Advice on neighbours trees (again!)

M00nface

Loza2016 said:

You may have a struggle finding a tree surgeon that wants the Job as they aren’t your trees. Without the owner’s permission some won’t want the hassle. 

I hope the neighbour sees sense and sorts them out for you. 

Believe it or not we actually get load of leaflets through or door for trer surgeons saying they'll cut up to boundaries of neighbouring trees. I think they can see them from the back and think we're an idea customer haha

M00nface

Greymug said:

deannagone said:

Not as easy as it sounds, falling branches would need to be controlled or they will damage things/people.  Not really a DIY project.

Aye those trees are massive and definitely wouldn't do it myself. Let someone else take that risk...

Definitely. Neighbour is also renting house out to a family eith children and last thing I'd want is for an injury. Would probably make him aware of this next time I contact

Section62

M00nface said:

Greymug said:

deannagone said:

Not as easy as it sounds, falling branches would need to be controlled or they will damage things/people.  Not really a DIY project.

Aye those trees are massive and definitely wouldn't do it myself. Let someone else take that risk...

Definitely. Neighbour is also renting house out to a family eith children and last thing I'd want is for an injury. Would probably make him aware of this next time I contact

In case it wasn't clear, I wasn't suggesting you try and fell the trees, or attack larger branches. I'd never suggest that to someone without experience.

My suggestion was about "smaller overhanging branches" i.e. the ones with lower damage-causing potential and which would fall in your garden (not the public space or the neighbour's gardens).  And also as stated, after "learning about safe methods of working" along with "knowing the legal rules inside out".

I wouldn't suggest that anyone takes a risk working with trees.

However, if you get someone in to do the work you would need to be willing to absorb the full cost yourself, or else approach it in a way which is 'legal' and leaves you in a position where you could claim the costs off the neighbour (/and council) if they refuse to contribute.

If you pay a tree surgeon (possibly a 4-figure sum) to trim a few small overhanging branches off a tree, and if you then try to (legally) claim the cost back from the neighbour, the court will take into account whether or not the costs incurred were reasonable in the circumstances.  There is an expectation that people will minimise the cost, and in some cases that would include adopting a DIY solution.

The neighbour's trees are large, but not 'massive' in tree terms. From your pictures it appears most of the overhang is small twig-like growth.  The cost therefore of cutting that back shouldn't be excessive, even if hiring a tree surgeon to do it makes it a 4-figure sum.

The council owned tree is a different story. Some of the branches on that are larger, but the situation could be improved significantly by pruning off some of the smaller branches.  Employing a tree surgeon to cut that tree back and presenting the council with the bill will almost certainly be met with a flat refusal. Taking legal action against them to recover the cost will likely be fought tooth and nail.

If you are happy to bear the full costs yourself then definitely look at getting in a professional to deal with all the overhanging branches (obviously still complying with the legal requirements).  But I would steer clear of those advertising using leaflets pushed through the door... good traders rarely need to advertise in that way, and if you want the trees dealt with in a safer manner than you can DIY it yourself, then you need a very good trader.

Otherwise you have to continue negotiating with both of the tree owners to get them to take responsibility for their trees, and do so up to the point where a court would find it reasonable for you to go ahead and take matters into your own hands by arranging to employ someone to do it.

Also, carefully think through the suggestion of contacting your home insurance legal protection if you are considering that option.  Will they make a record of you contacting them to discuss concerns about 'massive' trees in the neighbour's garden which might be damaging your property, and possibly causing subsidence?  Will that information be passed to the underwriters?  Will that affect your premiums or ability to get insurance when you renew?  There are some tricky questions there, and you should of course bear in mind the responsibility to honestly declare relevant facts when taking out or renewing insurance policies.  In other words there could be unintended consequences of making this problem bigger than it is.

But, to be clear, I'm not suggesting that anyone tries DIY tree work if they are not confident they know how to do the job safely and legally.

M00nface

Section62 said:

M00nface said:

Greymug said:

deannagone said:

Not as easy as it sounds, falling branches would need to be controlled or they will damage things/people.  Not really a DIY project.

Aye those trees are massive and definitely wouldn't do it myself. Let someone else take that risk...

Definitely. Neighbour is also renting house out to a family eith children and last thing I'd want is for an injury. Would probably make him aware of this next time I contact

In case it wasn't clear, I wasn't suggesting you try and fell the trees, or attack larger branches. I'd never suggest that to someone without experience.

My suggestion was about "smaller overhanging branches" i.e. the ones with lower damage-causing potential and which would fall in your garden (not the public space or the neighbour's gardens).  And also as stated, after "learning about safe methods of working" along with "knowing the legal rules inside out".

I wouldn't suggest that anyone takes a risk working with trees.

However, if you get someone in to do the work you would need to be willing to absorb the full cost yourself, or else approach it in a way which is 'legal' and leaves you in a position where you could claim the costs off the neighbour (/and council) if they refuse to contribute.

