CCj without knowledge parking eye

rosemorton95

Hi, I have read the newbies thread and tried to follow all advice before posting. Thanks for the all help already available. I had done so much reading my head feels like it will explode given I haven't slept since I found out about a ccj by chance on a credit site at the weekend that was a result of my driving licence being up to date by not v5c. I have had about 14 addresses in 15 years and overlooked it this time. Never had any speeding tickets or fines etc so I have been pretty inconsolable. I have a few questions after reading about some people losing their case  and that relate to my case (which I have read many times is not unique) but I want to know my chances. I will try to be concise and number all questions.

Timeline: Parking offence in xxxx2019, I have sent PE a SAR as shown on the Newbies to find out what the original amount was and how long I was there. I park there all the time and have proof I always pay on the app usually but not sure what happened here, haven't admitted to driving but I was the only person insured at the time. Also sent DVLA a SAR.
Spoke to courts and PE started proceedings without ever hearing from me xxxx2019, only 3 months later. Got the particulars but until they reply to SAR don't know the original or the time spent. 1) How can it be that the judgement order states £197 and when I ring the automated service it says I owe £257, didn't know it could go up after judgement?
Claim was served xxxx2019 to an old address and I have proof that my tenancy finished a few months before the offence so it is impossible that I would have seen papers.
However the problem area is proving that service was defective when my v5c was out of date. Long story short moved out and in with a friend due to a break up, this was a temporary address with no tenancy no payments, no bills, no council tax. I do have proof that I updated my driving licence with DVLA to avoid a potential fine  with temporary address after I moved out and before the offence so at the time off the offence and claim they had a current address and the TV licence was also up to date before the offence as I know you face a fine. I have a bill from water company showing that I gave them my new  forwarding address also before the offence. I notified council tax of my leave so I have SAR them also to try to prove this as I gave them " a forwarding address" but wasn't paying council tax/water at the time of the offence or on the electoral roll this was just upon closing my old accounts.  
2) Did not update bank details, council tax, electoral roll, phone bill until 1 month after the claim issued and 1 month before court proceedings when I got a permanent address, does this still count as there to be found and them not making reasonable attempt or is it too close to the date for PE to keep looking? (appreciate my stupidity, but all my bills are online and never crossed my mind someone was looking for me, foolishly though as long as licence was up to date v5c was as only had a licence for under 2 years)
3) In my case it seems to have moved quickly given they had no contact timeline from offence to claim is 3 months and claim to judgement date 2 months over a small amount of money £197 Is inflated?

4)I am worried with my temporary address and somethings updated somethings not that I will not stand a chance, but it is 100% provable that I never saw the papers but technically is driving licence up to date and tv licence irrelevant if current v5c  (old address) is the address they used?

5)I went ahead and prepared draft order and WS using the examples, mostly plagiarised is that an issue, is it allowed or not?  Haven't prepared defence yet because I wanted to submit the N244 ASAP to be prompt currently on 2 working days since finding out of CCJ at weekend. I was going to just submit all this first and prepare defence afterward, as I don't yet know why I didn't pay or how long I was there, original charge etc. Tried to remove irrelevant bits but not sure it is strong enough.

DRAFT ORDER
IN THE COUNTY COURT AT:xxxxxxxxx 
CLAIM No: xxxxxxxxx
BETWEEN:
PARKING EYE LIMITED (Claimant)
-- and --
xxxxxxxxxxxxDefendant)
______________________________________________
DRAFT ORDER
______________________________________________

IT IS ORDERED THAT:

1. The default judgment dated on xxxxxxxx 2020 be set aside.


2. Costs to be reserved.


3. Unless the Claimant serves a copy of the claim form on the Defendant by 4pm on XX/XX/21 paragraph 2 shall cease to have effect and the Claimant shall pay the Defendant's costs summarily assessed at £255 and the claim shall be struck out.


4. If the Claimant serves the claim form as directed in paragraph 3 the Defendant shall file and serve a defence by 4pm following 14 days on XX/XX/21.


5. Should the Claimant discontinue the Claim after the CCJ is set aside, paragraph 2 shall cease to have effect and the Claimant shall pay the Defendant's costs summarily assessed at £255.


