Fixed Term Tenancy End

nekr0mantik

MaryNB said:

nekr0mantik said:

Slithery said:

nekr0mantik said:

Only issue becomes is I would most likely need to pay rent for the whole month if I only stay for 1 week for example.

Possibly up to 2 months. Your notice needs to align with the end date of your tenancy.

For example if your tenancy runs from the 1st to the 31st of each month but you give notice on the 3rd of January you would need to pay rent until the end of March. You should have already allowed for this when doing the budget for your purchase.

I think its only 1 month when it comes rolling as I read that it depends on when you pay rent and currently I pay rent 2nd week of every month so if it becomes rolling tenancy in December then it would become a monthly rolling tenancy. So I would owe for that whole month. This is very unlikely anyway as my purchase started end of July and its a no chain purchase so dont think it will take until December to complete. If I not exchanged by end of this month I may just back out as there is something wrong if it should been simple purchase as in no complicated scenarios and no chains so should not take 2 months to exchange. If I exchange in time then I can hand in my 30 days notice prior to fixed term ending as there is a break clause. That will be best case as no extra rent. Could get complicated if I need to stay extra week or 2 in case of no movers free or completion delays.

If your purchase drags into next year and you end up with a same day exchange/completion you could end up paying up to two months.
Say your tenancy dates are 10th December 2020 to 9th December 2021. You exchange and complete on the 12th of January 2022, and, as you should, you only hand your notice in the day you exchange. Since your notice will line up with your tenancy dates and has to be a month, if you missed the 10th of Jan, the month doesn't start until the 10th of Feb so the end of the tenancy will be the 9th of March. In that scenario you'll be paying a mortgage and bills on your new property from the 12th of Jan and rent and bills on your rental until the 9th of March - so nearly a 2 month overlap. 

I may back out of purchase if not exchanged by October. Will see.
But yes if I miss the end of the tenancy date then I will need to pay that following month also up to next month.
But as long as exchange happens I will be moving and there should not be weeks of delays to completion as only thing left to do at that point is transfer mortgage funds from lender and get completion statement. So 30 days from exchange to completion is more then normally need so should be fine to give notice on exchange and time exchange date to ensure it lines up.

Neruda

nekr0mantik said:

Hi 

So currently living in a fixed term tenancy which is due to end in December 2021.
Got email as usual from the Estate Agent who manage the property to say to let them know asap if I want to a - leave at the end of the term or b - sign a new fixed term.
Now I know legally this would turn into rolling tenancy and I dont have to renew but I suspect its much easier for agents to evict me? 
My situation is I am currently in process of purchasing a property which if all goes well should be completed anytime between early to end October so plenty of time.
However if for any reason it drags on beyond the fixed term end then would the agents be able to go to courts to evict me for short period while I move to new place?
And are there any circumstances that mean the tenancy wont turn into rolling and will end and I cant stay longer?

Thanks

You would be better off if your tenancy becomes a 'rolling tenancy'. Agents do not like this because the fee for a new contract is a 'nice little earner' for them. However, if you sign a new fixed term contract then you have committed yourself to paying rent until that contract expires!

Anyway, it is the landlord, not the agent, who decides whether or not to extend your tenancy. If your landlord were unhappy with you having a 'rolling tenancy' s/he could apply to the courts for a possession order. Only a court can order you to leave your home, and only court-appointed bailiffs can actually carry out an eviction. Obviously this is an extreme situation, expensive for the landlord and very time-consuming. I suggest that you politely and firmly say that you want to remain with a rolling tenancy after the expiry of your fixed term, and if the landlord has a modicum of common sense then this is what will happen.

Note the comments in the discussion about the notice you need to give. Basically, the 30 days begins from the next rent day after you hand in your notice: if you usually pay on the 14th of the month and hand in notice on 13 October then your last rent payment will be on 14 October, but if you give notice on 15 October than you have to make the payment due for 14 November.

canaldumidi

Neruda said:

nekr0mantik said:

Hi 

So currently living in a fixed term tenancy which is due to end in December 2021.
Got email as usual from the Estate Agent who manage the property to say to let them know asap if I want to a - leave at the end of the term or b - sign a new fixed term.
Now I know legally this would turn into rolling tenancy and I dont have to renew but I suspect its much easier for agents to evict me? 
My situation is I am currently in process of purchasing a property which if all goes well should be completed anytime between early to end October so plenty of time.
However if for any reason it drags on beyond the fixed term end then would the agents be able to go to courts to evict me for short period while I move to new place?
And are there any circumstances that mean the tenancy wont turn into rolling and will end and I cant stay longer?

