mmtel dialer

dag_2

I found out about the MMTel dialer by searching Froogle for 18866 - at the moment, NOCHEX Classified's MMTel dialer is the top match. It's a dialer that simply dials 18866 before all your calls.

Since then, I've discovered that MMTel also do a programmable dialer. Has anyone tried it? Is it similar to this Orchid dialer that some of you have been talking about? If so, how do they compare?

I don't really understand the material about the Orchid V4 dialer - but on first impression, it seems that the MMTel dialer is much more customisable than the V4. MMTel can be programmed on digit matches - which means it's possible to set different prefixes for different mobile networks and different international destinations. You can also use it for call barring and speed-dials. You can use software on PC to program it, but apparently you don't have to - the full programming functions are available from a telephone keypad.

By contrast, the V4 only seems to offer one prefix for local numbers, one for national, and one for international. And that's it. And you can't do digit matching or anything else without the software.

But I don't know. Has anyone actually tried them? Thanks.

tweeter

dag,
I've got one but not knowing the history of the firm I put a link in here and some of the contributors come down on me like a ton of bricks because MMtl spammed this site which I deplore. I found it easy to program through the software but havn't tried it through the phone keypad. Its more expensive than Orchid so there is a cost consideration.
They were friendly to talk to. My name will be mud for putting this here!

dag_2

I see. Pleased that I had the foresight not to post a link myself then. I think I'll want to read up a bit more about Orchid first. Thanks.

Edinburghlass_2

Discount for MSE users on the Orchid website is now 20%

bbb_uk

Orchid are doing the initial programming free of charge providing you inform them prior to dispatch of the v4 dialler. Therefore if you planned out what calls you wanted routed through which call provider depending on daytime, evening or weekend (if applicable) then you could ask them (orchid) to programme it for you.

I havent used this 'other' dialler but had a quick glance at its features and they appear to be pretty much the same except for one or two differences. Main one being the 'other' dialler can route upto 12 different call providers whereas the orchid dialler is 9. I'm not aware of anyone who would need to use upto 12 different call providers. I only use about 5 and all our calls are routed via the cheapest for that type of call and depending on the time of day, etc.

I did, however, notice the cost. £20 for the dialler and another £15 for the software and you need to have an analogue (dial-up modem) and not a broadband, etc connection. I'm therefore guessing they don't provide a freephone number for dialling into them and poss use a 0845/0870 number.

I have had no problems programming the v4 dialler and followed Orchid's video for a guide which I found easy to understand than their user guide.

dag_2

and you need to have an analogue (dial-up modem) and not a broadband, etc connection. I'm therefore guessing they don't provide a freephone number for dialling into them and poss use a 0845/0870 number.

That's the bit that confused me.

I was under the impression that the reason you need a dial-up modem is because the dialer itself is programmed by using DTMF codes. This means that you can program it fully just by using an ordinary telephone keypad - but this could be long-winded and laborious, and that the PC software automates that process, simply by using your modem to generate the codes that you would otherwise dial by hand.

Obviously that would only be possible with a modem that generates DTMF codes, ie a fax or 56k modem. It wouldn't be possible with an ADSL or cable modem. But the point is, the dialer would have no reason to connect to an outside phone number while being reprogrammed.

But maybe I'm wrong.

So - what about Orchid? Why does it need a freephone, 0845 or 0870 number? Why does it need to phone home at all? Why can't it run completely independently?

I'm guessing this means you program the Orchid dialer by logging in on their web site, and you then prompt the dialer to phone Orchid to retrieve those settings - and that it would therefore be impossible to reprogram your Orchid dialer if you can't connect to the internet for whatever reason.

Personally I don't like the thought of Orchid or some other third party spying on my phone usage habits, in case they use it for marketing or other purposes at a later date. I do not want to send my dialer configurations over the phone line or internet. I would much rather be able to program my dialer, without anyone knowing how it's configured apart from me. I'm assuming that MMTel dialer doesn't have this problem - but I haven't checked. Thanks for alerting me to the problem.

bbb_uk

dag wrote:

...I was under the impression that the reason you need a dial-up modem is because the dialer itself is programmed by using DTMF codes.

I'm not sure myself as I've never used it but I read that you need to have a dial-up modem and a broadband connection is no good (unless you had both).

dag wrote:

So - what about Orchid? Why does it need a freephone, 0845 or 0870 number? Why does it need to phone home at all? Why can't it run completely independently?

It only needs to 'phone home' when you make changes to your routing requirements and you need to update the dialler with your new routing requirements.

The dialler does not ring home on its own (though there is a setting that will enable it to do this) and has to be manually told to 'ring home'. When it 'rings home' it uses a geographical number (the really older versions used to dial home using a 0845 number) so using Call18866 it would only cost 2p.

