Removals withholding deposit, they booked the wrong size van!

Swash

My partner called a removal company a few days ago and asked for removals for a 3 bedroom house. 

When he received the booking confirmation, it stated 1 Luton van. When I called and said we cannot do multiple trips as we're mid chain (which I thought would be common knowledge), and our belongings will not all fit in 1 van load, he became aggressive and said he knows better, has been doing removals for years and multiple trips is fine.

On his website, it literally says 1 Luton van is for an average 2 bedroom house.

We asked for a refund as what he has booked isn't suitable, and the company has refused to refund us. 

At no point did we specify 1 luton, we said an average 3 bedroom house (he said he doesn't need to come and visit to quote).

Also, he never stated the deposit was non-refundable.

What can I do?

pinkteapot

What are their T&C’s? If they’re online, post a link?

Sounds like a shonky company - I’ve always been emailed a quote and T&C’s to sign before I pay a deposit. And I think every remover I’ve had a quote from has come to look round before quoting. 

davilown

A Luton van, when packed properly, will do most 3 bed properties.

have done it 3 times so far

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Over the phone is a distance sale so unless they provided you with all the information below via durable means (on paper or by email, excluding links to the website) you aren't bound by the contract.

How did you pay the deposit? 



www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/regulation/10/made

10.—(1) Before the consumer is bound by an off-premises contract, the trader—

(a)must give the consumer the information listed in Schedule 2 in a clear and comprehensible manner, and

(b)if a right to cancel exists, must give the consumer a cancellation form as set out in part B of Schedule 3.

(2) The information and any cancellation form must be given on paper or, if the consumer agrees, on another durable medium and must be legible.

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/schedule/2/made

The information referred to in regulations 10(1) and 13(1) is (subject to the note at the end of this Schedule)—

(a)the main characteristics of the goods or services, to the extent appropriate to the medium of communication and to the goods or services;

(b)the identity of the trader (such as the trader’s trading name);

(c)the geographical address at which the trader is established and, where available, the trader’s telephone number, fax number and e-mail address, to enable the consumer to contact the trader quickly and communicate efficiently;

(d)where the trader is acting on behalf of another trader, the geographical address and identity of that other trader;

(e)if different from the address provided in accordance with paragraph (c), the geographical address of the place of business of the trader, and, where the trader acts on behalf of another trader, the geographical address of the place of business of that other trader, where the consumer can address any complaints;

(f)the total price of the goods or services inclusive of taxes, or where the nature of the goods or services is such that the price cannot reasonably be calculated in advance, the manner in which the price is to be calculated,

(g)where applicable, all additional delivery charges and any other costs or, where those charges cannot reasonably be calculated in advance, the fact that such additional charges may be payable;

(h)in the case of a contract of indeterminate duration or a contract containing a subscription, the total costs per billing period or (where such contracts are charged at a fixed rate) the total monthly costs;

(i)the cost of using the means of distance communication for the conclusion of the contract where that cost is calculated other than at the basic rate;

(j)the arrangements for payment, delivery, performance, and the time by which the trader undertakes to deliver the goods or to perform the services;

(k)where applicable, the trader’s complaint handling policy;

(l)where a right to cancel exists, the conditions, time limit and procedures for exercising that right in accordance with regulations 27 to 38;

(m)where applicable, that the consumer will have to bear the cost of returning the goods in case of cancellation and, for distance contracts, if the goods, by their nature, cannot normally be returned by post, the cost of returning the goods;

(n)that, if the consumer exercises the right to cancel after having made a request in accordance with regulation 36(1), the consumer is to be liable to pay the trader reasonable costs in accordance with regulation 36(4);

(o)where under regulation 28, 36 or 37 there is no right to cancel or the right to cancel may be lost, the information that the consumer will not benefit from a right to cancel, or the circumstances under which the consumer loses the right to cancel;

(p)in the case of a sales contract, a reminder that the trader is under a legal duty to supply goods that are in conformity with the contract;

(q)where applicable, the existence and the conditions of after-sale customer assistance, after-sales services and commercial guarantees;

(r)the existence of relevant codes of conduct, as defined in regulation 5(3)(b) of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008, and how copies of them can be obtained, where applicable;

(s)the duration of the contract, where applicable, or, if the contract is of indeterminate duration or is to be extended automatically, the conditions for terminating the contract;

(t)where applicable, the minimum duration of the consumer’s obligations under the contract;

(u)where applicable, the existence and the conditions of deposits or other financial guarantees to be paid or provided by the consumer at the request of the trader;

(v)where applicable, the functionality, including applicable technical protection measures, of digital content;

(w)where applicable, any relevant compatibility of digital content with hardware and software that the trader is aware of or can reasonably be expected to have been aware of;

(x)where applicable, the possibility of having recourse to an out-of-court complaint and redress mechanism, to which the trader is subject, and the methods for having access to it.

Adsta

Need to see the T&C's, but did the company cancel or you request the cancellation? I'm guessing the later if you asked for a refund. 

Irishpearce26

How much was the deposit? We had something similar, apparently the day before the big lorry broke down and was out of action. They send a lorry but had to do two trips which i was ok with as the house we were buying was empty and I had access to the garden to drop a number of things off.

The only issue which only came to light after I signed off was damage to some of my white goods due to packing everything in tightly due to a smaller lorry. Minor dents but still don't expect that to happen. I didn't take it further as i had signed off  before i had a chance to inspect everything. TIP don't let the removal company pressure you in signing off before you have inspected big ticket items.