6. All enforcement be put on hold pending the outcome of the application.

 

WITNESS STATEMENT
IN THE COUNTY COURT AT: xxxxxx
CLAIM No: xxxxxxx
BETWEEN:
PARKING EYE LIMITED (Claimant)
-- and --
xxxxxxxxxxxx (Defendant)
______________________________________________
WITNESS STATEMENT
______________________________________________
1. I am xxxxxxxxx and I am the defendant in this matter. The facts stated below are true to the best of my belief and my account has been prepared based upon my own knowledge. This is my supporting statement to my application dated xxxxxxxxx 2021 requesting to:
a. Set aside the default judgment dated xxxxxxxx2020 as it defectively served using an old address. 

b. Order for the claimant to pay the defendant £255 as reimbursement for the set aside fee.
c. Order for the original claim to be dismissed

2. Default Judgment

2.1 I understand that the claimant obtained a default judgment against me as the defendant on xxxxxx 2020. However, this default judgment was not served at my current address and therefore, I was not aware of the County Court Judgment until I created an Experian account in order view my credit rating score on xxxxxxx 2021. To verify this, I then requested a credit report from the same day, which stated that the Country Court Judgement was from xxxxxxx Country Court. 

2.2 Upon learning of the County Court Judgement on xxxxxxx 2021, I immediately contacted xxxxxxxCounty Court the next working day on xxxxxx 2021 to find out details of the Default Judgement. It was only at this point that I discovered that Parking Eye Ltd. was the claimant, and that the judgment was regarding a parking charge notice for £197 relating to parking in a car park in xxxxxx on xxxxx 2019.

2.3 xxxxxx Country Court informed me that the judgment was served at an old address, xxxxxxxxxxxxx, at some point after the parking notice was issued on xxxxx2019. However, I had moved to a new address in xxxxxxxx 2019 and my tenancy agreement at this address expired in xxxxxx 2019. In support of this I can provide confirmation of the end of tenancy at this old address in xxxxxx 2019  I also notified the DVLA to update my photocard licence in xxxxx 2019 and was paying a TV licence monthly that was registered to my new address, in addition to notifying xxxxx water,   xxxxxxx city council and xxxxxx energy of the fact I was leaving the address and provided them with my forwarding address, See EVIDENCE A

2.4 I have not ever received any previous documentation from the Claimant in this matter and I thus was never able to properly challenge the Claimant’s claim. When I learnt of the claim I then immediately applied for a copy of the judgment from xxxxxxxx  County Court and the PCN from Parking Eye Ltd as I have never seen either of these documents. However, I have not received it yet but I still wanted to submit the N244 promptly after learning of this situation.


2.6 I suggest the claimant did not make reasonable enquiries as to my current address before pursuing the court order and that they had good reason to believe they did not hold my current contact details as I had not responded to the claim. As stated in the Civil Procedure Rules CPR 6.9(3) where a claimant has reason to believe that the address of the defendant referred is an address at which the defendant no longer resides or carries on business, the claimant must take reasonable steps to ascertain the address of the defendant’s current residence or place of business. At the time of the County Court Judgment in on the xxxxxx 2020,  my driving license, car insurance, TV licence, council tax and utilities were all registered at a new address so I was there to be found by a simple trace SEE EVIDENCE C. Furthermore, considering they received no response from me to their correspondence I believe the Claimant had reasonable cause to question whether they were using an accurate address and that simple searches could have provided them with the correct address.

2.7 I believe the Claimant has behaved unreasonably in pursuing a claim against me without ensuring they held my correct contact details. According to publicly available information, my circumstances are far from being unique. The Claimant appears to have consistently failed to reasonably pursue the claim, as has been referred to as the practice of ‘Credit Clamping’, which several members of the Government have strongly condemned. Prime Minister Theresa May has pledged to investigate the ‘abuse’ of the CCJ system, while The Rt Hon Sir Oliver Heald QC MP has been quoted as saying on 23rd December 2016: "It cannot be right that people who are unaware of debts can see their lives and finances ruined by county court judgments. In the digital age, we must ensure companies pursuing unpaid debts make every reasonable effort to contact individuals, rather than simply relying on a letter to an old address." and "announced a crackdown on unresolved debts which can damage people’s credit ratings without them knowing. The action comes after concerns were raised that companies were issuing claims to consumers using incorrect addresses."