If you pay a tree surgeon (possibly a 4-figure sum) to trim a few small overhanging branches off a tree, and if you then try to (legally) claim the cost back from the neighbour, the court will take into account whether or not the costs incurred were reasonable in the circumstances.  There is an expectation that people will minimise the cost, and in some cases that would include adopting a DIY solution.

The neighbour's trees are large, but not 'massive' in tree terms. From your pictures it appears most of the overhang is small twig-like growth.  The cost therefore of cutting that back shouldn't be excessive, even if hiring a tree surgeon to do it makes it a 4-figure sum.

The council owned tree is a different story. Some of the branches on that are larger, but the situation could be improved significantly by pruning off some of the smaller branches.  Employing a tree surgeon to cut that tree back and presenting the council with the bill will almost certainly be met with a flat refusal. Taking legal action against them to recover the cost will likely be fought tooth and nail.

If you are happy to bear the full costs yourself then definitely look at getting in a professional to deal with all the overhanging branches (obviously still complying with the legal requirements).  But I would steer clear of those advertising using leaflets pushed through the door... good traders rarely need to advertise in that way, and if you want the trees dealt with in a safer manner than you can DIY it yourself, then you need a very good trader.

Otherwise you have to continue negotiating with both of the tree owners to get them to take responsibility for their trees, and do so up to the point where a court would find it reasonable for you to go ahead and take matters into your own hands by arranging to employ someone to do it.

Also, carefully think through the suggestion of contacting your home insurance legal protection if you are considering that option.  Will they make a record of you contacting them to discuss concerns about 'massive' trees in the neighbour's garden which might be damaging your property, and possibly causing subsidence?  Will that information be passed to the underwriters?  Will that affect your premiums or ability to get insurance when you renew?  There are some tricky questions there, and you should of course bear in mind the responsibility to honestly declare relevant facts when taking out or renewing insurance policies.  In other words there could be unintended consequences of making this problem bigger than it is.

But, to be clear, I'm not suggesting that anyone tries DIY tree work if they are not confident they know how to do the job safely and legally.

Thanks for this. We have already cut back some of the smaller branches that are lower as that's all we can really reach at this point anyway. I wouldn't do any more than that ourselves anyway. Appreciate your advice. Doesn't really seem there is much I can legally do or enforce anything towards the neighbour and seems can only be done ourselves. Cheers again.

Section62

M00nface said:

Thanks for this. We have already cut back some of the smaller branches that are lower as that's all we can really reach at this point anyway. I wouldn't do any more than that ourselves anyway. Appreciate your advice. Doesn't really seem there is much I can legally do or enforce anything towards the neighbour and seems can only be done ourselves. Cheers again.

Yup, I'd noticed that in your first post, and that was partly why I suggested the telescopic pruner.

Standing with both feet on the ground using a telescopic pruner is a much safer way of dealing with smaller branches than anything involving a ladder. Not least because using loppers requires both hands (and force) which means no spare hands to hold onto the ladder, or to deflect falling branches coming towards you or the ladder.

There is stuff you can do legally, but it takes time and costs money, so you have to look at all the available options.

Swasterix

HampshireH said:

Absolutely being too nice.

I wouldn't wait two either either.

I would email him again next with much firmer with exactly what you want done.

Don't dance around the problem with "ideally" etc.

"Tree x requires x to be done. We now require this is now done by x date. As a branch has already landed on a person and caused injury it is of huge concern that this could happen again.

We will pursue any costs for damages caused by these trees is this issue is not resolved.

As it's now been x months since this was brought to your attention, please let me know the date you have these works booked in for."

Not meaning to sound awful at all, but if I received a communication worded like this from my neighbours, I would tell them to get stuffed.  

Presumably the tree/trees have been there for some time, possibly since before OP owned the house? Obviously trees grow and require pruning from time to time. Would have taken little research to find out where the responsibility lies before it had gotten out of hand. 

Regardless, OP is well within her rights to cut the trees back to the boundary, but it is their cost to bear. The neighbour is under no obligation to bear any cost or arrange anything whatsoever. Fair or not, that’s the way it is.

By all means continue to communicate with your neighbour. They may eventually get round to doing something, but it’s pointless getting their back up with snarky emails or letters. In the mean time, I’d start making arrangements to have somebody deal with the branches overhanging your side. 

Edit to add: having re-read OPs post, I’ve realised that they have just recently moved in. The trees must have been of a similar size at the time of purchase. Had you done a little basic research at that time, you would have been able to take a view on whether it was worth proceeding with your purchase given the amount of hassle you might have. Obviously that doesn’t help now, and I’m sorry. 

My advice remains as above. Arrange for the trees to be cut back at your cost. Meanwhile, keep the pressure up on your neighbour, but be nice. He may just get sick of you and take action. It might be helpful if you were to offer to share the cost as a sweetener, given that sadly for you he’s under no obligation to do anything. 

I do hope you manage to get a result!

M00nface

Swasterix said:

HampshireH said:

Absolutely being too nice.

I wouldn't wait two either either.

