Laser treatment - could I get a refund?

TELLIT01

PR1510 said:

TELLIT01 said:

Do you have anything showing the original t&c from the time you made the initial booking.  If you can show that they have changed to an extent which effectively prevents you having the treatment you booked you should be able to get a full refund. 

How easy or otherwise it is going to be to actually get the refund is another matter.

Hi Tellit01, 

Thanks for your message. Unfortunately, there is nothing about suitability on the refund policy - it just says prepaid packages are non refundable. So that means it doesn’t matter if you are suitable or not - we will keep your money. If I changed my mind about having the treatment I can understand not getting the refund as per their policy. But I have not changed my mind, I am not medically suitable to have the treatment so them offering me almost 2k credit to use on something else does not really help and feels like I am being robbed.  

I wasn't actually commenting on your situation.  I was referring to potentially different statements on the website used by the OP at the time of booking and currently , and their situation is therefore totally different. 

Confusion can arise when 'variations on a theme' are raised by follow up posters.  Although I understand why people ask different questions on the same thread it really is better to start a new one unless the situations are the same.  It happens all the time, and isn't intended as a dig at PR1510.

PR1510

eskbanker said:

PR1510 said:
It seems barking mad they have not stated anything about suitability within their contract for laser hair removal so basically anyone can buy a package, go to the initial consultation and may be told they are not suitable like the OP and not get their money back because they entered a contract

But isn't the situation here that they're not telling you you're unsuitable, in that they're effectively disagreeing with your GP's view on that and asserting that the treatment can go ahead?

Having said that, even if they agreed that you were no longer suitable, it's still not clear to me that they'd be obliged to refund, from a consumer rights perspective, in a similar way to the fact that you don't get a refund of the cost of a flight if you turn up without a valid passport or visa and are denied boarding (not a perfect analogy!).

No the health questionnaire specifically stated I am unsuitable for treatment with that condition in black and white. The sales team (not a medical practitioner) are now saying I am suitable which contradicts what’s written in their own health questionnaire. My GP is also saying I am not suitable. It feels they are fobbing me off because if they declare I am unsuitable and unable to offer me treatment, they would probably have to refund me money which it seems like they don’t want to. This seems to be a common occurrence having read some reviews now (rookie error - learnt my lesson!). 

On the flight analogy - would I get offered a rescheduled flight or refund if I was not fit to fly - yes, and I have done in the past but of course each airline will have its own rules. I don’t think it is that black and white and a service provider should be able to apply discretion in extenuating circumstances. Or clearly indicate on the t&c’s…if you are found to be unsuitable for treatment you will not get a refund - then I would have never purchased from them in the first place. 

Sorry if this is a silly question but when does a contract start, on payment or on start of a service? Their T&Cs state the treatment is valid for 18 months from start of treatment so is that when the contract technically starts? 

PR1510

TELLIT01 said:

PR1510 said:

TELLIT01 said:

Do you have anything showing the original t&c from the time you made the initial booking.  If you can show that they have changed to an extent which effectively prevents you having the treatment you booked you should be able to get a full refund. 

How easy or otherwise it is going to be to actually get the refund is another matter.

Hi Tellit01, 

Thanks for your message. Unfortunately, there is nothing about suitability on the refund policy - it just says prepaid packages are non refundable. So that means it doesn’t matter if you are suitable or not - we will keep your money. If I changed my mind about having the treatment I can understand not getting the refund as per their policy. But I have not changed my mind, I am not medically suitable to have the treatment so them offering me almost 2k credit to use on something else does not really help and feels like I am being robbed.  

I wasn't actually commenting on your situation.  I was referring to potentially different statements on the website used by the OP at the time of booking and currently , and their situation is therefore totally different. 

Confusion can arise when 'variations on a theme' are raised by follow up posters.  Although I understand why people ask different questions on the same thread it really is better to start a new one unless the situations are the same.  It happens all the time, and isn't intended as a dig at PR1510.

Apologies for the confusion, the OP were given conflicting information on suitability on the same treatment, which is what I am also experiencing by the same provider Therapie Clinic. Hence I thought I would ask the OP whether the issue was resolved or not. 

eskbanker

PR1510 said:
It feels they are fobbing me off because if they declare I am unsuitable and unable to offer me treatment, they would probably have to refund me money which it seems like they don’t want to. 

It's probably moot anyway but it's unclear to me if there would be any obligation for them to do so.

PR1510 said:
I don’t think it is that black and white and a service provider should be able to apply discretion in extenuating circumstances.

Absolutely, a service provider should be able to apply discretion, but the issue here is whether or not they're compelled to refund in these circumstances.

PR1510 said:
Sorry if this is a silly question but when does a contract start, on payment or on start of a service? Their T&Cs state the treatment is valid for 18 months from start of treatment so is that when the contract technically starts? 

I haven't seen the contract terms but would have thought that the 18 month reference relates to the 'warranty period', i.e. the duration over which they'll 'guarantee' the results of the treatment.  I'd have thought that the start of a contract like this would have to be on payment, even if the actual treatment isn't scheduled for much later, otherwise they'd have your money with no terms applying to that.

PR1510

eskbanker said:

PR1510 said:
It feels they are fobbing me off because if they declare I am unsuitable and unable to offer me treatment, they would probably have to refund me money which it seems like they don’t want to. 