2.8. On the basis provided above I would suggest that the Claimant did not fulfil their duty to use the Defendant’s current address when bringing the claim and therefore, have not adhered to CPR 6.9 (3) and failed to show due diligence by using an address at which the defendant no longer resided.

2.9. Considering the above I as the Defendant was unable to defend this claim properly. I thus believe that the Default Judgement against me was issued incorrectly and thus should be set aside and I ask the Court to consider the reimbursement of the fee of £255 from the claimant should this request be successful.

3.6 If required to defend at a further hearing, I will require all copies of paperwork, letters and other documentation from the Claimant in order to make informed decisions and statements in a comprehensive defence as keeper of a vehicle 

 

6) Finally, do I mention my failure to update v5c, I know driving licence doesn't count but I still took some steps to make sure I could be found and thought I was doing the correct thing in my in experience being a car owner or is this irrelevant? 

7) Can I still submit this to the email shown in newbies or does it need to be posted? 

If anyone could take the time to answer the numbered questions and read my WS that would really help, I have tried to come forward with as much prep done to stop people repeating themselves but I am now worried that I don't have proof of there to be found if it was only a month before the judgement with a few bits beforehand. 

Many thanks

RoseM (not my real name)

 

nosferatu1001

Wow that was aHUGE first post
First
1) when precisely did you find out about the CCJ? 
2) You really have jumped ahead here. Have you approached PE to see if they would consent to a set aside?
They just want their money
enforcement@ is the right address i believe.
3) When you ask for consent, you can ask abou thte  amount you would be expected to pay

rosemorton95

Thanks for your reply just wanted to get the info out there and save time. Yes I have, as it was mentioned on the other posts I had read. I have approached them politely for set aside with consent by email aswell as requesting the information that I want about the offence so I can work out why payment wasn't made or received. However, I had seen they do not reply to a lot of people and I want to make sure I don't waste time so I wanted to have the set aside without consent ready to go if they do not get back within 5-7 days so that I can make a prompt application. I found out on Saturday but it's been there a year, so I contacted the court and then PE yesterday and prepared my set aside without consent stuff incase they say no or don't respond. I never been in any trouble so it shocked me and I am just trying to make sure I am prepared for my chance to get rid of it. 

I don't know the original amount it would have been less then 10 pound though so I never spend more and somehow it crept to 197 on the judgement date and now is apparently 257. I don't see that as reasonable really so I wasn't sure if set aside without consent was better for me as I think with I have to pay 100pound plus 257 . 

nosferatu1001

What deadline did you give PE?
Havce you tried calling? Usually not recommended, but might bear fruit. 
WITH consent you will likely have to pay the entire judgment amount PLUS £100 for the N244 applicaiton
Why there isa another £60 who knows, but they are entitled to take formal steps to recover the now proven debt such as a warrant of control., and youre on the hook for paying that IF they did so. We dont know so dont guess, it can be something that you discuss IF you get the consent
A set aside WITHOUT consent costs you £255, and you may get this fee back, and may win the reopened claim

Umkomaas

I don't know the original amount it would have been less then 10 pound though so I never spend more and somehow it crept to 197 on the judgement date and now is apparently 257. I don't see that as reasonable really so I wasn't sure if set aside without consent was better for me as I think with I have to pay 100pound plus 257 . 

£257 doesn't look right for a PE judgment. £197 is in the ball park, but there's £60 added which seems like the scam unlawful amount that the various ambulance chaser solicitors add to their parking claims.  PE have never added that to their claims, and there have been plenty!

You do need to try to get to the bottom of that. Maybe an email to PE to check on the total figure make up. A SAR would flush it out, but that can take up to 30 days which could delay your set aside application which is not the best idea.

rosemorton95

Thanks, I have tried calling and pressing every possible combination of numbers but unfortunately no way of speaking to an actual person even if you call head office. I have said I need an answer within 5 days as I saw that time period there so I will email again around day 4 and if it gets to a week I will press ahead I guess. I will see what they position is an weigh up the chance of not getting the set aside without consent vs paying a lot of money. 

