Civil Service Pensions - Deferred AND Current Member

marky_b_2

I have two periods of civil service employment 1991-2001 when my job got privatised, I then rejoined 2003 - present.

I have a preserved Classic pension for my first employment, when I rejoined I went into Premium and now Alpha.

I enquired about Partial retirement and different scenarios regarding when to access my three pensions.


One of my questions was going Partial and only taken my Classic pension. The reply was that they would use my salary at 2001  plus adjustments to inflation up until present day. 

I take it your current salary is more than your previous employment salary, so if they used your previous employment figure then I’d imagine if they abate it then you wouldn’t receive anything.

Thank you for your recent enquiry. 

Once in payment, your preserved classic pension will increase each April by inflation. If you choose to defer claiming this pension until after your normal retirement age (60), it would still attract the same annual inflation increases, which continue past this age. However, it is important to note that the lump sum only attracts increases up to age 60. 

If you defer claiming your preserved classic pension, it will be paid in arrears and backdated to your 60th birthday. The arrears payment will be calculated as if the pension had been claimed at 60, reflecting the correct inflation rates applicable.

If you access your current pension through partial retirement, your combined salary and pension should ideally not be more than what you were earning before you partially retired (your 'salary of reference'). This is because, if your new part-time salary plus your pension exceed your pre-partial retirement salary, we deduct the excess from your pension. This is known as abatement. You can find more detail on this here:

https://www.civilservicepensionscheme.org.uk/planning-for-retirement/what-are-my-options/partial-retirement/abatement/

If you wish to, you may claim your preserved classic pension while you continue to work, by completing and returning the ‘Change of details and retirement application form – deferred members’ form from the Civil Service Pension website: 

http://www.civilservicepensionscheme.org.uk/members/member-forms/

To assess abatement, the salary of reference used for the preserved pension would usually be the salary that you received on the last day of your original service for your preserved pension. This figure is adjusted to take inflation into account. 

If you decide to partially retire, this will provide access only to your current pension benefits. You can keep your classic pension preserved, and access it at a later time, as describe above. 

Suzycoll

jonnyfive111 said:

Hi, 

I wonder if anyone au fait with civil service pensions may be able to help me. Ive scoured the civil service pension webpages but cant seem to find any guidance on my particular situation.

I'm in a perhaps unusual position of having two civil service pensions. 

1) A deferred Classic pension from first period of service between 2001 and 2012.
2) A current Alpha pension from a second and current period of service from Dec 2018 to present.

My query is regarding whether I can take my deferred pension (lump sum and annual allowance) at 60 which is the standard retirement age for Classic pension, whilst I am still a current employee of the civil service and paying into my current Alpha pension which will pay out at 66/7. They are two distinct periods of employment (I got made redundant first time round). The only advice I can see if for those will Classic pensions that were then transferred into Alpha pensions. My classic is deferred so Im in a different position. Someone had previously advised me that it all depends on a potential qualifying or disqualifying period in-between pensions but I cant seem to find any information about it. They also mentioned it might depend on what pension I was paying into the years inbetween which can have an effect. I paid into a LGPS pension (police) for 6 years inbetween but I cant see how that would have any relevance as its entirely seperate?

My situation is that I ideally I want to carry on working past 60 in my current role, at least part time, but perhaps full time, paying into my Alpha and claiming my Classic. But I cant seem to find out if thats an option. If I deferred collection of my Classic pension as an alternative so that I waited to claim them all together at 66/7, I can't see at what rate my Classic pension would increase each year from having deferred it from 60 to 66/7?

Sorry for so many questions, but if anyone is able to offer a view, Id be very grateful. Thanks!

HI Johny

Unless I'm confused  - what is the reason why you cannot claim your classic pension and carry on  working ? 

as a current civil servant you will have to reduce your working hours in your current civil service job.
you can carry on paying into Alpha 

Just my personal opinion but I would claim the Classic pension now (with a lump sum if you choose) & have a good work/life balance working part time + your monthly classic pension in payment 

sorry if i misunderstood 

Dazed_and_C0nfused

Suzycoll said:

jonnyfive111 said:

Hi, 

I wonder if anyone au fait with civil service pensions may be able to help me. Ive scoured the civil service pension webpages but cant seem to find any guidance on my particular situation.