Thanks

Note the comments in the discussion about the notice you need to give. Basically, the 30 days begins from the next rent day after you hand in your notice: if you usually pay on the 14th of the month and hand in notice on 13 October then your last rent payment will be on 14 October, but if you give notice on 15 October than you have to make the payment due for 14 November.

Unless I missed it, no one has said "30 days". Notice in a periodic tenancy is 'one full tenancy period' as explained fully in the link provided in post 2. That could be 28 days. Or 30. Or as much as 60 days.

It depends which month of the year, when the periods run from/to, and the date notice is served.

Post 4: Ending/renewing an AST: what happens when a fixed term ends? How can a LL or tenant end a tenancy? What is a periodic tenancy?

PRAISETHESUN

Read your current TA closely, as the terms for serving notice should be spelt out there - I've had agreements that allowed for one month's notice (able to be given at any time) and ones that required "one full tenancy period" as discussed above.

And also to reiterate that no-one can "evict" you except for a bailiff under the authority of a court order. Stand your ground and refuse to sign any new fixed-term agreements and you will automatically roll onto a periodic agreement (the terms of which will be detailed in your TA). Once you have exchanged and know your completion date only then should you serve your notice.

nekr0mantik

PRAISETHESUN said:

Read your current TA closely, as the terms for serving notice should be spelt out there - I've had agreements that allowed for one month's notice (able to be given at any time) and ones that required "one full tenancy period" as discussed above.

And also to reiterate that no-one can "evict" you except for a bailiff under the authority of a court order. Stand your ground and refuse to sign any new fixed-term agreements and you will automatically roll onto a periodic agreement (the terms of which will be detailed in your TA). Once you have exchanged and know your completion date only then should you serve your notice.

Yeah had a look at the tenancy and it did not state anything about rolling tenancy after the fixed term.
The agreement has break clause with 1 months notice. Which I suppose the LL can use if I tell him I am staying and want to go rolling. It also states after 18 months which was the fixed term length,  the rent will increase by 4% which I has agreed to as I signed it. 

canaldumidi

nekr0mantik said:

PRAISETHESUN said:

Read your current TA closely, as the terms for serving notice should be spelt out there - I've had agreements that allowed for one month's notice (able to be given at any time) and ones that required "one full tenancy period" as discussed above.

And also to reiterate that no-one can "evict" you except for a bailiff under the authority of a court order. Stand your ground and refuse to sign any new fixed-term agreements and you will automatically roll onto a periodic agreement (the terms of which will be detailed in your TA). Once you have exchanged and know your completion date only then should you serve your notice.

Yeah had a look at the tenancy and it did not state anything about rolling tenancy after the fixed term.
The agreement has break clause with 1 months notice. Which I suppose the LL can use if I tell him I am staying and want to go rolling. It also states after 18 months which was the fixed term length,  the rent will increase by 4% which I has agreed to as I signed it. 

If the tenancy agreement is silent regarding a periodic (rolling) tenancy, and notice therein, then it becomes a @Statutory Periodic Tenancy, and notice is as described earlier and in the linked post.

The Break Clause can only be used during the Fixed Term, not thereafter. You could always not tell the LL you are staying. Simply ignore or prevaricate. He's unlikely to use the Break Clause which in any case still requires a S21 notice (4 months) followed by a court application (1 year?)

nekr0mantik

canaldumidi said:

nekr0mantik said:

PRAISETHESUN said:

Read your current TA closely, as the terms for serving notice should be spelt out there - I've had agreements that allowed for one month's notice (able to be given at any time) and ones that required "one full tenancy period" as discussed above.

And also to reiterate that no-one can "evict" you except for a bailiff under the authority of a court order. Stand your ground and refuse to sign any new fixed-term agreements and you will automatically roll onto a periodic agreement (the terms of which will be detailed in your TA). Once you have exchanged and know your completion date only then should you serve your notice.