I would email him again next with much firmer with exactly what you want done.

Don't dance around the problem with "ideally" etc.

"Tree x requires x to be done. We now require this is now done by x date. As a branch has already landed on a person and caused injury it is of huge concern that this could happen again.

We will pursue any costs for damages caused by these trees is this issue is not resolved.

As it's now been x months since this was brought to your attention, please let me know the date you have these works booked in for."

Not meaning to sound awful at all, but if I received a communication worded like this from my neighbours, I would tell them to get stuffed.  

Presumably the tree/trees have been there for some time, possibly since before OP owned the house? Obviously trees grow and require pruning from time to time. Would have taken little research to find out where the responsibility lies before it had gotten out of hand. 

Regardless, OP is well within her rights to cut the trees back to the boundary, but it is their cost to bear. The neighbour is under no obligation to bear any cost or arrange anything whatsoever. Fair or not, that’s the way it is.

By all means continue to communicate with your neighbour. They may eventually get round to doing something, but it’s pointless getting their back up with snarky emails or letters. In the mean time, I’d start making arrangements to have somebody deal with the branches overhanging your side. 

Edit to add: having re-read OPs post, I’ve realised that they have just recently moved in. The trees must have been of a similar size at the time of purchase. Had you done a little basic research at that time, you would have been able to take a view on whether it was worth proceeding with your purchase given the amount of hassle you might have. Obviously that doesn’t help now, and I’m sorry. 

My advice remains as above. Arrange for the trees to be cut back at your cost. Meanwhile, keep the pressure up on your neighbour, but be nice. He may just get sick of you and take action. It might be helpful if you were to offer to share the cost as a sweetener, given that sadly for you he’s under no obligation to do anything. 

I do hope you manage to get a result!

When we view the house it wasn't at the time of year when the trees were in full bloom so we didn't realise how are they were. Regardless if we knew this woulsnt have affected us proceeding with the purchase as we would have done so anyway.
 It wouldn't have been a sale killer for us. We are only trying to see if there is anything that can be done at this point. The people who lived here before didn't use the back garden at all apart from somwhere for their dog to toilet. I don't think they realised the concerns of the trees themselves.

The neighbour also doesn't live at the property and I don't think I've seen them there since we moved in, I don't think they realise themselves how large the trees are and potentially any issues, this is why we're trying to make him aware of this,I don't think the previous owners did.
I don't think either party were aware or cared before this point.

If nothing is done then so be it, I'm just seeing if anything can be done and where we stand. A lot of people are saying I need to be less "nice" and others stay nice so I'm not really sure 😂

M00nface

Section62 said:

M00nface said:

Thanks for this. We have already cut back some of the smaller branches that are lower as that's all we can really reach at this point anyway. I wouldn't do any more than that ourselves anyway. Appreciate your advice. Doesn't really seem there is much I can legally do or enforce anything towards the neighbour and seems can only be done ourselves. Cheers again.

Yup, I'd noticed that in your first post, and that was partly why I suggested the telescopic pruner.

Standing with both feet on the ground using a telescopic pruner is a much safer way of dealing with smaller branches than anything involving a ladder. Not least because using loppers requires both hands (and force) which means no spare hands to hold onto the ladder, or to deflect falling branches coming towards you or the ladder.

There is stuff you can do legally, but it takes time and costs money, so you have to look at all the available options.

Will definitely look into the telescopic one then, one I have now requires two hands and have definitely been a bit wobbly on the ladder a few times!. Do you have any links or anything about further legal advice on this?

MysteryMe

M00nface said:

Loza2016 said:

You may have a struggle finding a tree surgeon that wants the Job as they aren’t your trees. Without the owner’s permission some won’t want the hassle. 

I hope the neighbour sees sense and sorts them out for you. 

Believe it or not we actually get load of leaflets through or door for trer surgeons saying they'll cut up to boundaries of neighbouring trees. I think they can see them from the back and think we're an idea customer haha

Good tree surgeons very rarely leaflet.

Always try and get personal recommendations or businesses that are part of a trading standards approved scheme. There are just too many scammers operating in the home and garden maintenance area and they get their business from cold calling and leaflet drops.

Section62

M00nface said:

Do you have any links or anything about further legal advice on this?

I think the advice already given in this thread is about right.  You need to be clear with the neighbour what action you want and by when, then see how they respond.  You need to be reasonable in what you ask for, and give them a reasonable amount of time to take action.  E.g. they would need at least a month to organise a contractor, and you can't expect them to do work in bird nesting season, or when pruning a particular species of tree can harm it or make it vulnerable to disease.

A small point - and not a criticism of you - but in your post replying to Swasterix you said the trees weren't in full [leaf] when you viewed.  The fir/conifer/leylandii thing closest to your house is an evergreen, so will look roughly the same all year round.  That doesn't matter for the purposes of the discussion in this thread, but something to bear in mind if what you saw when you viewed becomes relevant in any legal action. Small details like that are the kind of thing the other side's legal representatives might pick up on and use to undermine your claim.