keep being subject to card fraud

[Deleted User]

I have had two instances of card fraud over the past six weeks. On the first occasion two payments of around £50 each were made on my debit card. RBS stopped these payments with their automatic fraud prevention system and sent me a new card. The payments were to Game and a drug website. I was unsure of how the card details had been stolen, and to play it safe had all my debit and credit cards marked as stolen and re-issued.

Fast forward six weeks and again I have had fraud on one of my cards, this time on an HSBC credit card. This card is brand new and has only been used four times since the card was issued. The card was only used at legit companies. This time however the fraud was for a much higher amount of some £1300. The payment is to an electrical retailer. This payment was not stopped by anyone and I only noticed a few hours before it cleared. I called HSBC to report this transaction as fraud and they blocked the card and issued a new one, and raised a payment dispute. When I called the bank the payment was still pending but has since cleared. The payment was via PayPal (I don't have an account but the company uses PP as a payment method) I have contacted the company also but never received a response.

I am at a loss of how this fraud is occurring as I am very careful about where I use the cards. I can rule out anyone in my household and at the time this payment was made I was at work and had the card with me. The bank estaminet online says that the pin was not entered when the payment was made. I am worried to use any card and they are now all blocked via the apps. I am getting worried now as £1300 is a lot of money to have to cover and I still have no refund from the bank. I can't see how these people are getting my card details, the card never leaves me, I only used it four times in three different places. Both cards that have been frauded were used at the same place once. But this is not conclusive as I cannot remember if the payments were contact or chip and pin. 

I have reported the fraud to the police fraud website. Are HSBC likely to offer a refund? is there anything I else I can do?

Eyeful

Is it a credit or debit card?

Have you used the card on your computer or mobile. If yes, run a security scan on both. 

When you blocked your old cards got new ones, did you tell the bank not to use "automated payment updating". As I   understand it, banks use this method to automatically inform PayPal, Google Pay, Amazon, of your new card details, without you getting involved.

Perhaps you should look into  "automated payment updating".

What was the "same place" both were used at .

Have you stored the card number on your mobile. Make sure bluetooth is off.

[Deleted User]

Eyeful said:

Is it a credit or debit card?

Have you used the card on your computer or mobile. If yes, run a security scan on both. 

When you blocked your old cards got new ones, did you tell the bank not to use "automated payment updating". As I   understand it, banks use this method to automatically inform PayPal, Google Pay, Amazon, of your new card details, without you getting involved.

Perhaps you should look into  "automated payment updating".

What was the "same place" both were used at .

Have you stored the card number on your mobile. Make sure bluetooth is off.

Both, first card was debit, this new fraud was on the credit card.

Yes they do have that automated payment, and I have tried to ask the bank to turn it off but they don't seem to be able to.

The same place was my work canteen. 

The card is not stored on my mobile, apart from Appel pay. I don't use wifi or blue tooth 90% of the time.

Thanks

brianposter

Does the electrical retailer have a branch near you ?

[Deleted User]

brianposter said:

Does the electrical retailer have a branch near you ?

As far as I can tell it is just a website but seems to be a large company. It's based up north whereas I am in the south.

colsten

I would have suggested change bank but as it also happened on a credit card from an entirely different provider, that would most likely not help.

If you have been using your cards for online purchases, you might have some malware on the device you use. A scan should identify it.

Other than that, you would have to re-visit the possibility that it is somebody in your household who made the payments.

[Deleted User]

colsten said:

I would have suggested change bank but as it also happened on a credit card from an entirely different provider, that would most likely not help.

If you have been using your cards for online purchases, you might have some malware on the device you use. A scan should identify it.

Other than that, you would have to re-visit the possibility that it is somebody in your household who made the payments.

I have decided to report all my cards as stolen again and get them re-issued again. Going forward I will not be using any card online, instead I have discovered Revolut, the the virtual cards feature. Basically you can create multiple cards on their account. So each regular payment I make online will only be linked to one card, in addition these cards can be added to Apple Pay. So my plan is to just use these cards in future and use Apple Pay for any purchases on the real cards. I will never use a real card directly again if I can help it. Only via Apple Pay. Even the Revolut top up can be done via Apple Pay. So in theory I will never need to disclose a real card again. I will top it up as and when required knowing they don't yet have FSCS protection. 