Yeah had a look at the tenancy and it did not state anything about rolling tenancy after the fixed term.
The agreement has break clause with 1 months notice. Which I suppose the LL can use if I tell him I am staying and want to go rolling. It also states after 18 months which was the fixed term length,  the rent will increase by 4% which I has agreed to as I signed it. 

If the tenancy agreement is silent regarding a periodic (rolling) tenancy, and notice therein, then it becomes a @Statutory Periodic Tenancy, and notice is as described earlier and in the linked post.

The Break Clause can only be used during the Fixed Term, not thereafter. You could always not tell the LL you are staying. Simply ignore or prevaricate. He's unlikely to use the Break Clause which in any case still requires a S21 notice (4 months) followed by a court application (1 year?)

yeah even though legally I dont need to tell them morally its another issue 
although the LL is actually a guy with company that owns 4 other london apartments he renting so morally does it affect him much

Slithery

nekr0mantik said:

canaldumidi said:

nekr0mantik said:

PRAISETHESUN said:

Read your current TA closely, as the terms for serving notice should be spelt out there - I've had agreements that allowed for one month's notice (able to be given at any time) and ones that required "one full tenancy period" as discussed above.

And also to reiterate that no-one can "evict" you except for a bailiff under the authority of a court order. Stand your ground and refuse to sign any new fixed-term agreements and you will automatically roll onto a periodic agreement (the terms of which will be detailed in your TA). Once you have exchanged and know your completion date only then should you serve your notice.

Yeah had a look at the tenancy and it did not state anything about rolling tenancy after the fixed term.
The agreement has break clause with 1 months notice. Which I suppose the LL can use if I tell him I am staying and want to go rolling. It also states after 18 months which was the fixed term length,  the rent will increase by 4% which I has agreed to as I signed it. 

If the tenancy agreement is silent regarding a periodic (rolling) tenancy, and notice therein, then it becomes a @Statutory Periodic Tenancy, and notice is as described earlier and in the linked post.

The Break Clause can only be used during the Fixed Term, not thereafter. You could always not tell the LL you are staying. Simply ignore or prevaricate. He's unlikely to use the Break Clause which in any case still requires a S21 notice (4 months) followed by a court application (1 year?)

yeah even though legally I dont need to tell them morally its another issue haha
although the LL is actually a guy with company that owns 4 other london apartments he renting so morally does it affect him much haha

I don't see what's funny?

nekr0mantik

Slithery said:

nekr0mantik said:

canaldumidi said:

nekr0mantik said:

PRAISETHESUN said:

Read your current TA closely, as the terms for serving notice should be spelt out there - I've had agreements that allowed for one month's notice (able to be given at any time) and ones that required "one full tenancy period" as discussed above.

And also to reiterate that no-one can "evict" you except for a bailiff under the authority of a court order. Stand your ground and refuse to sign any new fixed-term agreements and you will automatically roll onto a periodic agreement (the terms of which will be detailed in your TA). Once you have exchanged and know your completion date only then should you serve your notice.

Yeah had a look at the tenancy and it did not state anything about rolling tenancy after the fixed term.
The agreement has break clause with 1 months notice. Which I suppose the LL can use if I tell him I am staying and want to go rolling. It also states after 18 months which was the fixed term length,  the rent will increase by 4% which I has agreed to as I signed it. 

If the tenancy agreement is silent regarding a periodic (rolling) tenancy, and notice therein, then it becomes a @Statutory Periodic Tenancy, and notice is as described earlier and in the linked post.

The Break Clause can only be used during the Fixed Term, not thereafter. You could always not tell the LL you are staying. Simply ignore or prevaricate. He's unlikely to use the Break Clause which in any case still requires a S21 notice (4 months) followed by a court application (1 year?)

yeah even though legally I dont need to tell them morally its another issue haha
although the LL is actually a guy with company that owns 4 other london apartments he renting so morally does it affect him much haha

I don't see what's funny?

dont know why I put the "haha"s in.
anyway might be a chance I wont need to do any of this after all and sign new fixed term here. hopefully not, we shall see. 

canaldumidi

I think 'haha' (like 'LOL' etc) is added as a reflex action these days. Usually meaningless. If something genuinely funny is written it shouldn't need to be pointed out!