Freeholder wants to know when tenant moved in

woeestme

Hi, my situation is that I'm a long term tenant (nearly 20 yrs) in a London flat.  Initially, I'd signed with one other person an assured shorthold tenancy for 6 months with the leaseholder.  On 2 occasions there was a small rent increase but the terms of the contract remained the same.  The latest contract I signed was in 2014 - a '6 month assured shorthold tenancy' but with me as sole signatory.  This contract has remained in place since.

The owner (leaseholder of flats + shop) has recently said they're trying to extend the 'head lease' with the freeholder and the freeholder wants to know exactly when I moved in.  In the same leasehold, there is another flat whose occupant has been there for more than 20 yrs and there is a long running established business on the ground floor (>15 yrs).

So, naturally, I'm wondering what's afoot with regard to the freeholder needing to know my exact move in date?  Thanks in advance.

P.S. I'm not sure but I believe there's a difference between tenancies signed before and after 1998?

theartfullodger

There's a big difference with tenancies before 28 February 1997. (Usually no s21)

What's afoot?  Maybe leasehold conditions , maybe they are nosey .  
Your Landlord surely has right to inform them of that, but probably not your name or other details (unless you've granted them right to do that in eg tenancy agreement)

eddddy

I can't see how this is relevant to a lease extension.

Is you landlord asking you - or is the freeholder asking you (maybe behind your landlord's back)?


Most leases say that the freeholder's consent is required to sub-let a flat. Maybe your landlord didn't get consent, so the freeholder is investigating how many years your landlord has been breaching the lease.

(And some leases say that sub-letting isn't allowed under any circumstances.)

woeestme

The leaseholder (landlord) of the flat (who's also the leaseholder for the flat below and a downstairs shop in the same building) leases off the freeholder.  We the tenants (2 flats and a business) rent off the leaseholder.

The leaseholder (landlord) has recently said to me that she's trying to extend the head lease with the freeholder and that the freeholder has asked when I moved into the property because they 'need this information'.

There's a big difference with tenancies before 28 February 1997. (Usually no s21)

Yes, I thought there was a situation like this.

TBH, I think the leaseholder(landlord) is organising to evict me and determining her legal position - hence wanting to know my exact move in date.  I don't think the freeholder would be concerned with my personal situation in making decisions (though I could be wrong?).

theartfullodger

Was your current landlord the original landlord?  Sounds like not.  Do you have their actual home address?

Does not have copies of tenancy agreements?  (Original or renewal?)

woeestme

Was your current landlord the original landlord?

Original landlord passed away.  I now deal with the daughter.  In terms of the original agreement, very little has changed.

Home address?  Don't see how that's relevant but yes.

I have all copies of tenancy agreements.

Yes, the situation is a complete mess and I've tried my best to summarise it.

theartfullodger

(Assuming England...)     When there is a change of landlord (including inherited) the new owner must serve notice(s) s48 and S3.  If not no rent due (S48)  and possible fines and criminal conviction (S3).

S48 needs an address in England or Wales for you to serve notices on them (repairs, move out..).  S3 needs actual home address or office.

My question about tenancy agreements was does landlord have copies of all of them , sorry I wasn't clear 

Artful: Landlord since 2000

MaryNB

woeestme said:

The leaseholder (landlord) of the flat (who's also the leaseholder for the flat below and a downstairs shop in the same building) leases off the freeholder.  We the tenants (2 flats and a business) rent off the leaseholder.

The leaseholder (landlord) has recently said to me that she's trying to extend the head lease with the freeholder and that the freeholder has asked when I moved into the property because they 'need this information'.

There's a big difference with tenancies before 28 February 1997. (Usually no s21)

Yes, I thought there was a situation like this.

TBH, I think the leaseholder(landlord) is organising to evict me and determining her legal position - hence wanting to know my exact move in date.  I don't think the freeholder would be concerned with my personal situation in making decisions (though I could be wrong?).

2014 is more relevant. That's when your current tenancy started. Although it does still impact on an S21 notice because some of the requirements (e.g. GSC, EPC) may not apply pre October 2015. 

woeestme

Yes, England.

Current landlord doesn't appear to have any paperwork which is why she's asking me for the information.

I have all the paperwork.

Grumpy_chap

woeestme said:

Yes, England.

Current landlord doesn't appear to have any paperwork which is why she's asking me for the information.

I have all the paperwork.

You are not obliged to give the LL the paperwork if they do not have it unless it works to your benefit.

Can you simply say that "you moved in 20 years ago" and that's all the answer you need to give.