The reasons for this is that your routing requirements are held on Orchid's own server and your dialler downloads this info from their server. This has advantages like if the diallers ever forget the information like when unplugged from the telephone socket or you need to change the time programmed into the dialler (due to moving from/to BST / GMT, etc) then you simply have to tell the dialler to ring home.

I can imagine with the 'other' dialler you would need to program the routing info again which means remembering which type of call was routed to which company and at what time of day, and any call barring, etc.

dag_2

I've just looked at Orchid's web site. It says (my italics) ...

By using our FREE management software, the customer has the ability to manage their Dialler or Ranger Dect phone from anywhere that has an internet connection!

That answers my question. I guess anywhere really does mean anywhere - you don't have to be at home to reconfigure your home dialer - you can do it from work, a friend's house or an internet cafe.

But personally, I'd prefer not to. Not just for privacy issues, but for anti-obsolescence reasons too. If the makers of Orchid and CW Client go bankrupt, they will pull the plug on the machines that host their central servers, which would render your dialer useless. They're also vulnerable to Denial-of-Service attacks.

Any dialer which does not require an outside connection to reconfigure it would not have this problem. I'm guessing this is true of the MMTel dialer - but I'm not sure. Will check.

dag_2

I can imagine with the 'other' dialler you would need to program the routing info again which means remembering which type of call was routed to which company and at what time of day, and any call barring, etc.

True - but if you've used the PC software to configure the dialer, and it's saved the settings on your computer's hard disk too, then you'd simply need to run the software again to reconfigure the dialer with the settings you've already stored on your computer. You shouldn't need an internet connection - or even a phone line, for that matter - to be able to do that.

To me, that would be far preferable to the dialer ringing home - but I'll check that it's actually able to do this.

bbb_uk

You are correct they are vulnerable to DoS attacks (as is any company/server on the internet) but their dialler server does not hold any personal information about me (as far as i'm aware) but basically only my routing requirements. MMtel themselves would hold your personal details so they are vulnerable to DoS attacks as well. The only difference being is that MMtel may not hold your routing information so anyone wanting to do a DoS attack wouldn't get your routing preferences.

The thing that would put me off is the £15 for their software for which you may only ever use once especially as you have to pay £20 for the dialler. That to me is a rip-off but thats just my opinion.

Now if you don't have to pay the £15 for their software and use DTMF tones (from a phone or something capable of producing DTMF tones) then that isn't so bad.

Each of the diallers have their own pros and cons and you just have to decide which you prefer, etc.

dag_2

MMtel themselves would hold your personal details so they are vulnerable to DoS attacks as well. The only difference being is that MMtel may not hold your routing information so anyone wanting to do a DoS attack wouldn't get your routing preferences.

It seems like I haven't explained my point properly. I didn't mean to imply that DoS attacks could pose some sort of privacy threat.

My point about DoS attacks is that they're one of the things that could take the Orchid service offline temporarily, preventing you from reconfiguring your dialer. A fire in Orchid's office would also take the service offline. So would a flood. Or a powercut. Or a crash of their computer system. Or a domestic accidentally unplugging it so they can plug in the vacuum cleaner.

But the MMTel dialer does not have these vulnerabilities. I'm about 90%-95% sure that MMTel does not store your routing information, and that an MMTel dialer does not need to connect with MMTel to reconfigure itself.

Also, you mentioned ...

I'm not sure myself as I've never used it but I read that you need to have a dial-up modem and a broadband connection is no good (unless you had both).

On their web site they say ...

You will need an analogue modem on your PC to use the software (not a broadband modem or ISDN modem).

I think the fact that they use the word "broadband" makes it confusing - but - the only thing they say you need is an analog modem. They do not say that you need an internet connection. Most of the people that I know who use broadband used dial-up in the past, and did not disconnect and dispose of their analog modem when they moved on to broadband - so I suspect quite a few people have both. I definitely have both.

Still - it's good to know that such dialers exist. Maybe MMTel isn't the cheapest one. My dad's got an analog PBX system which he uses in much the same way. He has configured with least cost routing, and he's made a computer program which generates modem strings to reconfigure the PBX system too. So he can unplug his PBX and plug it back in again, and set up the least cost routing exactly as it was before with just the click of a mouse. Admittedly, if he wants to change the configuration, he needs to edit the script with a text-editor such as Notepad - he hasn't bothered making a nice GUI - but who cares? It does the job.

So perhaps I'll be able to make do with the dialer itself, and make my own program to reconfigure it. Or maybe there are cheaper dialers - though I dare say the MMTel dialer is a lot cheaper than a fully-functioning PBX system. I'll keep looking for now. Thanks for the info.