Drawdown

TVAS

OMG
1) Always have month 12 payments March early in the month because insurance companies cannot cope with the end of the tax year.

2) I worked on a contract paying pension income from all contracts: Drawdown, UFPLS, Small Pots, S32. When we messed up such as a request for a payment in the previous tax year to be paid in the current tax year, we would get the payment from the customer, recall the RTI (Real Time Information) to HMRC, make the payment in the previous tax year. Apologise and offer compensation.   

3) Because salaries have reduced over several decades, the calibre of staff who do these jobs are not as good as they used to be. When I worked for a company in the 90s we paid TFC in 48 hours and we always did it. There is usually overtime going towards the end of the tax year and insurance companies pay time and a half weekdays and double time at weekends. You would be surprised the amount of young people, with no children, saving for a deposit yet refuse to work extra hours. So the insurance company is extremely busy and there are not enough staff to make the payments on time. Also the staff should have logged this case as a complaint because you have expressed dissatisfaction so complain to them then Complain to FOS.

john-306

TVAS said:

OMG
1) Always have month 12 payments March early in the month because insurance companies cannot cope with the end of the tax year.

2) I worked on a contract paying pension income from all contracts: Drawdown, UFPLS, Small Pots, S32. When we messed up such as a request for a payment in the previous tax year to be paid in the current tax year, we would get the payment from the customer, recall the RTI (Real Time Information) to HMRC, make the payment in the previous tax year. Apologise and offer compensation.   

3) Because salaries have reduced over several decades, the calibre of staff who do these jobs are not as good as they used to be. When I worked for a company in the 90s we paid TFC in 48 hours and we always did it. There is usually overtime going towards the end of the tax year and insurance companies pay time and a half weekdays and double time at weekends. You would be surprised the amount of young people, with no children, saving for a deposit yet refuse to work extra hours. So the insurance company is extremely busy and there are not enough staff to make the payments on time. Also the staff should have logged this case as a complaint because you have expressed dissatisfaction so complain to them then Complain to FOS.

Thank you for reply.
She applied for the payment 5th of March, thinking that would be plenty of time to sort it.
She has now replied to email stating dissatisfaction at outcome and she will be taking things further if that's their final decision.
She's giving it a few days for reply before getting ombudsman involved.

Thrugelmir

john-306 said:

TVAS said:

OMG
1) Always have month 12 payments March early in the month because insurance companies cannot cope with the end of the tax year.

2) I worked on a contract paying pension income from all contracts: Drawdown, UFPLS, Small Pots, S32. When we messed up such as a request for a payment in the previous tax year to be paid in the current tax year, we would get the payment from the customer, recall the RTI (Real Time Information) to HMRC, make the payment in the previous tax year. Apologise and offer compensation.   

3) Because salaries have reduced over several decades, the calibre of staff who do these jobs are not as good as they used to be. When I worked for a company in the 90s we paid TFC in 48 hours and we always did it. There is usually overtime going towards the end of the tax year and insurance companies pay time and a half weekdays and double time at weekends. You would be surprised the amount of young people, with no children, saving for a deposit yet refuse to work extra hours. So the insurance company is extremely busy and there are not enough staff to make the payments on time. Also the staff should have logged this case as a complaint because you have expressed dissatisfaction so complain to them then Complain to FOS.

Thank you for reply.
She applied for the payment 5th of March, thinking that would be plenty of time to sort it.
She has now replied to email stating dissatisfaction at outcome and she will be taking things further if that's their final decision.
She's giving it a few days for reply before getting ombudsman involved.

