Employer asked for my P45 never put me on books won’t give my p45 back

lawcher

Hi I started a new job 6th may the employer asked for my p45 DBS certificates and health & hygiene certificates. I handed them over - after 3  weeks they paid  wages in bank hit and miss and I asked am I going on the books as I’ve no wage slip or taxed etc
he said say it’s training we will have you in books soon. Another lady started same thing carried on we’d both ask about tax etc same reply I said you can’t say it’s trial period I’ve been here 6 week now you put the money in my bank under the business name and how many hours.
Boss still didn’t do it 10 weeks on I text him -“asked  is he putting me on books he said yes soon( I wanted the reply in writing).
so long story short I left 10 days ago terrible employers full stop and I asked the day I left can you send me my stuff p45 etc ,  a week went by nothing he drives past my house every day going to wholesalers - said he’d drop it in my door !
he hasnt - I can’t go back as I had breast cancer surgery and the position caused me lots pain and swelling I saw the surgeon today and he said not to work there.

the employer has been horrible and rude since I left - they treat us awful but I’d like my items back he simply says 
when we pass your house you’ll get it in our time.

can I report them ? It’s really frustrating 

Thankyou 

General_Grant

lawcher said:

Hi I started a new job 6th may the employer asked for my p45 DBS certificates and health & hygiene certificates. I handed them over - after 3  weeks they paid  wages in bank hit and miss and I asked am I going on the books as I’ve no wage slip or taxed etc
he said say it’s training we will have you in books soon. Another lady started same thing carried on we’d both ask about tax etc same reply I said you can’t say it’s trial period I’ve been here 6 week now you put the money in my bank under the business name and how many hours.
Boss still didn’t do it 10 weeks on I text him -“asked  is he putting me on books he said yes soon( I wanted the reply in writing).
so long story short I left 10 days ago terrible employers full stop and I asked the day I left can you send me my stuff p45 etc ,  a week went by nothing he drives past my house every day going to wholesalers - said he’d drop it in my door !
he hasnt - I can’t go back as I had breast cancer surgery and the position caused me lots pain and swelling I saw the surgeon today and he said not to work there.

the employer has been horrible and rude since I left - they treat us awful but I’d like my items back he simply says 
when we pass your house you’ll get it in our time.

can I report them ? It’s really frustrating 

Thankyou 

You don't need to get your P45 back - a new employer can be issued with coding by HMRC (though may deduct tax at 20% until this is received - and any over-payment of tax will be refunded).

Re DBS - did you get this back?  If not, do you have reference number and did you sign for updating service?

Hygiene certificates - did you get these back?

(It's not clear whether the DBS and certificates are included in the "etc".)

When money was received in your bank account, was it the correct amount?  Was tax and NI apparently deducted or was it paid gross compared with your expected hourly rate?

TBagpuss

Personally I would write to them set out in the letter exactly what you want
-P45 from previous job, P45 from them, certificates (list them). State that these are your personal property and you do require them to be returned, and that of course they have a legal obligation to provide you with you pay slips and P45 with regard to your employment with them.

Enclose a SAE and ask that they are returned within 7 days, and get proof of positing when you send the letter to them. Alternatively can you call in at the business to request it? But sending a letter, if you keep a copy and proof of postage gives you a paper trail 

They need to pay you even if it was a training or probationary period and should have been reporting that to HMRC so I would have thought the last thing they would want if HMRC getting interested in their payroll practices... 

You can contact your local tax office who can remind them that they need to end you a P45 - this is of course relating to your P45 from your employment with them, not the older documents you provided to them on starting, but of course if you have a new one you shouldn't need the old one. 

I am pretty sure that they have to report to HMRC that they have paid you even if your pay was under the level where you have to pay tax - you should also be able to check with HMRC to see what tax/ NI has been reported, and to ask them to correct the record if they are wrong. 

lawcher

Thanks for your replies 
They didn’t put me on the books or the other staff that’s my worry even though I kept asking - the boss said say it’s a trial period I said I can’t - he w aged it cash in hand but never indicated that at the start as he asked for my P45.
yhey lis the hours I did straight into my bank with business name and how many hours I worked but kept saying I’ll contact my accountant to have you on the books - 10 weeks passed and still didn’t put us on the books so he obviously wanted to pay cash in hand which I would never of gone there if I knew that - he made it clear from the outset we would be on a contract and on the books but kept making excuses why he hadn’t.

yes I will send them an official letter with the SAE detailing what I require back.
they live 10 minutes drive away. I won’t go there they are not nice people I certainly wouldn’t test anyone the way they do.

as I said on my OP they didn’t have me as an employee paying me he kept lying saying he would myself and the I her lady kept asking.