I'm in a perhaps unusual position of having two civil service pensions. 

1) A deferred Classic pension from first period of service between 2001 and 2012.
2) A current Alpha pension from a second and current period of service from Dec 2018 to present.

My query is regarding whether I can take my deferred pension (lump sum and annual allowance) at 60 which is the standard retirement age for Classic pension, whilst I am still a current employee of the civil service and paying into my current Alpha pension which will pay out at 66/7. They are two distinct periods of employment (I got made redundant first time round). The only advice I can see if for those will Classic pensions that were then transferred into Alpha pensions. My classic is deferred so Im in a different position. Someone had previously advised me that it all depends on a potential qualifying or disqualifying period in-between pensions but I cant seem to find any information about it. They also mentioned it might depend on what pension I was paying into the years inbetween which can have an effect. I paid into a LGPS pension (police) for 6 years inbetween but I cant see how that would have any relevance as its entirely seperate?

My situation is that I ideally I want to carry on working past 60 in my current role, at least part time, but perhaps full time, paying into my Alpha and claiming my Classic. But I cant seem to find out if thats an option. If I deferred collection of my Classic pension as an alternative so that I waited to claim them all together at 66/7, I can't see at what rate my Classic pension would increase each year from having deferred it from 60 to 66/7?

Sorry for so many questions, but if anyone is able to offer a view, Id be very grateful. Thanks!

HI Johny

Unless I'm confused  - what is the reason why you cannot claim your classic pension and carry on  working ? 

as a current civil servant you will have to reduce your working hours in your current civil service job.
you can carry on paying into Alpha 

Just my personal opinion but I would claim the Classic pension now (with a lump sum if you choose) & have a good work/life balance working part time + your monthly classic pension in payment 

sorry if i misunderstood 

I think that's the crux of the issue.

Ideally they want to take the Classic pension and carry on with their existing working pattern and not go part time or suffer abatement.

jag403

Hi RGMO/njtt,

I have not re-viewed this thread since your comments earlier this year. I did pick up this thread last year and reviewed the comments and excellent advice and direction of hugheskevi.

I am in a similar position to you both. I started in the civil service in 1987 and in 2015 was forced off my classic pension after 28 years under the options exercise due to my age. I was in Alpha for three months and since Jan 2016 been in the partnership pension. I am 60 next June so RGMO is ahead of me.

To njtt, I asked the same question as you ‘can I claim my full classic pension from age 60 and continue to work full time without my classic pension being abated’. After 3 months of e-mail exchanges, I finally got a satisfactory response on 5 December 2023 from MyCSP in writing. The relevant part of the response stated the following:

However, unlike the other PCSPS sections and alpha, the classic rules do not say that a pension can only be paid to an individual if they have left employment or taken partial retirement.

The classic rules therefore effectively allow someone who opts out before normal pension age and remains opted out until their normal pension age, and remains in employment, to take their preserved pension. The classic rules do not provide for abatement to apply for abatement to apply in those circumstances.

You opted out of the scheme prior to the normal pension age of the classic pension, age 60. You had a dual classic and alpha service at the time, with a normal pension age of 60 in classic and a later age in alpha. A dual entitlement member who is active in Alpha and has banked classic service cannot opt out of classic only whilst continuing as an active member of alpha.

If a member were to opt out of both Alpha/Classic before their 60th birthday(which you did), and continue to be opted out on their 60th birthday, they could claim preserved classic benefits from age 60 and would not be abated.

Please note that this is only specific to members who remain opted out of both alpha and classic until their 60th birthday.

To RGMO, you may wish to notify MyCSP in relation to your outstanding complaint they have already advised a deferred member by e-mail on 5 December 2023 the classic pension is payable in full without abatement from the age of 60 and you can continue to work full time.

I hope this makes some sense and wish to support you, especially RGMO. I have not heard of anyone else receiving their full classic pension unabated and continue to work full time after the age of 60. I would be grateful if you could update us on the progress of your complaint.

