PCN despite purchasing an online parking session.

Sp06nh

Hi all

Firstly to provide a the background to the situation of the 12/08/21 i went to Porthpean beach whilst holidaying in Cornwall. Clearly this is during peak holiday season during a time when more people than usual are holidaying within the UK as appose to abroad and Cornwall is an obvious choice for many. Anyway upon arrival to the car park which was already full there were multiple cars all waiting for parking spaces to become available and due to the layout of the carpark many cars had to park on either side of the main through route as to not block the narrow entrance and exit to the car park, which caused in itself caused plenty of confusion as to who had been in the car park the longest and was in affect next in line for the next available parking space. As such due to the free for all nature of the parking and with multiple cars coming onto the car park unaware that other cars had been waiting for a space to become free it became something of a disaster in trying to get a space, and eventually after 45 minutes i was finally able to park the car. After parking up i went to the pay point which advertised the just park app but due to poor 4G/3G service the internet was not usable, so i made a note of the parking location and as soon as i had internet service (54 minutes after entering the car park, but 9 minutes after actually parking the car) made a parking session purchase for 3 hours. then going and spending an hour and half on the beach before returning to the car and leaving the car park at 18:07 (less than 2 1/2 hours after entering the car park and meaning i had paid for an extra half hour than i needed on the ticket).

fast forward I received a NTK from Armtrac Security services on the 23/08/21 for a 'contravention' on the 12/08/21. which given as mentioned above I had paid for a 3 hour parking session and the vehicle only being in the car park for 2.5 hours I immediately appealed assuming this was clearly some sort of admin error on there part. Again fast forward to 17/09/21 and Armtrac to my amazement and anger had rejected the appeal stating that "The session purchased on 12.08.2021 for VRM ******* was valid from 16:37. The vehicle entered the site at 15:43. Therefore, the vehicle had no valid cashless session or valid ticket covering the vehicle for 54 minutes. Signage at the site states 'You must display a valid pay & display ticket within the windscreen or be in possession of a cashless payment session for the entire parking period."

It was at this point that i started to do some reading and came across MSE. unfortunately in my naivety and assumption that my purchased 'parking session' would be enough i have admitted to being the driver during the first appeal. Now i am appealing to IAS and have stated that as per Armtrac's T&Cs the parking period is surely once the vehicle has actually been parked and the driver has left the vehicle unattended. As appose to what Armtrac are suggesting that i should have left the vehicle unattended in the middle of the car park blocking the exit and entry to purchase a parking session despite the car not actually being parked as yet.

Any advice on this would be really helpful. im hugely frustrated that common sense is not being used in this instance and that the 3 hour session purchased is not seen as sufficient to cover 2.5 hours parking and that the purchase of a ticket in itself shows the was no attempt to 'cheat the system' as such.

TIA 

A very angry and frustrated newbie.

Not_A_Hope

IAS are a kangaroo court that only allow 4% of appeals so don't be too surprised if they reject yours. However going through the motions of appealing (if it is the free IAS appeal not the binding £15 one) looks better in front of a judge if you are prepared to fight this scam in court. You should follow the advice in the Newbies thread to try to get the PCN cancelled by the Landowner.

Otherwise in might be a case of waiting for and ignoring debt collection letters before you get a letter of claim which is the step before they have to pay up to take you to the small claims court. 

With the support of the forum you will need to follow the court process and deadlines but if required you will be able to provide a good initial defence and a believable witness statement that may result in the PPC dropping the case or it being rejected by the judge

Redx

Armtrac thrive on issues like these and have done for many years

Do your best with the IAS , but don't expect a win , very few win an IAS appeal

A judge is more likely to agree with you , in court

KeithP

That's two people who have mentioned Porthpean today.

The other being @GrahamHam.

Look at this thread...
Armtrac Security Services BW Legal Scam

Coupon-mad

Don't be like him, don't pay. But be aware that there is no independent appeal as I replied to the other poster:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78623956/#Comment_78623956

You will not get common sense or customer service from a notorious ex-clamper like Armtrac.  Don't go phoning them or anything like that!

However, if you move house within 6 years you must inform Armtrac in writing and keep proof of posting, or email their DPO because you must ensure you see each snd every letter, in case of a court claim to defend and win!

Keep ALL letters in a file marked 'parking scam'.

I get the distinct impression from posts this Summer in particular, that many of the most notorious ex-clampers' (mostly IPC members) conduct is worse than ever this year.

Must be a reaction to a lack of 'penalty' money due to COVID, plus I think they will try it on more, with the new Government regulation coming in, or at least in the build up before it starts in 2022.

D_P_Dance

Have you complained to your MP?  

Sp06nh

@D_P_Dance yes I’ve complained to my MP and the local council in which the car park is situated who have advised they will forward on my complaint to the landowner 

Sp06nh

Shock as advised above IAS have rejected appeal as they find it hard to believe it took 45 mins to find a space.
so plan now is to just sit and wait for letter from DCA and ignore until CCJ letter arrives?

Redx

Yes , debt collector letters will arrive , but they are powerless , so ignore the debt collectors , post 4 in the newbies FAQ sticky thread

No , you definitely do not wait for a CCJ letter to arrive , too late if that happens !! J means Judgment , you definitely do not want that !

You wait for a formal LBC letter , deal with it according to the advice in post 2 of the newbies FAQ sticky thread near the top of the forum in announcements

Then await a court claim pack from the CCBC in Northampton , MCOL ( Google it ) , dealing with it according to the same post 2 in the newbies FAQ sticky thread

Sp06nh

Thankyou to everyone who has helped previously... after almost 18 months of silence i have this week received a letter of claim to which i have sent a SAR to Armtrac and made BW legal aware as directed in the newbies thread.
However i just want to double check that the court claim it mentions next is separate to a letter of claim? so now i just sit and wait until i receive an actual court claim letter and use the information from the SAR and template to write my defence?

Boat_to_Bolivia

The next letter you receive will be the actual Court Claim Letter from CCBC.

You do not need to wait for the SAR in order to write your defence as it is more helpful at the Witness Statement stage further down the line. 

Post back here when you receive the court claim and tell us of the Issue Date.