Vendor refuses to renegotiate

TheJP

So OP has any of the advice here helped? Whats your next steps?

sammyjammy

aoleks said:

Sistergold said:

aoleks said:

Out of curiosity: why did you offer that much for a terraced house on a street where a semi detached one in better condition sold for less?

OP said they decided to offer as the terraced had a entrance door at the front and semi had entrance at the side. 

I get that, but a front door is not worth tens of thousands...

No but a door at the side could be a deal breaker for security/safety issues to some people.

ACG

There are 2 types of desktop valuations, one of them may well have looked at the listing on rightmove, google street view etc. So it could be that they have an idea of the condition of the windows - you will never know which they did though. 

You may think your request is reasonable, they may not. Everyones interpretation of reasonable differs. If they will not back down and you can not find a happy medium, you have to decide what to do. It does not really matter what people on here think.

My first house, I bought it knowing it needed gutting. The lenders valuation came back £2k lower than the price I agree to pay, I just stuck to my offer because I still thought it was a good deal. I find it hard to believe you did not know the windows needed replacing if they are at the end of their life. I have viewed and renovated a few houses over the years and I have also walked out of a few properties because of the windows - those are properties where the people wanted top price despite work needing doing and I cant be bothered negotiating with people like that as their expectations and mine usually differ. 

£17k for windows seems a lot, but I suppose there and window fitters for all budgets and homes of all sizes. We tend to go with a local company that has been around for decades, they charge a little more than local builders but you get your certificates and a 10 year guarantee. But they are generally cheaper than the national firms. How many quotes did you get? 

You seem to feel quite strongly about this, so if that is the case is it worth losing the property over? 

Crashy_Time

TripleH said:

It might well be that the buyer has planned their forward move based on receiving £600K and are financially quite tight on numbers especially now so are not prepared to reduce further.

It might be that they are oblivious to the windows or of the mentality that they have lived with them so they are fine (same for electricity) or in his eyes why should he pay to replace / upgrade them as he gets no benefit?

House buying eh!

The 600k dream is history, they have already reduced by 70k, the question now is do they accept the need for more price cuts or just sit on the market for months/years?

lisyloo

Crashy_Time said:

TripleH said:

It might well be that the buyer has planned their forward move based on receiving £600K and are financially quite tight on numbers especially now so are not prepared to reduce further.

It might be that they are oblivious to the windows or of the mentality that they have lived with them so they are fine (same for electricity) or in his eyes why should he pay to replace / upgrade them as he gets no benefit?

House buying eh!

The 600k dream is history, they have already reduced by 70k, the question now is do they accept the need for more price cuts or just sit on the market for months/years?

Will be interesting to see what happens.
vendors can sit and often wait for either another buyer or an upturn in prices.
sometimes that may be rational, other times less so, but they can if they want to.
they might be kite flying or not have an imperative to move.
All very frustrating I think.

Crashy_Time

lisyloo said:

Crashy_Time said:

TripleH said:

It might well be that the buyer has planned their forward move based on receiving £600K and are financially quite tight on numbers especially now so are not prepared to reduce further.

It might be that they are oblivious to the windows or of the mentality that they have lived with them so they are fine (same for electricity) or in his eyes why should he pay to replace / upgrade them as he gets no benefit?

House buying eh!

The 600k dream is history, they have already reduced by 70k, the question now is do they accept the need for more price cuts or just sit on the market for months/years?

Will be interesting to see what happens.
vendors can sit and often wait for either another buyer or an upturn in prices.
sometimes that may be rational, other times less so, but they can if they want to.
they might be kite flying or not have an imperative to move.
All very frustrating I think.

Yes, all true, but they seem to have quickly accepted the 70k drop maybe they just need to see compelling evidence of how much the potential buyer might need to pay out to drop further?

ACG

Crashy_Time said:

do they accept the need for more price cuts or just sit on the market for months/years?

Typical Crashy. 

You have made some assumptions there havnt you. 
They "NEED" to take a price cut, the alternative being they wait for months or years. 

Who says it wont go on tomorrow and get snapped up for more than has been offered or at least the same amount? 

Has it been 10 years now you have been banging on about house prices being over valued? Brexit and a worldwide pandemic has not see house prices drop - I genuinely thought I was going to get to see the day you said you were right this year or last, but even with those 2 things happening at around the same time it has not effected things. Maybe this company in China defaulting may have see you right, but you could have cleared around a decades worth of mortgage payments in that time. 