I don’t see why I should have to chase them all the time they told me twice they put the requested items through my door they drive past my house every day so there is no reason other than childish behaviour.

thanks for your help.

lawcher

TBagpuss said:

Personally I would write to them set out in the letter exactly what you want
-P45 from previous job, P45 from them, certificates (list them). State that these are your personal property and you do require them to be returned, and that of course they have a legal obligation to provide you with you pay slips and P45 with regard to your employment with them.

Enclose a SAE and ask that they are returned within 7 days, and get proof of positing when you send the letter to them. Alternatively can you call in at the business to request it? But sending a letter, if you keep a copy and proof of postage gives you a paper trail 

They need to pay you even if it was a training or probationary period and should have been reporting that to HMRC so I would have thought the last thing they would want if HMRC getting interested in their payroll practices... 

You can contact your local tax office who can remind them that they need to end you a P45 - this is of course relating to your P45 from your employment with them, not the older documents you provided to them on starting, but of course if you have a new one you shouldn't need the old one. 

I am pretty sure that they have to report to HMRC that they have paid you even if your pay was under the level where you have to pay tax - you should also be able to check with HMRC to see what tax/ NI has been reported, and to ask them to correct the record if they are wrong. 

As said they never told tax man I was woriking  for them or the
Other lady she earns £300 per week they haven’t told tax man etc he’s telling us it’s cash in hand but it isn’t he’s put it in our banks with the business name and hours we worked no tax no deductions no wage slip etc 
we both kept asking to be put through the books he kept saying he would but in the meantime it’s cash in hand 
I said there’s evidence it’s earnings in our bank he then said out that down as a trial I said it’s can’t be its way too long.

General_Grant

Calling it "a trial" doesn't mean anything as far as the employment relationship is concerned.  
Employers will refer to "probationary periods" which is a trial and this forms part of employment.  They can be any length and be extended so calling your employment "a trial" as though that meant they didn't have to provide payslips is a nonsense.

By the way, you would also be entitled to paid leave accrued during the period of your employment.

You did keep your part of the original P45 didn't you?

TBagpuss

lawcher said:

TBagpuss said:

Personally I would write to them set out in the letter exactly what you want
-P45 from previous job, P45 from them, certificates (list them). State that these are your personal property and you do require them to be returned, and that of course they have a legal obligation to provide you with you pay slips and P45 with regard to your employment with them.

Enclose a SAE and ask that they are returned within 7 days, and get proof of positing when you send the letter to them. Alternatively can you call in at the business to request it? But sending a letter, if you keep a copy and proof of postage gives you a paper trail 

They need to pay you even if it was a training or probationary period and should have been reporting that to HMRC so I would have thought the last thing they would want if HMRC getting interested in their payroll practices... 

You can contact your local tax office who can remind them that they need to end you a P45 - this is of course relating to your P45 from your employment with them, not the older documents you provided to them on starting, but of course if you have a new one you shouldn't need the old one. 

I am pretty sure that they have to report to HMRC that they have paid you even if your pay was under the level where you have to pay tax - you should also be able to check with HMRC to see what tax/ NI has been reported, and to ask them to correct the record if they are wrong. 

As said they never told tax man I was woriking  for them or the
Other lady she earns £300 per week they haven’t told tax man etc he’s telling us it’s cash in hand but it isn’t he’s put it in our banks with the business name and hours we worked no tax no deductions no wage slip etc 
we both kept asking to be put through the books he kept saying he would but in the meantime it’s cash in hand 
I said there’s evidence it’s earnings in our bank he then said out that down as a trial I said it’s can’t be its way too long.

Which is why you need to check the position with HMRC, to ensure that you get your NI recorded so itit taken into account when you are looking at pension etc, and also why they probably won't want you to involve HMRC so it gives you good leverage! 

Them telling yo it is cash in hand doesn't mean that they escape their responsibilities as an employer, and as you say, you have the proof that you were paid.

I'd tell him that if you don't get all the things you've requested by  [date] you'll have no option t contact HMRC to sort it out from that end, from their records. If he has any sense at all he'll want to avoid that as it sounds like he is not doing anything correctly, so won't want them involved.

Then when he gives you your paperwork back, tell HMRC anyway, and perhaps they will investigate and he will be less likely to get away with it next time!