Consumer Rights Act - England (6 years)

dwaynet

Hi MoneySavingExperts users,

Hope you can help and thanks for reading my message.

I purchased an Apple MacBook Pro at £1999 from John Lewis online back in December 2016 and it came with a 3 year warranty with them and has of course now expired in December 2019.

The product itself as had very little use, due to me mainly using my iPad, last month I noticed something didn’t look quite right with the display and it turns out it’s a known problem with MacBooks and it’s the antiglare coating on the display peeling off, no fault of my own what so ever.

I rang John Lewis up and spoken to 2 different advisors and I mentioned to both of them the consumer rights act, they told me to get a diagnosis report for free from an official Apple store which I did yesterday from the Arndale centre in Manchester and to send them a copy once done and they would either carry out a repair or refund me back for the MacBook.

I spoken to a few advisors today at John Lewis as I have now provided them with the diagnosis report that they wanted me to get. They have basically said they will not be carrying out this repair or refund as they said for this problem to come under the consumer rights act the MacBook has had to have been in for at least one repair previously.

Now from what I have told you are they correct or am I being fobbed off?

Kind Regards,

Dwayne 

davidmcn

The latter.

powerful_Rogue

dwaynet said:

Hi MoneySavingExperts users,

Hope you can help and thanks for reading my message.

I purchased an Apple MacBook Pro at £1999 from John Lewis online back in December 2016 and it came with a 3 year warranty with them and has of course now expired in December 2019.

The product itself as had very little use, due to me mainly using my iPad, last month I noticed something didn’t look quite right with the display and it turns out it’s a known problem with MacBooks and it’s the antiglare coating on the display peeling off, no fault of my own what so ever.

I rang John Lewis up and spoken to 2 different advisors and I mentioned to both of them the consumer rights act, they told me to get a diagnosis report for free from an official Apple store which I did yesterday from the Arndale centre in Manchester and to send them a copy once done and they would either carry out a repair or refund me back for the MacBook.

I spoken to a few advisors today at John Lewis as I have now provided them with the diagnosis report that they wanted me to get. They have basically said they will not be carrying out this repair or refund as they said for this problem to come under the consumer rights act the MacBook has had to have been in for at least one repair previously.

Now from what I have told you are they correct or am I being fobbed off?

Kind Regards,

Dwayne 

Just checking there hasn't been some miscommunication.

If they had repaired it once, and the same fault returned, you could reject it for a refund. Did you specfically ask for a refund? Maybe this is what they meant.

dwaynet

davidmcn said:

The latter.

Thanks for replying back to my post.

David713

dwaynet said:

Hi MoneySavingExperts users,

they told me to get a diagnosis report for free from an official Apple store which I did yesterday from the Arndale centre in Manchester and to send them a copy once done and they would either carry out a repair or refund me back for the MacBook.

What exactly did the report state regarding the cause of the anti-glare coating coming off?
For it to be of any use in enforcing your CRA rights, it would need to state that the problem is due to a manufacturing defect as without this, the problem could have arisen because of something that you did (such as cleaning the screen with the wrong products).

If the report is satisfactory and accepted by JL, they may well offer you a refund (which can be a partial one to cover the 4+ years you have had use of the computer) and I doubt if this would be too much as in reality, how much is a 4 1/4 year old MacBook worth?

dwaynet

powerful_Rogue said:

dwaynet said:

Hi MoneySavingExperts users,

Hope you can help and thanks for reading my message.

I purchased an Apple MacBook Pro at £1999 from John Lewis online back in December 2016 and it came with a 3 year warranty with them and has of course now expired in December 2019.

The product itself as had very little use, due to me mainly using my iPad, last month I noticed something didn’t look quite right with the display and it turns out it’s a known problem with MacBooks and it’s the antiglare coating on the display peeling off, no fault of my own what so ever.

I rang John Lewis up and spoken to 2 different advisors and I mentioned to both of them the consumer rights act, they told me to get a diagnosis report for free from an official Apple store which I did yesterday from the Arndale centre in Manchester and to send them a copy once done and they would either carry out a repair or refund me back for the MacBook.

I spoken to a few advisors today at John Lewis as I have now provided them with the diagnosis report that they wanted me to get. They have basically said they will not be carrying out this repair or refund as they said for this problem to come under the consumer rights act the MacBook has had to have been in for at least one repair previously.

Now from what I have told you are they correct or am I being fobbed off?

Kind Regards,

Dwayne 

Just checking there hasn't been some miscommunication.

If they had repaired it once, and the same fault returned, you could reject it for a refund. Did you specfically ask for a refund? Maybe this is what they meant.

Thanks for replying back to my post.

Just to confirm, this MacBook has never had a fault or been repaired previously.
John Lewis told me once I get the diagnosis report from Apple, then they would either repair it or refund me as sometimes repairing something can cost more than what was originally paid for it.

m0bov

How did you pay for the item?