I actually reinstalled my PC before when I had the previous fraud and reset my phone as a precaution. 

I have not given up on finding the fraud. I will also create a virtual card and add it to Apple Pay and with this card I will only use it in my work canteen. If the fraud is there, then it will re-occur and I will catch them without question. Although thinking about it I may need to order a physical card for this purpose as the fraud must have been via physical card rather than Apple Pay. I just hope HSBC refund me that's my only real concern now. I really would like to talk to my work place to raise the possibility of fraud in the canteen and ask them to check the payment equipment but feel I need a bit more evidence. 

I only live with a few people and I do not consider it a possibly given that the cards never leave me. In addition I had the card with me at the time of the payment. 

brianposter

[Deleted User] said:

brianposter said:

Does the electrical retailer have a branch near you ?

As far as I can tell it is just a website but seems to be a large company. It's based up north whereas I am in the south.

Pity. Still might be worth a phone call to see if they will tell you more about the order.

[Deleted User]

brianposter said:

[Deleted User] said:

brianposter said:

Does the electrical retailer have a branch near you ?

As far as I can tell it is just a website but seems to be a large company. It's based up north whereas I am in the south.

Pity. Still might be worth a phone call to see if they will tell you more about the order.

I have emailed I am still hoping to get a response early next week as I emailed them on Friday afternoon. I might call otherwise. Wonder if they will tell me anything seeing as I know nothing about the order?

AnotherJoe

[Deleted User] said:

Eyeful said:

Is it a credit or debit card?

Have you used the card on your computer or mobile. If yes, run a security scan on both. 

When you blocked your old cards got new ones, did you tell the bank not to use "automated payment updating". As I   understand it, banks use this method to automatically inform PayPal, Google Pay, Amazon, of your new card details, without you getting involved.

Perhaps you should look into  "automated payment updating".

What was the "same place" both were used at .

Have you stored the card number on your mobile. Make sure bluetooth is off.

Both, first card was debit, this new fraud was on the credit card.

Yes they do have that automated payment, and I have tried to ask the bank to turn it off but they don't seem to be able to.

The same place was my work canteen. 

The card is not stored on my mobile, apart from Apple pay. I don't use wifi or blue tooth 90% of the time.

Thanks

Are you a woman?

Do you leave your purse by your desk sometimes?

If so, seems fairly obvious a co worker is taking your card.

If a man, is your wallet in your jacket and you leave that on the back of your chair?

No one is hacking your PC or phone to get card details to buy a sandwich in your work canteen.

[Deleted User]

AnotherJoe said:

[Deleted User] said:

Eyeful said:

Is it a credit or debit card?

Have you used the card on your computer or mobile. If yes, run a security scan on both. 

When you blocked your old cards got new ones, did you tell the bank not to use "automated payment updating". As I   understand it, banks use this method to automatically inform PayPal, Google Pay, Amazon, of your new card details, without you getting involved.

Perhaps you should look into  "automated payment updating".

What was the "same place" both were used at .

Have you stored the card number on your mobile. Make sure bluetooth is off.

Both, first card was debit, this new fraud was on the credit card.

Yes they do have that automated payment, and I have tried to ask the bank to turn it off but they don't seem to be able to.

The same place was my work canteen. 

The card is not stored on my mobile, apart from Apple pay. I don't use wifi or blue tooth 90% of the time.

Thanks

Are you a woman?

Do you leave your purse by your desk sometimes?

If so, seems fairly obvious a co worker is taking your card.

If a man, is your wallet in your jacket and you leave that on the back of your chair?

No one is hacking your PC or phone to get card details to buy a sandwich in your work canteen.

I'm a man but yes in theory a wallet could be taken out of my jacket pocket when I am away from the desk, but in covid times it would be very obvious and risky. But a possibility.

They bought something which was over £1300, not a sandwich. But I suspect the work canteen is where the card details could have been copied.