed price with BG ends at the end of January, then just stay with them on their variable tariff?  Even though when I run through the Energy Club it suggesting variable with Utility Warehouse?

Utility Warehouse are always showing top of the comparison websites at the moment. But it's not like for like, to get those rates you must also take phone and broadband with them. 

But you have to take other products with them to get the cheapest deals, something I'm not willing to do just to save a few pound on electric and gas.

We're making the same point, I was replying to the poster who said they see UW as cheapest on the Energy Club.

wild666

coupleuk said:

I do wish we could move away from Ofgems 1, 2 or 3-bed tariff comparisons used by energy providers.

Why cant we have pence per kWh and pence per day stated - instead they are hidden in price comparison charts and require at least 2 clicks to find them.

The Ofgem route may be easier to see BUT it DEFINATELY DOES NOT show true results, only "guesstimates".

You can always put in your own readings from the last 12 months on most comparison sites that can reduce your monthly DD if you use less than the average user. I prefer to overestimate my yearly usage when visiting the comparison sites because there will normally be an increase in prices sometime during the year, unless you're on a fixed deal. 

Spies

I predict a 25% price rise in April - 25p/kwh for electric and 5p/kwh for gas.

Astria

coupleuk said:

I do wish we could move away from Ofgems 1, 2 or 3-bed tariff comparisons used by energy providers.

Why cant we have pence per kWh and pence per day stated - instead they are hidden in price comparison charts and require at least 2 clicks to find them.

The Ofgem route may be easier to see BUT it DEFINATELY DOES NOT show true results, only "guesstimates".

Thing is, pence per kWh and pence per day isn't useful for most people, all they are interested in is how much they are paying at the end. You need to multiply up the per day and then add your typical usage per year, and most comparison websites will do that for you anyway, typically under a "I know my usage" or similar. It typically takes me at least 2 runs through any comparison - what I've used in the last year and my prediction of usage in the next year. Until I've shortlisted my providers it's not even worth looking at kWh and standing charges.

Thrugelmir

Astria said:

martyp said:

On that basis a 40% increase on £845 would be £1139 on the assumption my supplier will jump their variable rate to the price cap the second they are able to (likely if making losses with the current one).
For me the best fixed rate is for 2 years at £1183 with Scottish Power which also offers £41.50 cashback with Topcashback so potentially £1141.50

After the last round of companies collapsing I wouldn't be surprised if companies are now putting in "get out" clauses so that they can cancel a fixed rate if they start making a loss on it.

Companies will be forward buying supply at a fixed price to match demand. Their gross operating margin is therefore fixed. None of the majors will selling fixed price products then speculating at buying at an unknown future spot price.  Not the way business works. Same principle applies to commodities of all kinds. 

QrizB

Spies said:

I predict a 25% price rise in April - 25p/kwh for electric and 5p/kwh for gas.

My forecast is in this thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6307877/what-should-the-unit-prices-be-to-cover-wholesale-prices

You'll all know how close I am in February, when the new cap is announced!

TheTone79

Hello all. I may be going soft in my old age, but I am genuinely struggling to work out what the 'price cap' announced by Ofgem actually is. I was on the variable standard tariff last year when the prices started to spike. I was expecting my unit rate on my tariff to increase by a maximum of 12% from October 1st 2021. What actually happened was it increased by 23% Electricity and 76% Gas:

Provider: Outfox the Market

Tariff: Summer 21 variable v2

Electricity - 17.30p/kWh 17.85p standing charge

Gas - 2.506p/kWh 21p standing charge

New Tariff (from October 9th 2021)

Electricity - 21.32p/kWh 18.9p standing charge (+23.2%)

Gas - 4.27p/kWh 18.9p standing charge (+76%)

I called my provider and they said they hadn't heard of the 12% cap but they were compliant with Ofgems cap system.

Confused.com

Please help if you know the answer. I would be very grateful.
Thanks

HeinzVarieties

TheTone79 said:

Hello all. I may be going soft in my old age, but I am genuinely struggling to work out what the 'price cap' announced by Ofgem actually is. I was on the variable standard tariff last year when the prices started to spike. I was expecting my unit rate on my tariff to increase by a maximum of 12% from October 1st 2021. What actually happened was it increased by 23% Electricity and 76% Gas:

Provider: Outfox the Market

Tariff: Summer 21 variable v2

Electricity - 17.30p/kWh 17.85p standing charge

Gas - 2.506p/kWh 21p standing charge

New Tariff (from October 9th 2021)

Electricity - 21.32p/kWh 18.9p standing charge (+23.2%)

Gas - 4.27p/kWh 18.9p standing charge (+76%)

I called my provider and they said they hadn't heard of the 12% cap but they were compliant with Ofgems cap system.

Confused.com

Please help if you know the answer. I would be very grateful.
Thanks

The "12% rise" was a 12% rise over the previous cap that was likely significantly more than you were paying on your previous tariff.

TheTone79

HeinzVarieties said:

TheTone79 said:

Hello all. I may be going soft in my old age, but I am genuinely struggling to work out what the 'price cap' announced by Ofgem actually is. I was on the variable standard tariff last year when the prices started to spike. I was expecting my unit rate on my tariff to increase by a maximum of 12% from October 1st 2021. What actually happened was it increased by 23% Electricity and 76% Gas:

Provider: Outfox the Market

Tariff: Summer 21 variable v2

Electricity - 17.30p/kWh 17.85p standing charge

Gas - 2.506p/kWh 21p standing charge

New Tariff (from October 9th 2021)

Electricity - 21.32p/kWh 18.9p standing charge (+23.2%)

Gas - 4.27p/kWh 18.9p standing charge (+76%)

I called my provider and they said they hadn't heard of the 12% cap but they were compliant with Ofgems cap system.

Confused.com

Please help if you know the answer. I would be very grateful.
Thanks

The "12% rise" was a 12% rise over the previous cap that was likely significantly more than you were paying on your previous tariff.

60mins in a queue to talk with my provider and even then they couldn't tell me that! Makes sense so thank you. Be good to see in numbers what the actual tariff is for the price cap. At least we would know what it was then and if I am on it.

QrizB

TheTone79 said:

60mins in a queue to talk with my provider and even then they couldn't tell me that! Makes sense so thank you. Be good to see in numbers what the actual tariff is for the price cap. At least we would know what it was then and if I am on it.

The cap isn't directly defined in terms of a maximum daily charge plus a maximum price per kWh. There is a little bit of flexibility in how the supplier puts the two together to meet the cap. It also varies by supply region.

However most of the major suppliers' variable tariffs are at the cap. This pdf from EDF is typical:

https://www.edfenergy.com/sites/default/files/r505_deemed_rate_card.pdf

Look at the entry for your region and payment method. How does it compare to your new OTM tariff?