neighbour spray painted his fence and our house too !!!

fruitpie

Hi all, we have a drama - any help and advise would be appreciated.

The neighbour across the way from me, spray painted his 50ft long fence in the high winds. It has, for the want of a better word, splatered, the car, garage door, upstairs and down stairs white upvc windows and frames, and the side elevation to the conservatory at the back !

Its wicks creosote subsitute, and will not wash off.

Can we make a claim through his insurance,? he says he has contacted his insurance and they are sending someone out to look at the damage to my house and also my next door neighbours house, that also now has brown freckles but that was a week ago now and no visit.

vikingaero

Oh dear fruitpie!

I would ask your neighbour for details of his house insurer. Take pictures of the damage in daylight. Given that it's a non-urgent claim (no property damage, leaks, flood, uninhabitable etc) the insurer may take a couple of weeks to send someone round.

Do not under any circumstances be bullied into claiming off your own household policy or car policy. Household insurance normally does not have the right of abrogation (the insurer does not claim off the guilty party unless it's $$$$) and a claim on your own policy will register as a claim for years. If you have legal expenses cover then consider giving them a call.

Basically your neighbours insurer should hopefully pay up under the Public Liability section of the policy........ assuming your neighbour actually has a policy.

fruitpie

Do not under any circumstances be bullied into claiming off your own household policy or car policy. Household insurance normally does not have the right of abrogation (the insurer does not claim off the guilty party unless it's $$$$) and a claim on your own policy will register as a claim for years. If you have legal expenses cover then consider giving them a call.

Thank you so much for your pompt reply vikingaero .. could you just explain again about "abrogation" thank you..

paintpot

Hi

Sorry, can't really advise on the insurance side but just to say my neighbours did the same thing, it didn't go on my car thank goodness but the whole of the back of the house was sprayed in green paint including white UPVC windows, patio doors, back door and sophet boards. I spent almost an entire day with every cleaning product under the sun and found brillo pads worked a treat to get it off! I don't think that would work on your car though I was seriously using every expletive under the sun by the end of it but they are back to being white again - only my arms fell off! Good luck!

colnkits

No advice re the insurance...but paint thinners should get it off your UPVC.

Hope you get it resolved

Kits

fruitpie

Thanks for that Paintpot - I like your name very appropriate.:j

I have been advised by the manufacturer of the stuff he sprayed that only a Solvent will remove the stains and that they recommend that Solvents are not used, as on UPVC it dulls the shine and makes the plastic brittle. More importantly this product should only be applied by brush or dip method, it should not be sprayed. God knows what will happen about the spots on the car. The splats on the white upvc windows appear to have sunk into the plastic and have leached. Well done to you with your cleaning, I hope your arms have recoverd.

vikingaero

fruitpie wrote: »

Thank you so much for your pompt reply vikingaero .. could you just explain again about "abrogation" thank you..

When you make a claim under your car insurance policy, you have the car repaired and pay the excess and then recover the excess from the third party at fault. Once you reclaim this excess then this proves that you were not at fault and your insurer recovers the cost of repairing your car from the third partys insurers. You are left with a non-fault claim on your records.

Home/household insurance is different. When you claim your insurer will pay out irrespective of fault of a third party. That is that they generally will not recover the cost of the damage from the third party unless the amounts are very high. This is where no right of automatic abrogation exists - that is, your insurer cannot or will not claim back it's costs off a third party. So if you claim under your own policy you will have a "claim" on your records.

paintpot

Fruitpie, I laugh about it now but I didn't at the time I assure you. And my OH got it in the neck cos the neighbour, unbeknown to me, came round to apologise cos they realised what they had done and OH said "no bother I'll wipe it off" and DIDN'T, then b***ered off on a business trip and left it to me to sort out having finally told me! :eek: I tried all sorts of products, exactly for the reason you mention cos some products can be damaging to UPVC so it was Cif and a brillo or should I say bottles of Cif and packets of brillos Maybe you are wiser going down the insurance route TBH based on the advice you have had and as it's your car aswell that puts a different spin on things.

Why are people so stupid ? In fact double ! I still have no arms, I type with my nose :rotfl: :rotfl:

mattymoo

vikingaero wrote: »

Home/household insurance is different. When you claim your insurer will pay out irrespective of fault of a third party. That is that they generally will not recover the cost of the damage from the third party unless the amounts are very high. This is where no right of automatic abrogation exists - that is, your insurer cannot or will not claim back it's costs off a third party. So if you claim under your own policy you will have a "claim" on your records.

Are you sure about this vikingaero. I am not familiar with the term "abrogation" but wonder if you mean "subrogation", the insurers ability to pursue claims in the policyholders name to effect a recovery. That certainly does exist on household policies and is a basic principle of all insurance policies AFAIK.

fruitpie

Thanks Mattymoo for your input, but it all sounds as clear as mud !!! what do you think about this situation I am in ? - cheers...

mattymoo

You certainly have a clear cut case in the "Tort of Negligence" against the neighbour and any claim against him would succeed.

To help your case, take photos (as someone else has suggested) and if you can, find a copy weather report for the day in question. If you have the papers in a recycling pile, that would help. If not, don't worry as insurers can access historical weather records.

I have checked abrogation / subrogation on Wikipedia and looking at those, I am certain I am correct. Here is what Wikipedia says about Subrogation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subrogation

Put simply, if your insurer pays out for damage to your property, they can assume the same legal rights you have, and pursue legal action in your name. They would then use this to recover their outlay from the neighbour and his insurance company.

It would be worth checking your insurance policy to see if you have household legal expenses cover. If not, you might have it through union membership or a fee paying bank account.

The legal cover would pay for the cost of a solicitor to pursue your claim.

The person who is coming to see you will be a loss adjuster employed by your neighbours insurer. He will charge them a fee and to justify this, will attempt to adjust your claim downwards. He / she will expect to see two or three quotes for the work or may suggest a firm with experience in this area. They will then approve the cheapest so be happy in your own mind that the work is of an acceptable standard before signing off on it.

The car will be the trickiest thing. They need a sound surface to spray and if the creosote is attacking the paint / metal then this will need to be dealt with, possibly via panel replacement. If you are looking at a total respray with panels, the costs will easily reach £2-3k and depending on the age / type of car, might make it beyond economic repair.