It's probably moot anyway but it's unclear to me if there would be any obligation for them to do so.

PR1510 said:
I don’t think it is that black and white and a service provider should be able to apply discretion in extenuating circumstances.

Absolutely, a service provider should be able to apply discretion, but the issue here is whether or not they're compelled to refund in these circumstances.

PR1510 said:
Sorry if this is a silly question but when does a contract start, on payment or on start of a service? Their T&Cs state the treatment is valid for 18 months from start of treatment so is that when the contract technically starts? 

I haven't seen the contract terms but would have thought that the 18 month reference relates to the 'warranty period', i.e. the duration over which they'll 'guarantee' the results of the treatment.  I'd have thought that the start of a contract like this would have to be on payment, even if the actual treatment isn't scheduled for much later, otherwise they'd have your money with no terms applying to that.

Thanks for that, thats useful to know. I cannot post the link to the t&c’s as I’m a newbie! 

I think I will contact the CMA perhaps if the can help to determine if the contract itself is fair or maybe the Consumer Ombudsman? I feel I am disproportionally disadvantaged with the t&c’s, but unsure if I have grounds to challenge why they are selling a package that is not refundable without determining suitability for customers. If I was found to be unsuitable based on my skin and hair colour (as not all lasers work effectively on different skin types) would they be allowed to say…sorry you purchased a package but we cannot treat you and we will also not give you your money back…should they even be allowed to sell like this in the first place?

eskbanker

PR1510 said:
I cannot post the link to the t&c’s as I’m a newbie! 

You can post them if you split the URL into separate chunks with some extra spacing and miss out the 'http://www.' bit at the beginning.

PR1510 said:
I think I will contact the CMA perhaps if the can help to determine if the contract itself is fair or maybe the Consumer Ombudsman?

I'd suggest Citizens Advice in the first instance - there isn't a consumer ombudsman as such (although Retail ADR might be an option), and I don't believe the CMA will intervene in a specific case like this.  Ultimately it's only a court that'll decide if a contract is fair or not....

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/get-more-help/Solve-an-ongoing-consumer-problem/

PR1510

eskbanker said:

PR1510 said:
I cannot post the link to the t&c’s as I’m a newbie! 

You can post them if you split the URL into separate chunks with some extra spacing and miss out the bit at the beginning.

lol PR1510 said:
I think I will contact the CMA perhaps if the can help to determine if the contract itself is fair or maybe the Consumer Ombudsman?

I'd suggest Citizens Advice in the first instance - there isn't a consumer ombudsman as such (although Retail ADR might be an option), and I don't believe the CMA will intervene in a specific case like this.  Ultimately it's only a court that'll decide if a contract 

Thanks for the trick with URL but it still won’t work! :-( 

Thank you, I will give citizens advice a call tomorrow and try that way - if not I may have to try court as a last resort. I read through the guidance on fair contracts and I don’t think this is as per the guidelines but I’m no expert! There is nothing even on cooling off periods/online/distant selling laws that might apply on the t&c’s which seems odd. It literally says this and that is it:

Refund Policy

Refund Policy

• Treatments/services are not transferable to other individuals or clinics
• We require at least 48 hours’ notice to be given for any appointment cancellation (See cancellation policy)
• In the case of pre-paid treatments, the full cost of treatment will be forfeited
• All items & purchases are non-refundable. This does not affect your statutory rights.

Prepaid Treatments

If you pre-pay for treatments in full you will avail of a discounted price. There is no refund on pre-pays and they are not transferable to other individuals, treatment areas or clinics. Pre-paid treatments are valid for the time periods specified below:

Laser Hair Removal Expiry Dates

• Per session – 3 months
• Course of 3 – 18 months
• Course of 6 – 18 months
• Course of 10 – 18 months

Body Treatments

• Any Purchase – 12 months

Skin Treatments

• Single Purchase – 12 months
• Course – 12 months

Injectables

• Any Purchase – 12 months

48 hours’ notice is required for any pre-paid appointment cancellations. If you cancel a pre-paid appointment within 48 hours, or do not attend the appointment, the treatment will be forfeited. (please see cancellation policy). You agree to these terms by purchasing pre-paid treatments.

eskbanker

https://www.therapieclinic.com/our-policy-procedures/ is the page you're quoting from, but that seems like a hotchpotch of miscellaneous bits and pieces rather than a cohesive contract, although if that's all there is, it's what would need to be judged against the unfair contract terms legislation.

No contract can override your statutory rights though, so your rights under the likes of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 and the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 are implied in any such contract.

PR1510

eskbanker said:

is the page you're quoting from, but that seems like a hotchpotch of miscellaneous bits and pieces rather than a cohesive contract, although if that's all there is, it's what would need to be judged against the unfair contract terms legislation.

No contract can override your statutory rights though, so your rights under the likes of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 and the Consumer Contracts (Information, Cancellation and Additional Charges) Regulations 2013 are implied in any such contract.

Unfortunately that’s all they keep referring me back to and I have not seen or received any other contract during or after the purchase aside from a link to that page.

Thanks for the pointers, I will have a read of the consumer contracts act as I think that would be more applicable in this case. This will be fun to understand and digest in my simple brain!