esa and mandatory reconsideration,points and other questions

randm

could do with some help please.i have been on esa in the support group for many years, previously on incapacity benefit. this is due to mental health issues. i filled out the questionnaire last year , had a phone consultation , and then another phone consultation last month which went over the questionnaire again as it had been altered for covid .

subsequently i have been moved to the work support group. we asked for a written reply as to why , as i had been given 15 points, and the decider guy rang.

firstly he said that as i had been given 15 points in the one section but from two questions it meant i had to go into the work support group, and that the only way for this not to have happened was for me to get the 15 points on one question.

could someone clarify if this is true? Because on the how we made our decision letter it states if you get less than 15 points and do not have any other qualifying condition this shows you are capable of doing some kind of work. your total points are 15.

secondly i then went online to see what i was to do and followed one of the links to the benefits and work site, i filled out their version of the esa forms and received 30 points because they had worded the questions more appropriately.i thought this was the new esa form but then went on to the dwp site and its the one where i got 15 points. should i put some of the questions and answers from the benefit and work site on the mandatory consideration form?

also the dr who did the 2nd consultation said some things that were lies, and missed out things , can all this be put on the m.c. form.?

thank you.

poppy12345

The group you've been placed into is the WRAG (work related activity group) not work support group. To be placed into the Support Group at least one of the descriptors must apply the majority of the time. See link. https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/employment-and-support-allowance/esa-glossary/1353-support-group-descriptors

If none of those apply to you then reg35 (substantial risk)  may apply. See link. https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/news/2955-regulation-35-2-b-is-now-the-main-route-into-esa-support-group

Regarding the "lies" you mentioned. It's recommended that you don't mention any of those because this isn't going to get you placed into the Support Group. You're much better off putting as much detail as possible about the reasons why you think you should be in that group and add a couple of recent real world examples where possible.

Alice_Holt

This is a helpful guide to the appeal process:

https://www.advicenow.org.uk/guides/how-win-appeal-about-your-work-capability-assessment

Here are the support group descriptors:

https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/employment-and-support-allowance/esa-glossary/1353-support-group-descriptors

You need to be placed into one of these descriptors (or that there is a significant risk to your health resulting from attendance at  WRAG activities), to be placed in the Support Group.
https://wcainfo.net/issues/substantial-risk-lcwra

You may wish to see if your local advice charity can help with an appeal:

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/employment-and-support-allowance/problems-with-esa/challenging-an-esa-decision/

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/about-us/contact-us/contact-us/contact-us/

Spoonie_Turtle

Do you know what the reason was for being in the Support Group previously, which descriptor(s) you met or whether there was significant risk?  If so, and if things are still the same, that would be a very good guide for tailoring your approach to the relevant descriptors.

randm

thank you all for your help. the cab has been amazing , looking at the questions on the form and then giving you the situations that you thought didn't apply to the questions. some of them are black or white. i think i used the same answers as my previous forms but it seems the dr on the phone chat has decided , but having read what she wrote i can clearly see that there are  questions she didn't ask which would have been paramount to the decision.

poppy12345

randm said:

thank you all for your help. the cab has been amazing , looking at the questions on the form and then giving you the situations that you thought didn't apply to the questions. some of them are black or white. i think i used the same answers as my previous forms but it seems the dr on the phone chat has decided , but having read what she wrote i can clearly see that there are  questions she didn't ask which would have been paramount to the decision.

The HCP's that do the assessments aren't Dr's. They also don't make the decisions. The assessment is just another process you go through so that they can gather more evidence to write the report. They don't write the report word for word with what you said during the assessment either because the report is just their opinion.

When you filled out the form this would have been the time to write as much information as possible about how your conditions affect you. There's never going to be enough of time during the assessment to ask you about everything.

randm

poppy12345 said:

randm said:

thank you all for your help. the cab has been amazing , looking at the questions on the form and then giving you the situations that you thought didn't apply to the questions. some of them are black or white. i think i used the same answers as my previous forms but it seems the dr on the phone chat has decided , but having read what she wrote i can clearly see that there are  questions she didn't ask which would have been paramount to the decision.

The HCP's that do the assessments aren't Dr's. They also don't make the decisions. The assessment is just another process you go through so that they can gather more evidence to write the report. They don't write the report word for word with what you said during the assessment either because the report is just their opinion.

When you filled out the form this would have been the time to write as much information as possible about how your conditions affect you. There's never going to be enough of time during the assessment to ask you about everything.

you know poppy, i have just looked at my copy of all the additional information i gave and it is obvious that this has not been read properly. we asked for a written report as to why the decision was made, the decsion maker rang  and said that a phone call would be much better, except the only reason he could give as to why i had been moved was that i had not scored a 15 under the two tasks that applied to me. it seems that if you are able to say thank you to a shop assistant that is classed as being able to socially interact and therefore go into a work place and interact with people everday.

poppy12345

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Do you know what the reason was for being in the Support Group previously, which descriptor(s) you met or whether there was significant risk?

This is great advice here ^^ have you looked into those reasons?

randm

poppy12345 said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Do you know what the reason was for being in the Support Group previously, which descriptor(s) you met or whether there was significant risk?

This is great advice here ^^ have you looked into those reasons?

i have looked at them, thank you, i had been wondering which ones applied.i will go look out my paperwork and see if they gave a reason before as to which descriptors i met.as for this time, there is no reason as to why, just the bit about my total points being 15.

Spoonie_Turtle

randm said:

poppy12345 said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

Do you know what the reason was for being in the Support Group previously, which descriptor(s) you met or whether there was significant risk?

This is great advice here ^^ have you looked into those reasons?

i have looked at them, thank you, i had been wondering which ones applied.i will go look out my paperwork and see if they gave a reason before as to which descriptors i met.as for this time, there is no reason as to why, just the bit about my total points being 15.

When I said 'reason' I meant the descriptor(s) you met before which would be the reason - or basis - for being in the Support Group