Are people not learning any lessons re travel bookings?

p3ncilsharpener

MoJoeGo said:

Ganga said:

MoJoeGo said:

Shaking my head a bit right now. It seems like every day we are getting posts from people asking for help with refunds when the travel rules change (as they do every 5 minutes it seems). However this is despite them having done one or more of:

1) Made their original booking during the pandemic
2) Booked with a travel agent that has a poor reputation
3) Not got any/adequate travel insurance
4) Not checked the cancellation terms before booking

I've not tacked this post onto one of these threads as I'd rather not be rubbing salt into any specific posters wound... but are people really not learning even the basics of making sure they have some risk mitigation, after more than a year of global disruption?

Whilst i agree with some of your comments the likes of TUI are not a travel agent with a poor track record but some people are still waiting for their money back.
The biggest problem would be that this world wide pandemic which has been raging for almost a year and a half ,is something that the travel industry has never had to face before and has had to adjust on a daily basis.
The other problem was some people expected a refund almost instantly ,if all the travel industry had been made to pay back say with in 2 weeks most would have gone under and that would have left many facing hardship .
I am not defending them all nor do i work for any off them ,i am an engineer who has been retired for over 5 years and have had holidays cancelled like most but have carried on and still look forward to the day when all is well again.

I'm not saying that everyone posting for help here has been irresponsible in their actions (although some would argue that anyone booking anything during a pandemic is irresponsible by definition - not my view however).

For example, I was also waiting a while for TUI to refund me for a holiday last year, but I cut them some slack for exactly the reasons you mentioned. After all, I wasn't going anywhere else in a hurry so not like I desperately needed the money back.

The posts I'm referencing, and I'm not going to point at specifics (I'm sure you can spot them!) are the ones where no personal responsibility has been exercised and now it's last chance saloon time to try and find someone else to blame/pick up the tab. The starting position generally seems to be "waah, I'm a poor little consumer, surely one of these big bad companies (airline/TA/credit card/hotel) should be more responsible than me".

Ironically, that attitude is exactly what I'm used to dealing with in my day job, financial services being as heavily regulated as they are. Doesn't work so well here though, as people are now finding out. But not, apparently, learning the lessons in the process...

Ultimately this is a problem that is only going to get worse.  Increasingly people are having personal responsibility taken away from them through more and more Government interventions.  It's clearly got to the point that people essentially don't care about risk, as there is an expectation of, for want of a better term, a Government bailout.

This is not helped by people like Martin Lewis essentially painting every company as "the enemy" who should not be trusted and should be "screwed over" at essentially every opportunity (and he's gotten rather rich off playing people against companies too.)

ginger_chocolate

Ganga said:

Sandtree said:

MoJoeGo said:

2) Booked with a travel agent that has a poor reputation

You are forgetting that people book almost always book on price and its easier to offer cheaper prices if you provide poor service and avoid your obligations for as long as possible. To a lesser degree there can also be an element of convenience, City, Heathrow and Gatwick are my three easiest airports to get to in order and so Ryanair are not high on my list but if you live near Luton or Southend etc then its understandable why you may consider them more favourably.

The ones that amuse me more personally are those that are doing chargebacks against the likes of Ryanair as not only were they let down in the first place but they were unhappy with the handling of the situation and now are complaining that Ryanair won't let them book with them again unless they repay their debt. Thats going beyond just using someone with a poor reputation but where you have first hand poor experience

People ALWAYS complain about budget airlines and yet use them time after time ,why ? because they are cheap as chips !
Many years ago i had to go to Southampton on a training course ( we live in the NE of England ) got a price from BA who at the time were the only ones who flew Newcastle / Southampton  £333.00 ! the course was cancelled and went a few years later ,flew with Flybe £19.50 , scheduled flight costs have all ways been more expensive so RyanAir etc will always be popular.

tbh if I could get a flight for £19.50 I'd be willing to risk losing the money if something went wrong. £333 less so....

ginger_chocolate

This is not helped by people like Martin Lewis essentially painting every company as "the enemy" who should not be trusted and should be "screwed over" at essentially every opportunity (and he's gotten rather rich off playing people against companies too.)

To be fair, he does also point out when companies are doing good things - e.g. when sharing info on which banks have the best customer service. 

People should take personal responsibility for their decisions, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't also hold companies to account when they behave badly. It's not a business bad/consumer good or vice versa situation. 

Thrugelmir

ginger_chocolate said:

This is not helped by people like Martin Lewis essentially painting every company as "the enemy" who should not be trusted and should be "screwed over" at essentially every opportunity (and he's gotten rather rich off playing people against companies too.)

People should take personal responsibility for their decisions, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't also hold companies to account when they behave badly. It's not a business bad/consumer good or vice versa situation. 