It's missed their payroll run obviously. 5th March was a Friday. So was cutting it fine to meet cut-off to apply. At what is always the busiest time of the year.  The ombudsman cannot change the course of events unfortunately. 

john-306

5th March gave then a full month to organise the payment.
Reading on the ombudsman site, they say they can put you in a financial position you would have been without them making a mistake/error (which they admitted in an email).
She has now lost out on tax free income of £5.6k ish but taking that now would give a tax liability for this tax year of £1100 ish.
So I'm sure it she would have a good chance of a positive result.

dunstonh

john-306 said:

5th March gave then a full month to organise the payment.
Reading on the ombudsman site, they say they can put you in a financial position you would have been without them making a mistake/error (which they admitted in an email).
She has now lost out on tax free income of £5.6k ish but taking that now would give a tax liability for this tax year of £1100 ish.
So I'm sure it she would have a good chance of a positive result.

Getting the tax paid is a potential outcome.   However, there is also the possibility that they may say that the deadline was tight and you didn't give enough room for delays and leaving it so late was a risk.   I have seen the FOS say that before in their publications. 

cfw1994

dunstonh said:

john-306 said:

5th March gave then a full month to organise the payment.
Reading on the ombudsman site, they say they can put you in a financial position you would have been without them making a mistake/error (which they admitted in an email).
She has now lost out on tax free income of £5.6k ish but taking that now would give a tax liability for this tax year of £1100 ish.
So I'm sure it she would have a good chance of a positive result.

Getting the tax paid is a potential outcome.   However, there is also the possibility that they may say that the deadline was tight and you didn't give enough room for delays and leaving it so late was a risk.   I have seen the FOS say that before in their publications. 

A month is considered not long enough?  
FOS need to sharpen their teeth if they still believe that in this day & age!!

george4064

cfw1994 said:

dunstonh said:

john-306 said:

5th March gave then a full month to organise the payment.
Reading on the ombudsman site, they say they can put you in a financial position you would have been without them making a mistake/error (which they admitted in an email).
She has now lost out on tax free income of £5.6k ish but taking that now would give a tax liability for this tax year of £1100 ish.
So I'm sure it she would have a good chance of a positive result.

Getting the tax paid is a potential outcome.   However, there is also the possibility that they may say that the deadline was tight and you didn't give enough room for delays and leaving it so late was a risk.   I have seen the FOS say that before in their publications. 

A month is considered not long enough?  
FOS need to sharpen their teeth if they still believe that in this day & age!!

I think dunstonh is referring to cutting it fine with LVs deadline whereby customers can make changes before the next payroll in the system.

Just like with a normal employee on payroll, there’s usually a deadline (around 1 month) date before payday for any changes to take effect. Same process I imagine would apply to a drawdown platform where pensioners are drawing down from their pots.

Thrugelmir

john-306 said:

5th March gave then a full month to organise the payment.

Not how the real world works. There'll be a structure and routine to payment runs. Which are run in batches not when one individual requests a drawdown. Did she bother to ask them first? 

john-306

Thrugelmir said:

john-306 said:

5th March gave then a full month to organise the payment.

Not how the real world works. There'll be a structure and routine to payment runs. Which are run in batches not when one individual requests a drawdown. Did she bother to ask them first? 

Oh yes as I said in a previous post, they stated on 2 different phone calls it would be in her account the 1st or 2nd of April. 
It wasn't, because of their error which they agreed it was in their later email.

TVAS

You refer the case to FOS after you have received the Final Decision letter from the firm. 

If FOS think a month is not sufficient time to give a provider notice for a payment in month 12 March which is probably one of the busiest months of the tax year they have not worked in pension payment admin.

I have worked for several providers and they gear up to the end of tax year because they know it will busy.

They also know that due to the changes in 2015 and how HMRC treat each payment for tax that it makes sense to take a payment in month 12 rather than month 1 especially so as a) no tax if under the personal allowance and b) if over the personal allowance a tax rebate will be paid at the start of the next tax year.

You need to make these arguments if you go to FOS and also to the provider. You have to realise because FOS is based in London and the money they offer the complaint handlers is rubbish, your case will be reviewed by a kid who still lives at home whose only financial product is a student loan. They don't hire people who have actually worked in the pensions payment department i.e. the real world. Good luck.