Having LCW and still having to hand in fit notes?

NE12

Need advice about if my partner should be declaring new fit notes or not. 

It's quite complicated, but I'll explain the best I can. 

When we both started our UC claim, my partner declared her health conditions and began handing in fit notes.  eventually she had a work capability assessment.

She was declared fit for work, so we then requested a mandatory reconsideration.  UC said on the telephone she could only have it looked at again, if she declared a new health condition.  (I'm sure this was against the rules to be honest)

As she had been diagnosed as having Type 2 diabetes after her WCA they accepted this as a new condition and did a mandatory reconsideration which was denied again. 

This and her other health conditions worsened due to the stress of being declared fit for work my partner continued handing in fit notes, whilst we prepared for a tribunal. 

The tribunal happned via a paper decision, and she lost that.  I sent a letter to the judge asking for written reasons. 

In the mean time, my partner asked UC is she could be sent for another WCA and this was accepted so my partner filled in the form and sent it off. 

Shortly after this, the Tribunal sent a letter saying there was a procedural irregularity so they will have to do it again.  On the 6th September 2021 she was awarded 15 points, and declared her as having limited capability for work for 24months.

It's been weeks since, and UC haven't posted anything in the journal.  she was told to continue handing in fit notes until they say otherwise.  She had a telephone appt yesterday, and we asked why is it taking so long to hear back.  Her work coach looked into her account, and seen she was declared as having LCW on the 6th September, but they didn't bother to notify her in the journal.

After the appt my partner contacted her work coach, and said as I've been declared as having LCW should I be still handing in fit notes, and they've said she has to because she sent the UC50 off before the tribunal reversed their decision, so she's going to have to have a new assessement anyway.   And as she got the new assessment because of her new declared conditions, so has to keep providing fit notes for them conditions. 

Does this seem correct?

I also asked what would happen if she went to this assessment and was declared fit for work.  would that then cancel out the tribunals decision that she has LCW for 24months, but she said that can't be undone.

calcotti

NE12 said:

She was declared fit for work, so we then requested a mandatory reconsideration.  UC said on the telephone she could only have it looked at again, if she declared a new health condition. 

That was incorrect. The whole point of a Mandatory Reconsideration (MR) is that it is a request to look again at an existing decision.

NE12 said:

As she had been diagnosed as having Type 2 diabetes after her WCA they accepted this as a new condition and did a mandatory reconsideration which was denied again.  

If she reported a new health condition that should have resulted in a new WCA rather than reason for an MR.

NE12 said: On the 6th September 2021 she was awarded 15 points, and declared her as having limited capability for work for 24months. 

... she was declared as having LCW on the 6th September, but they didn't bother to notify her in the journal.

After the appt my partner contacted her work coach, and said as I've been declared as having LCW should I be still handing in fit notes, and they've said she has to because she sent the UC50 off before the tribunal reversed their decision, so she's going to have to have a new assessement anyway.   And as she got the new assessment because of her new declared conditions, so has to keep providing fit notes for them conditions.  

The tribunal looked at whether or not the previous decision was correct or not (and concluded it was incorrect). However because she has declared a new health condition, triggering a new WCA, since the original decision that the tribunal looked at that creates a ‘closed period’ and the tribunal decision is only valid until a decision is made on the new WCA. 

As the current WCA is for a different condition to the one(s) that the tribunal decision is based on then it is correct that Fit Notes should be provided.

NE12

calcotti said:

NE12 said:

She was declared fit for work, so we then requested a mandatory reconsideration.  UC said on the telephone she could only have it looked at again, if she declared a new health condition. 

That was incorrect. The whole point of a Mandatory Reconsideration (MR) is that it is a request to look again at an existing decision.

NE12 said:

As she had been diagnosed as having Type 2 diabetes after her WCA they accepted this as a new condition and did a mandatory reconsideration which was denied again.  

If she reported a new health condition that should have resulted in a new WCA rather than reason for an MR.

NE12 said: On the 6th September 2021 she was awarded 15 points, and declared her as having limited capability for work for 24months. 

... she was declared as having LCW on the 6th September, but they didn't bother to notify her in the journal.

