Car Accident

jack_tyler

Aretnap said:

jack_tyler said:

Aretnap said:

If his policy is cancelled due to non-disclosure of the modifications then yes, the insurer can potentially attempt to reclaim any costs they have to pay the third party from him. This would depend on him being to blame for the accident of course.

However, trading what you say at face value it is doubtful whether they have grounds to cancel the policy. The Financial Ombudsman had been fairly clear that if the customer has bought the car, innocently not realising that it has been modified, then the insurer cannot use the non-disclosure as grounds to cancel the policy - even if they would not have agreed to insure the car at all  had the modifications been declared.

The caveat is that the above only applies if the modifications would not have been obvious to the average motorist. So if the car had huge spoilers, skirting a millimeter off the grounds and blue LEDs everywhere your son might have a hard time convincing anyone that he thought it had come out of the factory like that. However if it just seemed like the slightlier sportier model that he thought it was then he should be on firm ground if he has to make a compliant. 

The quote where you mention the Financial Ombudsman, please could you tell me where this is? As it may be useful if the worst happens, thanks

For an example of a case where the FOS upheld a consumer's complaint on these grounds see

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/217184/DRN9184237.pdf

If you go here and search for something like "second hand modifications" under insurance you should find several more examples.

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/decisions-case-studies/ombudsman-decisions

Also, the insurance company gave a valuation for the car before any of these alledged modifications were mentioned, its only when my son has asked them to reconsider the offer, that they have now turned round and said there is modifications on the car. So surely all this should of been looked at prior to making the offer

Car_54

jack_tyler said:

Aretnap said:

jack_tyler said:

Aretnap said:

If his policy is cancelled due to non-disclosure of the modifications then yes, the insurer can potentially attempt to reclaim any costs they have to pay the third party from him. This would depend on him being to blame for the accident of course.

However, trading what you say at face value it is doubtful whether they have grounds to cancel the policy. The Financial Ombudsman had been fairly clear that if the customer has bought the car, innocently not realising that it has been modified, then the insurer cannot use the non-disclosure as grounds to cancel the policy - even if they would not have agreed to insure the car at all  had the modifications been declared.

The caveat is that the above only applies if the modifications would not have been obvious to the average motorist. So if the car had huge spoilers, skirting a millimeter off the grounds and blue LEDs everywhere your son might have a hard time convincing anyone that he thought it had come out of the factory like that. However if it just seemed like the slightlier sportier model that he thought it was then he should be on firm ground if he has to make a compliant. 

The quote where you mention the Financial Ombudsman, please could you tell me where this is? As it may be useful if the worst happens, thanks

For an example of a case where the FOS upheld a consumer's complaint on these grounds see

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/217184/DRN9184237.pdf

If you go here and search for something like "second hand modifications" under insurance you should find several more examples.

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/decisions-case-studies/ombudsman-decisions

Also, the insurance company gave a valuation for the car before any of these alledged modifications were mentioned, its only when my son has asked them to reconsider the offer, that they have now turned round and said there is modifications on the car. So surely all this should of been looked at prior to making the offer

The original offer was likely made on the basis of the book value of the car, with an engineer only being sent after your son sent photos showing a non-standard exhaust.
BTW it’s very unlikely that those receipts for work would improve the offer. Routine servicing, repairs and replacements simply maintain the car in the condition on which the guide prices are based.

[Deleted User]

delete 123

Retrogamer

jack_tyler said:

Hello.

Approx 3 wks ago my son was involved in a car accident, at the moment liability is still being estabilished but unfortunately my sons car is a total loss. As such he was offered a valuation amount for his car, minus his excess, but the amount is much too low.  So he has asked them to reconsider and sent in all the paperwork like full service history etc, receipts for work done on the car, receipts showing genuine parts used etc etc along with photos of the car prior to the accident and adverts showing what it would cost to replace his car like for like. Today his insurance contacted him regarding the valuation, and have said that it has gone to the underwriters to make a decision as the car has modifications on that they were not aware of. My son had no idea what these modifications were, as he only got the car in February and was told when he bought it, that it was standard. The car is a Skoda Fabia VRS, he knows that they are more sporty than a normal Fabia, but he has no idea what these so called modifications are. His insurance have said that someone will be in touch with him to discuss things very soon.

However my son is now really worried about what is going to happen. He has tried to contact the previous owner of the car to ask them what they had done to the car, but he cant get hold of them.  Ive tried to reassure him and told him not to worry as there is nothing really he can do, but at the same time ive told him to prepare for the worst case scenario, which would be they cancel his insurance because of these modifications. If this happens, I know that my son will not got anything from his insurers for his car, but what about the third party? Will he be liable for their costs, if liability goes against him?  Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you

Is it a 1.9 Diesel Fabia VRS?

If so if you are able to share any pictures of the cars engine / exterior etc i will be able to spot any modifications and state them for you (blur the registration)

jack_tyler

Car_54 said:

jack_tyler said:

Aretnap said:

jack_tyler said:

Aretnap said:

If his policy is cancelled due to non-disclosure of the modifications then yes, the insurer can potentially attempt to reclaim any costs they have to pay the third party from him. This would depend on him being to blame for the accident of course.

However, trading what you say at face value it is doubtful whether they have grounds to cancel the policy. The Financial Ombudsman had been fairly clear that if the customer has bought the car, innocently not realising that it has been modified, then the insurer cannot use the non-disclosure as grounds to cancel the policy - even if they would not have agreed to insure the car at all  had the modifications been declared.

