No room for the disabled

lisyloo

Sea_Shell said:

lisyloo said:l

Sea_Shell said:

If it got as far as court, would the court actually grant a sale order in the circumstances?

Regardless of either parties entitlement.

What’s circs are you referring to? Disability?

without underestimating how hard it is I don’t think disability prevents someone moving or being evicted

Lets think of this another way...     

How successful would the OP be if they had been left out of a will, and they were bringing a case under the Inheritance Act because they had not been sufficiently provided for?

We basically have a similar problem here, in that the will (assuming there was a will and it's not an intestacy split) does not fully take into account the OP's situation (yes, including her disabilities) and does not provide for them sufficiently.

In the circumstances (of an IA claim) would a court actually agree that the OP should "win" and get more of the inheritance, or be allowed to stay in the house?

Could the same outcome be applied in this situation where the OP is entitled to 50% but that is not enough to provide them with a home and a carer etc. going forwards.

It’s a great point (and sorry wasn’t immediately obvious to me that was where you were going).

the starting point is for the OP to confirm if they have legal cover and we haven’t had an answer on that.

if not the they have to try getting a free consultation with a solicitor about an IA claim.

lisyloo

ellenGB said:

Please accept that I am too ill to move. Suggestions to move are not helpful. If I could, I would. And social services do not help. They assessed mum only two days before her death when she was already unconscious and after questions from a male politician.  I complained, they apologised and the ombudsman was happy with that. I’d love to live in a different area with a better SS department but can’t. I know you are all trying to gelp but you do what a lot of able bodied people do. You don’t acknowledge our limitations. This ‘bet you can’ is hard to cope with. It’s what you ay to a child. I am 65. And truthful. 

I accept that you are too ill to physically move yourself, but I don’t accept that you cannot be moved. 
i say that as I have moved someone completely incapacitated and sold their home.
this is not a unique situation as it happens when Elderly people move into residential or nursing homes which happens all the time.
it’s simply not true to say those people cannot move.

the suggestion was that you take control rather than have it forced on you.
by contacting in the first instance social services, GP, citizens advice, shelter and now perhaps solicitor so see if you have a valid IA claim. Do you have anyone that can help you with this?

ellenGB

Hi.  No law centre.  Been disabled since childhood so you apply for them yourself.  I have PIP and ESA.  Asked for my own social worker.  Six months of promises but nothing yet. I have a choice.  Find somewhere to live but no money for sufficient care or live here by buying brother out, and no care.  He wants to sell house to pay mum’s debts.  She was rich but he managed to bankrupt her. No one saw that coming.  Hence will and nothing except letter of wishes to protect me.  I am the person with most to be paid from estate given I paid for her care until the last week when the nhs took over. 

New gp.  Old one told me to keep asking social services for help for mum.  Didn’t involve himself.  Except when brother claimed I was messing with mum’s medication.  Triggered a safeguarding investigation within 24 hours.  Still no idea what I am supposed to have done as my SAR has been rejected in full, to protect brother from stress of disclosure.  Other SARs were given so know two caters working with brother gave no drugs, as he instructed, and mum was often in pain. If I knew, I told carers, unaware of their contact and arrangements with brother.  Hence lost family.  They believe I tried to murder my mum.  The shock of that has prevented me from mourning her.  I lost mum and family.  And lost nearly £100k paying for care and repairs.  Ergo, can’t afford anything here or close by.  Plenty up North, but really too ill for such adventures. Apparently, this sibling alienation is very common so coroner sided with me against gp who wanted autopsy.  Coroner, bank manager and funeral director all recognised scenario and offered support. I’d never heard of sibling alienation.  

Note here to inform those of you who weren’t aware of this either.  If you have family, they can help with clearing and finding housing.  With a move.  Now you know why I can’t access that. Law can make exception to evict based on severe illhealth, apparently.  Speaking to consultant this week. 

Thanks for your help.  I know you all mean well. 

Sea_Shell

ellenGB said:

Hi.  No law centre.  Been disabled since childhood so you apply for them yourself.  I have PIP and ESA.  Asked for my own social worker.  Six months of promises but nothing yet. I have a choice.  Find somewhere to live but no money for sufficient care or live here by buying brother out, and no care.  He wants to sell house to pay mum’s debts.  She was rich but he managed to bankrupt her. No one saw that coming.  Hence will and nothing except letter of wishes to protect me.  I am the person with most to be paid from estate given I paid for her care until the last week when the nhs took over. 

New gp.  Old one told me to keep asking social services for help for mum.  Didn’t involve himself.  Except when brother claimed I was messing with mum’s medication.  Triggered a safeguarding investigation within 24 hours.  Still no idea what I am supposed to have done as my SAR has been rejected in full, to protect brother from stress of disclosure.  Other SARs were given so know two caters working with brother gave no drugs, as he instructed, and mum was often in pain. If I knew, I told carers, unaware of their contact and arrangements with brother.  Hence lost family.  They believe I tried to murder my mum.  The shock of that has prevented me from mourning her.  I lost mum and family.  And lost nearly £100k paying for care and repairs.  Ergo, can’t afford anything here or close by.  Plenty up North, but really too ill for such adventures. Apparently, this sibling alienation is very common so coroner sided with me against gp who wanted autopsy.  Coroner, bank manager and funeral director all recognised scenario and offered support. I’d never heard of sibling alienation.  