RGMO

I haven't checked in on this thread for a while so apologies to anyone keeping an eye on things.  Jag403 - that's really useful.  Unfortunately I have heard nothing more.  I made a complaint under the first stage of the internal dispute resolution (IDR) process which gave CSP 4 months to respond.  They responded on the last day to advise that they still hadn't received legal advice and fobbed me off for another month 'til the middle of June.  They have advised that my claim for my preserved classic pension isn't in line with the policy intent behind the legislation.  They have also noted that my claim hasn't been denied - it has been "paused". I have contacted the pension ombudsman, but they will only take it on once I have concluded the IDR 2-stage process. 

It is all very frustrating.

CorseyEdge

RGMO said:

It is all very frustrating.

I can imagine it is frustrating and stressful, especially when the rules are clear - rooting for you RGMO!
Are you a member of, and/or do you have access to a Union representative, such as PCS? They may very well be interested and may offer support, legal or otherwise.

RGMO

CorseyEdge said:

RGMO said:

It is all very frustrating.

I can imagine it is frustrating and stressful, especially when the rules are clear - rooting for you RGMO!
Are you a member of, and/or do you have access to a Union representative, such as PCS? They may very well be interested and may offer support, legal or otherwise.

Thanks CorseyEdge - I'm not currently a member of any TU, and I'm not sure how long I would have to await after re joining, before I could avail of their services in such a matter - I know most have a "probation" period.  But as you note, the rules are very clear and unambiguous and so I'm hopeful that good sense will prevail before I would need to seek any more formal action.  I'll await, hopefully, the response to my IDR which is due on 19 June before I take any further action, though am preparing myself for CSP advising they need another month to consider!!

ALogical1

It all seems rather crooked:
Logically you have accrued you Classic pension, and assuming having left the acursed CS, should be able to claim it at any time: Before 60 with ER penalties, At scheme NRA (60) in full, if deffered / after SNRA at what ever increases the gov't applied (in arrears) at each April, If you kept the pension autonomous (noting any McCloud restitutions from the governments illegal action re forced scheme changes, which will be costing taxpayers £nnnM ) ; If you subsequently rejoined the CS (!) and started pension afresh, e.g. in Alpha, surely that should carry on, as long as you did not merge the previous Classic/McClouf faux pas, into Alpha, which is only career average, no in built tax free lump sum and a State retirement age (but still a DB scheme as opposed to the employers liability free 'cash scheme).

IME MyCSP are appalling to deal with, woeful responsiveness and impossible to speak with anyone responsible or empowered to actually do anything even after 'escallation' franky after my and wifes experiences over the last yeatr+ simply not fit for purpose,  and none of their board/executives deserve any justifiable pay increases/bonus's, they are another disgrace of government. I can say government as I have other pensions administerd by Equinity and they are reasonable, apologise for their failings and make prompt amends with dialogue, so its just MyCSP/Cab Orifice / government 'managemnt' for customer (dis)service. Hard to belive Capita were thrown out of MyCSP in 2014 and yet as of 2023 have had the contract returned to them, bodes well?

hyubh

ALogical1 said:

It all seems rather crooked:
Logically you have accrued you Classic pension, and assuming having left the acursed CS, should be able to claim it at any time: Before 60 with ER penalties, At scheme NRA (60) in full, if deffered / after SNRA at what ever increases the gov't applied (in arrears) at each April, If you kept the pension autonomous (noting any McCloud restitutions from the governments illegal action re forced scheme changes, which will be costing taxpayers £nnnM ) ; If you subsequently rejoined the CS (!) and started pension afresh, e.g. in Alpha, surely that should carry on, as long as you did not merge the previous Classic/McClouf faux pas, into Alpha, which is only career average, no in built tax free lump sum and a State retirement age (but still a DB scheme as opposed to the employers liability free 'cash scheme).

IME MyCSP are appalling to deal with, woeful responsiveness and impossible to speak with anyone responsible or empowered to actually do anything even after 'escallation' franky after my and wifes experiences over the last yeatr+ simply not fit for purpose,  and none of their board/executives deserve any justifiable pay increases/bonus's, they are another disgrace of government. I can say government as I have other pensions administerd by Equinity and they are reasonable, apologise for their failings and make prompt amends with dialogue, so its just MyCSP/Cab Orifice / government 'managemnt' for customer (dis)service. Hard to belive Capita were thrown out of MyCSP in 2014 and yet as of 2023 have had the contract returned to them, bodes well?

Pensions aristocrat gives the pension serfs who till his land a right dressing down