Trouble is the cost of the wasted unproductive time is borne by us the consumer in the price we pay. As everything now seems to escalate into a complaint. Whether there's foundation for one or not. I often wonder if people do any actual work themselves the amount of time they spend dealing with personal problems. 

MoJoeGo

ginger_chocolate said:

Ganga said:

Sandtree said:

MoJoeGo said:

2) Booked with a travel agent that has a poor reputation

You are forgetting that people book almost always book on price and its easier to offer cheaper prices if you provide poor service and avoid your obligations for as long as possible. To a lesser degree there can also be an element of convenience, City, Heathrow and Gatwick are my three easiest airports to get to in order and so Ryanair are not high on my list but if you live near Luton or Southend etc then its understandable why you may consider them more favourably.

The ones that amuse me more personally are those that are doing chargebacks against the likes of Ryanair as not only were they let down in the first place but they were unhappy with the handling of the situation and now are complaining that Ryanair won't let them book with them again unless they repay their debt. Thats going beyond just using someone with a poor reputation but where you have first hand poor experience

People ALWAYS complain about budget airlines and yet use them time after time ,why ? because they are cheap as chips !
Many years ago i had to go to Southampton on a training course ( we live in the NE of England ) got a price from BA who at the time were the only ones who flew Newcastle / Southampton  £333.00 ! the course was cancelled and went a few years later ,flew with Flybe £19.50 , scheduled flight costs have all ways been more expensive so RyanAir etc will always be popular.

tbh if I could get a flight for £19.50 I'd be willing to risk losing the money if something went wrong. £333 less so....

Likewise it's a risk I'd be happy to take (although even then probably not with Ryanair). But for some people that £19.50 would be pushing the boat out versus going on another "Sun £9.50 special" to Pontins, and not money that can easily be lost. 

You'd think in that situation people would be especially careful reading the conditions that go with spending their money. But as we see here, that's often not the case. To too many people, price is king. Until it bites you in the backside.

Ganga

MoJoeGo said:

ginger_chocolate said:

Ganga said:

Sandtree said:

MoJoeGo said:

2) Booked with a travel agent that has a poor reputation

You are forgetting that people book almost always book on price and its easier to offer cheaper prices if you provide poor service and avoid your obligations for as long as possible. To a lesser degree there can also be an element of convenience, City, Heathrow and Gatwick are my three easiest airports to get to in order and so Ryanair are not high on my list but if you live near Luton or Southend etc then its understandable why you may consider them more favourably.

The ones that amuse me more personally are those that are doing chargebacks against the likes of Ryanair as not only were they let down in the first place but they were unhappy with the handling of the situation and now are complaining that Ryanair won't let them book with them again unless they repay their debt. Thats going beyond just using someone with a poor reputation but where you have first hand poor experience

People ALWAYS complain about budget airlines and yet use them time after time ,why ? because they are cheap as chips !
Many years ago i had to go to Southampton on a training course ( we live in the NE of England ) got a price from BA who at the time were the only ones who flew Newcastle / Southampton  £333.00 ! the course was cancelled and went a few years later ,flew with Flybe £19.50 , scheduled flight costs have all ways been more expensive so RyanAir etc will always be popular.

tbh if I could get a flight for £19.50 I'd be willing to risk losing the money if something went wrong. £333 less so....

Likewise it's a risk I'd be happy to take (although even then probably not with Ryanair). But for some people that £19.50 would be pushing the boat out versus going on another "Sun £9.50 special" to Pontins, and not money that can easily be lost. 

You'd think in that situation people would be especially careful reading the conditions that go with spending their money. But as we see here, that's often not the case. To too many people, price is king. Until it bites you in the backside.

Without sounding like a flash harry ,if £19.50 is going to cause people heart ache they should not be considering travelling . As i said earlier its the people laying out several thousands for a holiday and booking with some fly by night operator to save £5 ! but each to their own as this is a money saving site.

rosiesposies

There are also a lot of people like me who are desperate to go abroad to see family.. its not just holidays! 
Ive had smatterings of both cancelled and fingers crossed both will happen in the next 6 weeks. 
I will be joining you in the lounge Butts, I will hit silver by end of sept (started bronze in june with first flight in 18 months) and should be gold well before june next year. 

CKhalvashi

Ganga said:

MoJoeGo said:

ginger_chocolate said:

Ganga said:

Sandtree said:

MoJoeGo said:

2) Booked with a travel agent that has a poor reputation

You are forgetting that people book almost always book on price and its easier to offer cheaper prices if you provide poor service and avoid your obligations for as long as possible. To a lesser degree there can also be an element of convenience, City, Heathrow and Gatwick are my three easiest airports to get to in order and so Ryanair are not high on my list but if you live near Luton or Southend etc then its understandable why you may consider them more favourably.