Note here to inform those of you who weren’t aware of this either.  If you have family, they can help with clearing and finding housing.  With a move.  Now you know why I can’t access that. Law can make exception to evict based on severe illhealth, apparently.  Speaking to consultant this week. 

Thanks for your help.  I know you all mean well. 

This one line puts a whole different perspective on things, and really goes to the heart of the issue around selling the house.

Yes, if your Mum had debts, however these were accrued, then these will HAVE to be settled from her estate, and if there is insufficient cash to do this then yes, the house would need to be sold.

Who is the executor of mums will, your brother?  If that is the case, then your Brother sounds like he is doing everything he should be doing to administer the estate.  

You are each only entitled to your shares of the estate, AFTER all her debts have been settled.

Unless there is even more to this story that you've left out!!


What sort of debt is it?

Equity Release?
Mortgage?
Credit Cards?
Loans?

lisyloo

ellenGB - you say you can’t afford care, but if you need it then it will be provided by the local authority. They do a needs assessment and then a financial assessment.
I did the financial stuff twice and my MIL & FIL were allowed about £300 per week income each before having to pay for care.
the first thing is to get your needs assessment.
chase it and complain if it doesn’t happen.

unfortunately the pandemic has made things worse for lots of people getting services, so you need to complain. If you don’t complain then the assumption from hard pressed services is that you dont really need it. Unfortunately that’s the way our social care and nhs work at the moment.

yes of course I’m aware that some people don’t have helpful family (or they are abroad). Happens to lots of people
It won’t stop someone being evicted if family don’t do it.

Volunteers and charities can help where there are no family and friends.
Shelter may be able to sign post you to another charity or voluntary organisation if they can’t help directly.

at one point I joined an organisation called gooddym who combined fitness goals with helping people. You run to someone’s house and then do a job for them.
so no need to feel it’s begging or pity,
everyone who volunteers has their own motivation for doing do e.g. they might be keeping fit

lisyloo

lisyloo said:

Sea_Shell said:l

lisyloo said:l

Sea_Shell said:

If it got as far as court, would the court actually grant a sale order in the circumstances?

Regardless of either parties entitlement.

What’s circs are you referring to? Disability?

without underestimating how hard it is I don’t think disability prevents someone moving or being evicted

Lets think of this another way...     

How successful would the OP be if they had been left out of a will, and they were bringing a case under the Inheritance Act because they had not been sufficiently provided for?

We basically have a similar problem here, in that the will (assuming there was a will and it's not an intestacy split) does not fully take into account the OP's situation (yes, including her disabilities) and does not provide for them sufficiently.

In the circumstances (of an IA claim) would a court actually agree that the OP should "win" and get more of the inheritance, or be allowed to stay in the house?

Could the same outcome be applied in this situation where the OP is entitled to 50% but that is not enough to provide them with a home and a carer etc. going forwards.

It’s a great point (and sorry wasn’t immediately obvious to me that was where you were going).

the starting point is for the OP to confirm if they have legal cover and we haven’t had an answer on that.

if not the they have to try getting a free consultation with a solicitor about an IA claim.

Note the inheritance is only the bit AFTER the debts are paid.
this is crucial as the house may have to be sold anyway.

Sea_Shell

Something else has occurred to me.  Maybe the op can confirm.

You say the ownership of the house is (now?) currently tenants in common.

When did this happen?  Before your Mum passed?  Surely any executor can't have already changed the ownership yet, especially if there are any secured debts.

Does the house actually form part of your Mum's estate, if ownership was amended before she passed (for whatever reason)?

ellenGB

Ownership has not changed yet. Social care where I live is appalling. I am main person to whom mum was in debt. I did mention my role as payer of care and repairs before. Not bothered about being repaid now. Can afford to pay beneficiaries. So house doesn’t have to be sold for that. Am exploring equity release and buy brother out. 

ellenGB

lisyloo said:

ellenGB - you say you can’t afford care, but if you need it then it will be provided by the local authority. They do a needs assessment and then a financial assessment.
I did the financial stuff twice and my MIL & FIL were allowed about £300 per week income each before having to pay for care.
the first thing is to get your needs assessment.
chase it and complain if it doesn’t happen.

unfortunately the pandemic has made things worse for lots of people getting services, so you need to complain. 

As noted above, doesn’t work like that in Richmond. One year and counting. Theory different from practice. Ombudsman sided with council because they apologised to me. 

Sea_Shell

Is the house still in your Mum's name?
Who is the executor?
Who are the beneficiaries and in what %?
Did the will specify the house at all, or is it just part of the overall estate?
Was your "loan" to your Mum documented in any way, or did you just pay for stuff as and when?   
Can you prove you didn't gift Mum this money?


I realise it's difficult and complicated, but clear answers will give us the full picture and you'll get more helpful ideas that way.