After the appt my partner contacted her work coach, and said as I've been declared as having LCW should I be still handing in fit notes, and they've said she has to because she sent the UC50 off before the tribunal reversed their decision, so she's going to have to have a new assessement anyway.   And as she got the new assessment because of her new declared conditions, so has to keep providing fit notes for them conditions.  

The tribunal looked at whether or not the previous decision was correct or not (and concluded it was incorrect). However because she has declared a new health condition, triggering a new WCA, since the original decision that the tribunal looked at that creates a ‘closed period’ and the tribunal decision is only valid until a decision is made on the new WCA. 

As the current WCA is for a different condition to the one(s) that the tribunal decision is based on then it is correct that Fit Notes should be provided.

Yeah I thought it was incorrect as well, and I told the guy on the phone. He insisted that I had to upload medical documents to her Journal. 

This was back in May 2019.  It wasn't until June 2021 that they sent the UC50 for a new WCA.

The way they've handled the entire thing has been an absolute mess. 

She finally got the result she wanted, but it's still not right. 

Also the bit about the tribunal decision only be valid until a decision is made on the new WCA.  I asked her work coach if the assessor was to declare her fit for work, would it void the tribunals decision, and she said that it wouldn't.  That she could only go upto LCWRA and not down to fit for work.  I don't think she's being honest.

Any ideas on how she should proceed?

Alice_Holt

NE12 said:

calcotti said:

NE12 said:

She was declared fit for work, so we then requested a mandatory reconsideration.  UC said on the telephone she could only have it looked at again, if she declared a new health condition. 

That was incorrect. The whole point of a Mandatory Reconsideration (MR) is that it is a request to look again at an existing decision.

NE12 said:

As she had been diagnosed as having Type 2 diabetes after her WCA they accepted this as a new condition and did a mandatory reconsideration which was denied again.  

If she reported a new health condition that should have resulted in a new WCA rather than reason for an MR.

NE12 said: On the 6th September 2021 she was awarded 15 points, and declared her as having limited capability for work for 24months. 

... she was declared as having LCW on the 6th September, but they didn't bother to notify her in the journal.

After the appt my partner contacted her work coach, and said as I've been declared as having LCW should I be still handing in fit notes, and they've said she has to because she sent the UC50 off before the tribunal reversed their decision, so she's going to have to have a new assessement anyway.   And as she got the new assessment because of her new declared conditions, so has to keep providing fit notes for them conditions.  

The tribunal looked at whether or not the previous decision was correct or not (and concluded it was incorrect). However because she has declared a new health condition, triggering a new WCA, since the original decision that the tribunal looked at that creates a ‘closed period’ and the tribunal decision is only valid until a decision is made on the new WCA. 

As the current WCA is for a different condition to the one(s) that the tribunal decision is based on then it is correct that Fit Notes should be provided.

Yeah I thought it was incorrect as well, and I told the guy on the phone. 

Also the bit about the tribunal decision only be valid until a decision is made on the new WCA.  I asked her work coach if the assessor was to declare her fit for work, would it void the tribunals decision, and she said that it wouldn't.  That she could only go upto LCWRA and not down to fit for work.  I don't think she's being honest.

Any ideas on how she should proceed?

        Again she has been given incorrect info by a DWP employee.  

      The position is as calcotti outlined.  The tribunal decision is now time limited, as a new claim has been submitted with a new medical condition.

    I would suggest -
a)  You look carefully at the tribunal decision awarding 15 points, check that these activities / descriptors  were fully covered in your latest UC50 form,

b)  Do a follow up letter to this UC50 form - explain fully why and how the 15 points still apply, enclose a copy of the tribunal decision, explain the circumstances leading to this confusion, enclose evidence detailing the help that your wife needs with the relevant descriptors,  request that the forthcoming assessment is not carried out and that the tribunal decision be accepted for the full 24 months,

c)  Copy all the above to your MP asking them to intervene with the DWP and let the tribunal decision stand.


If this fails, the assessment is carried out and your wife found fit for work - then appeal and attend in person.  You have a far, far, far higher chance of success if you give verbal evidence to the tribunal.   Do not opt for a paper hearing, if you do so then you lose the opportunity to tell the panel about how you are affected by your ill-health.

May be worthwhile seeing if your local advice charity has capacity to help you.