The caveat is that the above only applies if the modifications would not have been obvious to the average motorist. So if the car had huge spoilers, skirting a millimeter off the grounds and blue LEDs everywhere your son might have a hard time convincing anyone that he thought it had come out of the factory like that. However if it just seemed like the slightlier sportier model that he thought it was then he should be on firm ground if he has to make a compliant. 

The quote where you mention the Financial Ombudsman, please could you tell me where this is? As it may be useful if the worst happens, thanks

For an example of a case where the FOS upheld a consumer's complaint on these grounds see

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/217184/DRN9184237.pdf

If you go here and search for something like "second hand modifications" under insurance you should find several more examples.

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/decisions-case-studies/ombudsman-decisions

Also, the insurance company gave a valuation for the car before any of these alledged modifications were mentioned, its only when my son has asked them to reconsider the offer, that they have now turned round and said there is modifications on the car. So surely all this should of been looked at prior to making the offer

The original offer was likely made on the basis of the book value of the car, with an engineer only being sent after your son sent photos showing a non-standard exhaust.
BTW it’s very unlikely that those receipts for work would improve the offer. Routine servicing, repairs and replacements simply maintain the car in the condition on which the guide prices are based.

My son never sent photos showing a non standard exhaust, simply because he didn't know it was. The photos he sent of the car where to show the condition of the bodywork, as he had had a 4 stage polish on it and ceramic coated, so it was immaculate. Also sent in adverts of cars like his, same age & mileage and they were selling for 2k more than what the insurance company offered.

Car_54

jack_tyler said:

Car_54 said:

jack_tyler said:

Aretnap said:

jack_tyler said:

Aretnap said:

If his policy is cancelled due to non-disclosure of the modifications then yes, the insurer can potentially attempt to reclaim any costs they have to pay the third party from him. This would depend on him being to blame for the accident of course.

However, trading what you say at face value it is doubtful whether they have grounds to cancel the policy. The Financial Ombudsman had been fairly clear that if the customer has bought the car, innocently not realising that it has been modified, then the insurer cannot use the non-disclosure as grounds to cancel the policy - even if they would not have agreed to insure the car at all  had the modifications been declared.

The caveat is that the above only applies if the modifications would not have been obvious to the average motorist. So if the car had huge spoilers, skirting a millimeter off the grounds and blue LEDs everywhere your son might have a hard time convincing anyone that he thought it had come out of the factory like that. However if it just seemed like the slightlier sportier model that he thought it was then he should be on firm ground if he has to make a compliant. 

The quote where you mention the Financial Ombudsman, please could you tell me where this is? As it may be useful if the worst happens, thanks

For an example of a case where the FOS upheld a consumer's complaint on these grounds see

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/files/217184/DRN9184237.pdf

If you go here and search for something like "second hand modifications" under insurance you should find several more examples.

https://www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk/decisions-case-studies/ombudsman-decisions

Also, the insurance company gave a valuation for the car before any of these alledged modifications were mentioned, its only when my son has asked them to reconsider the offer, that they have now turned round and said there is modifications on the car. So surely all this should of been looked at prior to making the offer

The original offer was likely made on the basis of the book value of the car, with an engineer only being sent after your son sent photos showing a non-standard exhaust.
BTW it’s very unlikely that those receipts for work would improve the offer. Routine servicing, repairs and replacements simply maintain the car in the condition on which the guide prices are based.

Also sent in adverts of cars like his, same age & mileage and they were selling for 2k more than what the insurance company offered.

No, they were being advertised for 2k more. That's not the same as selling - no-one pays the advertised price.

jack_tyler

Retrogamer said:

jack_tyler said:

Hello.

Approx 3 wks ago my son was involved in a car accident, at the moment liability is still being estabilished but unfortunately my sons car is a total loss. As such he was offered a valuation amount for his car, minus his excess, but the amount is much too low.  So he has asked them to reconsider and sent in all the paperwork like full service history etc, receipts for work done on the car, receipts showing genuine parts used etc etc along with photos of the car prior to the accident and adverts showing what it would cost to replace his car like for like. Today his insurance contacted him regarding the valuation, and have said that it has gone to the underwriters to make a decision as the car has modifications on that they were not aware of. My son had no idea what these modifications were, as he only got the car in February and was told when he bought it, that it was standard. The car is a Skoda Fabia VRS, he knows that they are more sporty than a normal Fabia, but he has no idea what these so called modifications are. His insurance have said that someone will be in touch with him to discuss things very soon.

However my son is now really worried about what is going to happen. He has tried to contact the previous owner of the car to ask them what they had done to the car, but he cant get hold of them.  Ive tried to reassure him and told him not to worry as there is nothing really he can do, but at the same time ive told him to prepare for the worst case scenario, which would be they cancel his insurance because of these modifications. If this happens, I know that my son will not got anything from his insurers for his car, but what about the third party? Will he be liable for their costs, if liability goes against him?  Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you

Is it a 1.9 Diesel Fabia VRS?

If so if you are able to share any pictures of the cars engine / exterior etc i will be able to spot any modifications and state them for you (blur the registration)

It is a Fabia VRS as the vin number etc confirms this.

Reginald74

There's no induction kit on the engine in that photo.

macman

If the modifications were reported to the vendor's insurers (which of course they may or may not have been), then cannot the current insurer's access this info from the previous insurers?
Do not all insurers share this sort of info across a common database?

Evie44

Insurers need to know if ceramic coated as its classed as a modification, as is having windows tinted if its not factory standard.