Swash

pinkteapot said:

What are their T&C’s? If they’re online, post a link?

Sounds like a shonky company - I’ve always been emailed a quote and T&C’s to sign before I pay a deposit. And I think every remover I’ve had a quote from has come to look round before quoting. 

I'm reluctant to post a link atm in case they see this, given that he knows both my current address and new address. 

I can't find any t&c's on his website. We were never given anything to sign.

Swash

davilown said:

A Luton van, when packed properly, will do most 3 bed properties.

have done it 3 times so far

You must have less stuff than the average 3 bed house. Ive asked around and online and 1 luton generally isn't enough. Especially as I have garden furniture and planters that obviously cannot be stacked.

Swash

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

Over the phone is a distance sale so unless they provided you with all the information below via durable means (on paper or by email, excluding links to the website) you aren't bound by the contract.

How did you pay the deposit? 



www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/regulation/10/made

10.—(1) Before the consumer is bound by an off-premises contract, the trader—

(a)must give the consumer the information listed in Schedule 2 in a clear and comprehensible manner, and

(b)if a right to cancel exists, must give the consumer a cancellation form as set out in part B of Schedule 3.

(2) The information and any cancellation form must be given on paper or, if the consumer agrees, on another durable medium and must be legible.

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/3134/schedule/2/made

The information referred to in regulations 10(1) and 13(1) is (subject to the note at the end of this Schedule)—

(a)the main characteristics of the goods or services, to the extent appropriate to the medium of communication and to the goods or services;

(b)the identity of the trader (such as the trader’s trading name);

(c)the geographical address at which the trader is established and, where available, the trader’s telephone number, fax number and e-mail address, to enable the consumer to contact the trader quickly and communicate efficiently;

(d)where the trader is acting on behalf of another trader, the geographical address and identity of that other trader;

(e)if different from the address provided in accordance with paragraph (c), the geographical address of the place of business of the trader, and, where the trader acts on behalf of another trader, the geographical address of the place of business of that other trader, where the consumer can address any complaints;

(f)the total price of the goods or services inclusive of taxes, or where the nature of the goods or services is such that the price cannot reasonably be calculated in advance, the manner in which the price is to be calculated,

(g)where applicable, all additional delivery charges and any other costs or, where those charges cannot reasonably be calculated in advance, the fact that such additional charges may be payable;

(h)in the case of a contract of indeterminate duration or a contract containing a subscription, the total costs per billing period or (where such contracts are charged at a fixed rate) the total monthly costs;

(i)the cost of using the means of distance communication for the conclusion of the contract where that cost is calculated other than at the basic rate;

(j)the arrangements for payment, delivery, performance, and the time by which the trader undertakes to deliver the goods or to perform the services;

(k)where applicable, the trader’s complaint handling policy;

(l)where a right to cancel exists, the conditions, time limit and procedures for exercising that right in accordance with regulations 27 to 38;

(m)where applicable, that the consumer will have to bear the cost of returning the goods in case of cancellation and, for distance contracts, if the goods, by their nature, cannot normally be returned by post, the cost of returning the goods;

(n)that, if the consumer exercises the right to cancel after having made a request in accordance with regulation 36(1), the consumer is to be liable to pay the trader reasonable costs in accordance with regulation 36(4);

(o)where under regulation 28, 36 or 37 there is no right to cancel or the right to cancel may be lost, the information that the consumer will not benefit from a right to cancel, or the circumstances under which the consumer loses the right to cancel;

(p)in the case of a sales contract, a reminder that the trader is under a legal duty to supply goods that are in conformity with the contract;

(q)where applicable, the existence and the conditions of after-sale customer assistance, after-sales services and commercial guarantees;

(r)the existence of relevant codes of conduct, as defined in regulation 5(3)(b) of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008, and how copies of them can be obtained, where applicable;

(s)the duration of the contract, where applicable, or, if the contract is of indeterminate duration or is to be extended automatically, the conditions for terminating the contract;

(t)where applicable, the minimum duration of the consumer’s obligations under the contract;

(u)where applicable, the existence and the conditions of deposits or other financial guarantees to be paid or provided by the consumer at the request of the trader;

(v)where applicable, the functionality, including applicable technical protection measures, of digital content;

(w)where applicable, any relevant compatibility of digital content with hardware and software that the trader is aware of or can reasonably be expected to have been aware of;

(x)where applicable, the possibility of having recourse to an out-of-court complaint and redress mechanism, to which the trader is subject, and the methods for having access to it.

This was really helpful, thank you! We paid the deposit over the phone with a debit card. 

Swash

Adsta said:

Need to see the T&C's, but did the company cancel or you request the cancellation? I'm guessing the later if you asked for a refund. 

Well originally we just called to request the extra van but once he got aggressive and argumentative, my partner said we want our deposit back as the company wouldn't give us the extra van. 

We then received an email saying 'booking cancelled as requested'.

Swash

Irishpearce26 said:

How much was the deposit? We had something similar, apparently the day before the big lorry broke down and was out of action. They send a lorry but had to do two trips which i was ok with as the house we were buying was empty and I had access to the garden to drop a number of things off.

The only issue which only came to light after I signed off was damage to some of my white goods due to packing everything in tightly due to a smaller lorry. Minor dents but still don't expect that to happen. I didn't take it further as i had signed off  before i had a chance to inspect everything. TIP don't let the removal company pressure you in signing off before you have inspected big ticket items.

Thanks for the tip! The deposit was £200. His website says deposit is 10% but £200 is more like 33%.