Letter Before Action But Address Was Wrong

Undervalued

If you know the chap's real name you can search on Companies House website to see if he is a director of any limited companies. The limited company (if there is one) may well be registered at a different address to his (such as his accountant's). There is nothing in itself wrong with that.

Gwalker

If it is a limited company, registered with Companies House, then it is a separate legal entity and you can't (normally) claim against him personally.

If it is just Joe Bloggs trading as, for example, Bloggs and Co (or Dodgy Joe of Toytown!) but not Limited, then he and the business are one and the same thing however much he may try to pretend otherwise.

Thanks! I am sure he and his business are one! We paid him 4 months ago and he never gave us an invoice too. He always said "lass" in the office will send it but we never receive any. Neither by email nor post. Most probably he doesn't have any physical office too.

But we have all the evidence; email, whatsapp, FB messanger, traditional text messages, even phone recordings. All on his name.

Gwalker

Jenni_D said:

What paperwork (email is OK) have you received from the "business"? That should be your starting point - if the company is registered then the company number (and registered address) should be on all paperwork.

No. Never seen company number on the paperwork Even the email address is his personal (gmail) address. However the address was on the quotation, but it's only street name and postcode. Incomplete address. We managed to dig in and got the full address on Yell.com, that's where we sent the Letter Before Action. 

Sandtree

Gwalker said:

Jenni_D said:

Does the business have a company number? If yes, have you checked it at Companies House?

https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/search?q=

If the company exists then you can serve an LBC and court papers at the registered address.

Bear in mind though that serving a claim and winning does not mean you get your money back - you'd still need to enforce the claim (methods for which depend on the claim value). So it's very important to understand exactly who you're claiming against. (A claim against a limited company may not be worth the bother, depending on value and the company history. A claim against a sole trader/individual means you have more chance of getting your money back as you can lodge a claim against assets owned by the individual, or even against their bank account).

I have tried to check whether his company is registered, but there are more than 8 thousands company with the similar names. I don't think so I can check the list.

We claim against individual, but all this time the payment sent to his business account, so does this mean we are claiming against the company? He is the owner. Now that I think about this, his company is probably is not registered too. He does have several vehicles with his company name written on them.

Sorry for silly questions!

You need to be careful with terminology here... a sole trader can have a business account and if he is a sole trader you sue him personally (sole trader doesnt mean one man band, they can have employees, subcontractors etc). A company has to have a business account and is a legal entity in its own right, unless there was a director's guarantee in the contract its generally not possible to directly sue the person and action must be taken against the company.

Both companies and sole traders are allowed to use trading names, these can be an abbreviation of their full name or something totally different. For any formal documents, like contracts and invoices, they should identified the true legal entity in addition to having the big brand name at the top of the page.

A fair number of cases are dismissed because the claimant names the wrong defendant... there are several on here including one just from last week where they named the defendant as "Hermes" and the first defence is that "Hermes" doesnt exist and the claimant was in contract with Hermes Parcelnet Limited.

Your original question was a little unclear but seems to have been overtaken by the fact you're not sure who you are in contract with.

macman

You must determine whom your contract is with and whom you made payment to. What is the name of the business account,  and was it 'Joe Bloggs Ltd?  If it was, you resend the LBA to the registered address at Companies House.
You say 'he and his business are one', but they are not. They are separate legal entities, with no shared liability.
If you contracted with and made payment to him as an individual, then it is that individual you must serve papers on instead, once you trace his address.

Undervalued

macman said:

You must determine whom your contract is with and whom you made payment to. What is the name of the business account,  and was it 'Joe Bloggs Ltd?  If it was, you resend the LBA to the registered address at Companies House.
You say 'he and his business are one', but they are not. They are separate legal entities, with no shared liability.
If you contracted with and made payment to him as an individual, then it is that individual you must serve papers on instead, once you trace his address.

Only if it is a limited company. If it is Joe Bloggs Widgets (not Ltd) or Joe Bloggs trading as The Bogner Widget Emporium then Joe Bloggs himself is still liable.

Gwalker

Thanks everyone for making it clear that I am actually in contract with a sole trader! No, it's not a limited company. His business account doesn't end with Ltd. The address that he put on Yell.com turned out is his personal address.

There is error with RM delivery update (tracking still showing the letter's not been delivered!). So I thought the letter has never been delivered because the address was incorrect. But he gave us a ring yesterday and said that the wife received the letter. So he'll come to finish off his job within timeline.

He still didn't say anything when we asked him for the receipt, so might just gonna report him to the tax man.

macman

Undervalued said:

macman said:

You must determine whom your contract is with and whom you made payment to. What is the name of the business account,  and was it 'Joe Bloggs Ltd?  If it was, you resend the LBA to the registered address at Companies House.
You say 'he and his business are one', but they are not. They are separate legal entities, with no shared liability.
If you contracted with and made payment to him as an individual, then it is that individual you must serve papers on instead, once you trace his address.

Only if it is a limited company. If it is Joe Bloggs Widgets (not Ltd) or Joe Bloggs trading as The Bogner Widget Emporium then Joe Bloggs himself is still liable.

Which is why I stated 'was it Joe Bloggs Ltd'?

Sandtree

Gwalker said:

There is error with RM delivery update (tracking still showing the letter's not been delivered!). So I thought the letter has never been delivered because the address was incorrect. But he gave us a ring yesterday and said that the wife received the letter. So he'll come to finish off his job within timeline.

For future reference, dont send something like a LBA by recorded or special delivery.

The law assumes something posted first class is delivered in 2 days time, or 3 days time for 2nd class. It is then up to the defendant to prove that they didnt receive it (something hard to do unless you sent it to the wrong address). If you send it via a method that requires a signature (in non-covid times) then they can refuse to sign and can then point to RM tracking saying not delivered... they dont really have to rationalise why they're choosing not to sign for things.

Post such letters by normal mail at the post office and ask for a certificate of posting/proof of posting (its free) and your then all good.

user1977

Sandtree said:

Gwalker said:

There is error with RM delivery update (tracking still showing the letter's not been delivered!). So I thought the letter has never been delivered because the address was incorrect. But he gave us a ring yesterday and said that the wife received the letter. So he'll come to finish off his job within timeline.

For future reference, dont send something like a LBA by recorded or special delivery.

The law assumes something posted first class is delivered in 2 days time, or 3 days time for 2nd class. It is then up to the defendant to prove that they didnt receive it (something hard to do unless you sent it to the wrong address). If you send it via a method that requires a signature (in non-covid times) then they can refuse to sign and can then point to RM tracking saying not delivered... they dont really have to rationalise why they're choosing not to sign for things.

Post such letters by normal mail at the post office and ask for a certificate of posting/proof of posting (its free) and your then all good.

Or send it in duplicate, one by normal post and one not - if you end up with proof of delivery then even better, but if not then you can still rely on the assumption it would have been delivered (and the recipient can see what it was they didn't sign for...).