The ones that amuse me more personally are those that are doing chargebacks against the likes of Ryanair as not only were they let down in the first place but they were unhappy with the handling of the situation and now are complaining that Ryanair won't let them book with them again unless they repay their debt. Thats going beyond just using someone with a poor reputation but where you have first hand poor experience

People ALWAYS complain about budget airlines and yet use them time after time ,why ? because they are cheap as chips !
Many years ago i had to go to Southampton on a training course ( we live in the NE of England ) got a price from BA who at the time were the only ones who flew Newcastle / Southampton  £333.00 ! the course was cancelled and went a few years later ,flew with Flybe £19.50 , scheduled flight costs have all ways been more expensive so RyanAir etc will always be popular.

tbh if I could get a flight for £19.50 I'd be willing to risk losing the money if something went wrong. £333 less so....

Likewise it's a risk I'd be happy to take (although even then probably not with Ryanair). But for some people that £19.50 would be pushing the boat out versus going on another "Sun £9.50 special" to Pontins, and not money that can easily be lost. 

You'd think in that situation people would be especially careful reading the conditions that go with spending their money. But as we see here, that's often not the case. To too many people, price is king. Until it bites you in the backside.

Without sounding like a flash harry ,if £19.50 is going to cause people heart ache they should not be considering travelling . As i said earlier its the people laying out several thousands for a holiday and booking with some fly by night operator to save £5 ! but each to their own as this is a money saving site.

I don't think it's £19.50 causing heartache, I think for some it's a case of losing their money and not being able to go somewhere.

I booked a series of flights last February for summer 2020, 5 flights with 5 airlines. 3 of those ended up being cancelled and I made the other 2 work (a weekend in Vilnius and getting into the country I was supposed to be finishing in from London 3 days after returning).

I have 2 skeleton bookings so far for this summer, one pair was cheap, the other (booked in the middle) is refundable if I can't enter either the country I'm transiting for 2 weeks or the destination country. Everything else has been planned around this and is completely refundable.

I completely agree though about booking (and paying) with companies one hasn't heard of. We are offering discounts now for pre-payment within my own interests, we are also in a position to be able to offer vouchers (in most cases) or refunds (in the case of border closures). Nothing I have an interest in offers flights or packages under the UK or EU legal definitions.

Butts

rosiesposies said:

There are also a lot of people like me who are desperate to go abroad to see family.. its not just holidays! 
Ive had smatterings of both cancelled and fingers crossed both will happen in the next 6 weeks. 
I will be joining you in the lounge Butts, I will hit silver by end of sept (started bronze in june with first flight in 18 months) and should be gold well before june next year. 

Replying to you sitting in the BA Lounge at Edinburgh Airport which reopened last week.

It's only 7am but I'm supping a Cappuccino with a Cognac chaser.

En- route to London City  and then returning from LHR tomorrow night at which point I will go Silver.

Depending on covid I have upcoming trips to Romania, Bulgaria, Turkey, Greece and Albania before the end of the year. Germany and Czech Republic have succumbed to the lurgy to be replaced by two Ireland Excursions. Added bonus with ROI Duty Free is back - save a few quid on ciggies.  

lisyloo

ginger_chocolate said:

Ganga said:

Sandtree said:

MoJoeGo said:

2) Booked with a travel agent that has a poor reputation

You are forgetting that people book almost always book on price and its easier to offer cheaper prices if you provide poor service and avoid your obligations for as long as possible. To a lesser degree there can also be an element of convenience, City, Heathrow and Gatwick are my three easiest airports to get to in order and so Ryanair are not high on my list but if you live near Luton or Southend etc then its understandable why you may consider them more favourably.

The ones that amuse me more personally are those that are doing chargebacks against the likes of Ryanair as not only were they let down in the first place but they were unhappy with the handling of the situation and now are complaining that Ryanair won't let them book with them again unless they repay their debt. Thats going beyond just using someone with a poor reputation but where you have first hand poor experience

People ALWAYS complain about budget airlines and yet use them time after time ,why ? because they are cheap as chips !
Many years ago i had to go to Southampton on a training course ( we live in the NE of England ) got a price from BA who at the time were the only ones who flew Newcastle / Southampton  £333.00 ! the course was cancelled and went a few years later ,flew with Flybe £19.50 , scheduled flight costs have all ways been more expensive so RyanAir etc will always be popular.

tbh if I could get a flight for £19.50 I'd be willing to risk losing the money if something went wrong. £333 less so....

I don't see any issue with knowingly taking a risk when you understand the terms of the risk.
That's not what this thread is about though.