Manxman_in_exile

dwaynet said:

powerful_Rogue said:

dwaynet said:

Hi MoneySavingExperts users,

Hope you can help and thanks for reading my message.

I purchased an Apple MacBook Pro at £1999 from John Lewis online back in December 2016 and it came with a 3 year warranty with them and has of course now expired in December 2019.

The product itself as had very little use, due to me mainly using my iPad, last month I noticed something didn’t look quite right with the display and it turns out it’s a known problem with MacBooks and it’s the antiglare coating on the display peeling off, no fault of my own what so ever.

I rang John Lewis up and spoken to 2 different advisors and I mentioned to both of them the consumer rights act, they told me to get a diagnosis report for free from an official Apple store which I did yesterday from the Arndale centre in Manchester and to send them a copy once done and they would either carry out a repair or refund me back for the MacBook.

I spoken to a few advisors today at John Lewis as I have now provided them with the diagnosis report that they wanted me to get. They have basically said they will not be carrying out this repair or refund as they said for this problem to come under the consumer rights act the MacBook has had to have been in for at least one repair previously.

Now from what I have told you are they correct or am I being fobbed off?

Kind Regards,

Dwayne 

Just checking there hasn't been some miscommunication.

If they had repaired it once, and the same fault returned, you could reject it for a refund. Did you specfically ask for a refund? Maybe this is what they meant.

Thanks for replying back to my post.

Just to confirm, this MacBook has never had a fault or been repaired previously.
John Lewis told me once I get the diagnosis report from Apple, then they would either repair it or refund me as sometimes repairing something can cost more than what was originally paid for it.

Are you certain that is what they said?  Is it possible they said that depending on what the report said that they might repair or refund?  If you think about it, there would be little point in asking you to get a report if what it said would make no difference to what they would do, would it?

They only need to repair or refund if the Apple report shows that the fault was inherent (ie caused by sub-quality materials or components or faulty manufacturing process) at the time you bought it.  After four and a half years that might be difficult to establish.  And any refund can be reduced to reflect the four and a half years use you have had of it.

Does Apple's report show that they used sub-standard materials or manufacturing process?  If it doesn't, JL don't need to do anything...

EDIT:  You may be confused because you've put "6 Years" in the title of your thread as if it is relevant - it almost certainly isn't.  Many people think the law says that products must last for a minimum of 6 years - it doesn't.  What the law says is you can't make a claim after 6 years - which does not mean that products must last for 6 years.

dwaynet

A email a received from a John Lewis advisor.

As discussed, under Section 24 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015, it does stipulate under clause 136 about when the final right to reject or the right to a price reduction can be applied. Please see this below;

 

The section provides that, if repair or replacement was impossible or if the consumer’s goods continue to be substandard after the consumer has either:

 

•already undergone one repair or replacement of the goods by the trader; or

•sought a repair or replacement but this was not carried out within a reasonable time or without significant inconvenient to the consumer,

 

the consumer may either:

 

•keep the goods and insist on a reduction in the price; or

•reject the goods and obtain a refund which may, in some circumstances, be subject to a deduction to take account of any use the consumer has had of the goods.

We have already established that the item has not been repaired previously nor has it been replaced previously and therefore this is why the Consumer Rights Act claim has been rejected.

 

In addition, I had advised that Section 23, titled Right to repair or replacement does not apply in this instance as that applies when the item is within the guarantee period. The only time in which this would be applied outside of the guarantee period is if there is a product recall from Apple as the manufacturer.

 

As per Apple's website linked below, there is no recall program, or service program for your MacBook which would render Section 23 non-applicable in this instance.

 

 

Understandably, this is not what you were expecting but I am pleased that during our conversation we came to an agreement to disagree and I do understand that you will be taking this further.

 

If you have any further questions or queries, then please do not hesitate to get in contact with us.

-

Bare in mind, it states in section 23 the following which I thought I would add in.

Section 23 (2)(b)bear any necessary costs incurred in doing so (including in particular the cost of any labour, materials or postage).

John Lewis also told me to go to Apple and it shouldn't be their issue to fix, until I told them that they are the supplier.

Manxman_in_exile

You haven't answered the question:  Does the report from apple say the fault was inherent* when the item was purchased by you?

After 6 months from purchase the onus is on the consumer to prove that the fault was inherent when purchased.  This can be done in your case by producing apple's report saying so.

So what does the Apple report say is the cause of the item in question not working properly?

*eg Apple used faulty or sub-standard quality or otherwise unsuitable components or materials, or Apple's manufacturing process was faulty.

jon81uk

If the report from Apple states it is a manufacturing defect then John Lewis should arrange the repair.
They are right that they should offer one repair before considering you rejecting the goods, but they need to actually offer that repair, if they fault is a manufacturing defect.