Crashy_Time

ACG said:

Crashy_Time said:

do they accept the need for more price cuts or just sit on the market for months/years?

Typical Crashy. 

You have made some assumptions there havnt you. 
They "NEED" to take a price cut, the alternative being they wait for months or years. 

Who says it wont go on tomorrow and get snapped up for more than has been offered or at least the same amount? 

Has it been 10 years now you have been banging on about house prices being over valued? Brexit and a worldwide pandemic has not see house prices drop - I genuinely thought I was going to get to see the day you said you were right this year or last, but even with those 2 things happening at around the same time it has not effected things. Maybe this company in China defaulting may have see you right, but you could have cleared around a decades worth of mortgage payments in that time. 

Really? So no inflation and no threat of rate rises due to these things? Evergrande will have repercussions it seems, nobody seems to know how bad yet though. The seller has already taken a 70k price cut so even if it sells tomorrow they are still probably not happy?

PadreM

eidand said:

OliviaWw said:

PadreM said:

As others say, you have no expectation whatsoever of a discount - not because it's necessarily unreasonable to expect it but because this isn't about reasonableness.  You've asked - as we all would - and he's refused.  You now either quit as effectively more than you wish to pay (he may then reduce, calling your bluff) or accept as is.  I'd probably not call his bluff if you're prepared to accept, thinking you can say no then yes, as he might have a fallback offer he accepts.  No strategy here, then, just the usual 'how much do you want it?'

Thanks. We know that they can say No, but we thought our request is reasonable so was hoping they can understand. But of course you are right. Our choice is to walk away or to accept. I find it still hard to make up my mind now. 

We did not have trained eyes to notice the windows defects unfortunately during our viewings, contrary to many’s belief, they did not appear obvious to us. The only thing we can rely on is the surveyor’s report. I don’t understand why so many people left hostile comments with regard to that we should know the conditions of the windows by viewing. 

I wouldn't call it aggression, in my case I'm literally fed up.

I had a similar buyer last year, made a fuss about the windows and how they will cost 15k to rectify and wanted 15k off the sale price. Told them to jog on, got someone in to sort a few loose handles, job done, cost £150.

In most cases you don't need to replace a window, a simple , inexpensive fix will do.

You can check that yourself, try to close open all windows and see what you get. Unless they're falling out of the frame, or are completely destroyed, everything else is fixable for not much money.

It's common sense, nothing more.

I'd add that that upvc frames and hardware may be OK but the glass units may have failed (ie, misted - condensation between panes).  It's livable with but not ideal.  How viable replacement of the glazing only is - or 'demisting' glass - I've no idea.

saajan_12

OliviaWw said:

PadreM said:

As others say, you have no expectation whatsoever of a discount - not because it's necessarily unreasonable to expect it but because this isn't about reasonableness.  You've asked - as we all would - and he's refused.  You now either quit as effectively more than you wish to pay (he may then reduce, calling your bluff) or accept as is.  I'd probably not call his bluff if you're prepared to accept, thinking you can say no then yes, as he might have a fallback offer he accepts.  No strategy here, then, just the usual 'how much do you want it?'

Thanks. We know that they can say No, but we thought our request is reasonable so was hoping they can understand. But of course you are right. Our choice is to walk away or to accept. I find it still hard to make up my mind now. 

We did not have trained eyes to notice the windows defects unfortunately during our viewings, contrary to many’s belief, they did not appear obvious to us. The only thing we can rely on is the surveyor’s report. I don’t understand why so many people left hostile comments with regard to that we should know the conditions of the windows by viewing. 

Well that's the thing.. its not necessarily so reasonable in a vendor's eyes to renegotiate when 

* they accepted an offer based on the windows being in that condition. I can't imagine how windows can be so terrible without some visible clue to the average buyer (they don't know if your experience varies from the average). Also "end of serviceable life" doesn't mean much as they don't often need servicing until they actually break. 
* unclear why wiring etc needs redoing, again offer would be assumed to be based on a house upto code at the time - updating to current codes would be your choice + cost. 
* valuation passed so you can afford the purchase
* vendors would have placed their onward offer based on your offer, so now may not be able to afford theirs