Yeah I know I saw PE don't add to theirs and the guidance in newbies mentioned that is why the WS needs to be different so I thought it odd, perhaps a solicitor is involved. I have sent the SAR aswell as just asking nicely for consent so I will hopefully get a response soon.  Thanks all 

Coupon-mad

PE don't use solicitors.  They have an in-house legal team.

6) Finally, do I mention my failure to update v5c, I know driving licence doesn't count but I still took some steps to make sure I could be found and thought I was doing the correct thing in my in experience being a car owner or is this irrelevant? 

I would put it the other way, that you DID take steps to inform the DVLA and only now how you discovered, to your horror, that they do not update all your data when a person changes their address by sending in their driving licence. As an aside you believe the failure of the DVLA to update all records of a data subject when they move is a GDPR breach and as such you have raised a complaint/data concern with the Information Commissioner* because this is happening to too many innocent people who believe they have made all reasonable endeavours to inform the DVLA that their address has changed.  However, even if you had realised this later and updated the V5C in between the date of the PCN and now, this would have made no difference because parking firms can't ask the DVLA a second time and know full well that they were told by the DVLA some months ago that they should use a tracing service before filing court claims.  It is well known that DVLA data is soon out of date, or doesn't match the address of the data subject, and parking firms must take every step to find the proposed Defendant before filing these claims.



* and do so, please (a very easy online complaint to the ICO about the DVLA, showing your evidence that you informed them of your change of address but they failed to update all records, despite knowing that (your name at your address) is the same data subject as listed as registered keeper of xxxxx vehicle.  This failure in their data systems has caused a CCJ and you want to ICO to investigate the DVLA, who seem to be hiding behind the argument that a 'different department' deal with driving licences, and V5C logbooks!).   I want to hear what the ICO think.  I believe the DVLA are breaching the GDPR.  It is certainly worth the ICO looking at.

rosemorton95

Thank you, I will get onto that immediately and will defiantly make that complaint. I have spoken to the DVLA who said as you predicted it is "clearly" two different departments but not so clear given the amount of people that have this issue. So the 7 days I gave PE is up and I had a response that basically told me to apply for set aside without consent, didn't even consider it. They ignored my question of how much the original amount was and said it is now £257 and said to contact the debt collectors. I just can't understand how it is £197 on the judgement but now more, are they allowed to put it up? However, I found out that on the day of the offence I paid for my parking TWICE on the app. So basically I must have overstayed. Does this make it better or worse as I made the effort to pay but as it was a year and a half ago I don't know why I overstayed but I clearly must have. I paid for overnight parking but I paid again in the morning before the overnight expired at 8am, must have got it confused with the other car park I use and thought it was 24 hours given it had overnight. The problem is I don't think the car park in question exists still but I will go look for signage tonight. 

Luckily, I have the paperwork ready to go for the set aside without consent so that will be going today as it is now 7 working days since  finding out, as it was the weekend I had to wait to contact the court, so 9 in total. Would anyone but able to look over the draft order and WS I posted in my first post now we are at this stage please? Any suggestions appreciated.

nosferatu1001

I told you at 410pm that the amount CAN go up, and why, but that it doesnt matter for a set aside. 
Why does paying for parking twice mean you must hav e overstayed? Explain that a little more!

Post the WS again. You need to make it absolutely crystal clear why PE should have known the address they had for you wasnt rigfht - the complete lack of contact from you would be a hint, and thats all they should need to do a TRACE on your currrent address

rosemorton95

The reviews of the car park (aire street, Leeds) on parkopedia  speak for itself it seems as though most people who use it get a fine! I looked to see if I could get a copy of the signage somewhere 

Le_Kirk

rosemorton95 said:

The reviews of the car park (aire street, Leeds) on parkopedia  speak for itself it seems as though most people who use it get a fine! I looked to see if I could get a copy of the signage somewhere 

Google street view is sometimes good for this and there is a little date drop-down box that will take you back over the years.