Moving Home Whilst on Income-related ESA, within same LA area.

sa1992

general question people, If someone is on employment support allowance and on regular council housing benefits if they were to move to universal credit will they be able to get the same amount from housing benefit or is a completely different payment, or do they have to apply again for housing benefit? Thanks

Spoonie_Turtle

sa1992 said:

general question people, If someone is on employment support allowance and on regular council housing benefits if they were to move to universal credit will they be able to get the same amount from housing benefit or is a completely different payment, or do they have to apply again for housing benefit? Thanks

Help with rent is included in Universal Credit.  The maximum rate would be the same for the housing costs element of UC, but non-dependant deductions have different rules. https://www.entitledto.co.uk/help/non-dependants

calcotti

sa1992 said:

general question people, If someone is on employment support allowance and on regular council housing benefits if they were to move to universal credit will they be able to get the same amount from housing benefit or is a completely different payment, or do they have to apply again for housing benefit? Thanks

They are applying for Universal Credit which includes the housing element. UC will calculate the housing element based on UC rules. For claimants without non dependants the eligible rent will be the same but it can be different where non dependants are involved and the contributions non dependants are expected to make are also different (UC is often kinder in this regard).

Noor711

An update.
I have managed to find a suitable 1 bedroom property in the same LA area, with a weekly rent of only just a few £s above the maximum weekly 1 bed LHA, not far from my current GP. 

I found it via a letting agent who is aware I am on out of work benefit (on Income-Related ESA) and will be relying on HB to pay the rent.  An offer was made (because I would otherwise fail the affordability/income referencing check by the tenancy referencing company) to pay 12 month's up front via a loan from my sister, to be paid directly to the letting agent on my behalf.  The offer was accepted by the landlord. 

A Tenancy Agreement has been drawn up and sent to me electronically, for signature.  It details that the rent is £X per calendar month as the payment period, but then it goes on in the next paragraph to say rental payment is to be paid in full cleared funds before the start of the tenancy for 12 months rent in advance for the total sum of £XXX , etc.  When notifying my local authority of my change of address after I have moved, I will have to provide a copy of this Tenancy Agreement as proof of my new rent liability.

My question is,  because the 12 months advance rent payment is specified within the body of the Tenancy Agreement as a large sum of money - in London - it is obviously above the lower capital limit of £6,000 for means tested benefit, and so does my sister have to provide a letter to my local authority with evidence of the payment made directly to the letting agent, specifying that it is paid on my behalf as a loan to be repaid to her from any housing benefit entitlement I am to receive?  I ask this because, even though I am automatically entitled to maximum housing benefit as I am passported on ESA (IR), my local authority might question how this large sum was paid and wonder about my capital...  I would normally not be required to provide any proof of my income/capital to my council, because my ESA (IR) was means tested by the DWP when I claimed, and my existing 'capital', that is what is in my bank accounts, was/is way below the lower capital limit.

Is this large amount of money viewed as my capital?  Even though it has not ever been in my own possession, i.e. not been in my bank account?   I am getting anxious, confused about it.  Just so amazed at having somewhere to move to for such a good rent with a landlord willing to accept me on housing benefit.  I have no CCJs and have a good previous landlord reference, which helped, but it was the advance 12 month's rent that clinched it.

Thank you for any advice.

poppy12345

As it never went into your bank then it's not classed as your capital. If the worst happens then ask your sister for a letter stating that she paid the rent upfront for you.

Noor711

poppy12345 said:

As it never went into your bank then it's not classed as your capital. If the worst happens then ask your sister for a letter stating that she paid the rent upfront for you.

Yes, you're right Poppy.  Just getting confused and stressed about it.  It's my sister's money and I am so lucky to have her offer to help me move - no choice, current landlord is selling - by paying this large amount of money knowing she won't get it all back for months.  Just read somewhere about loans being classed as capital... but that's only if it goes into your account?

But, it worries me that this large 12 month advance being paid is specified in black and white in the Tenancy Agreement, which my local authority will see, and then ask me about it.  Then, I got to worrying that it would be classed as my capital, even though it isn't...  Sorry for overthinking it.  This move is aggravating my illness so I am having a tough time of it, just now. 

So, wondering if it is best just for her to do a letter up front (with a payment slip from her bank as proof of the money paid for what and to whom) and provide it with the Tenancy Agreement as evidence of my move.   

poppy12345

Noor711 said:

poppy12345 said:

As it never went into your bank then it's not classed as your capital. If the worst happens then ask your sister for a letter stating that she paid the rent upfront for you.

  Just read somewhere about loans being classed as capital... but that's only if it goes into your account?

You are correct here, only if it goes into your bank account. Personally, i wouldn't worry about it but i know that's easier said than done. If it makes you feel more at ease then ask your sister for a letter stating that the 12 month rent upfront came as a loan from her and without her help you wouldn't have been able to pay that rent upfront, which enabled you to move house quickly. Good luck with the move, if you haven't moved already.

Noor711

poppy12345 said:

Noor711 said:

poppy12345 said:

As it never went into your bank then it's not classed as your capital. If the worst happens then ask your sister for a letter stating that she paid the rent upfront for you.

  Just read somewhere about loans being classed as capital... but that's only if it goes into your account?

You are correct here, only if it goes into your bank account. Personally, i wouldn't worry about it but i know that's easier said than done. If it makes you feel more at ease then ask your sister for a letter stating that the 12 month rent upfront came as a loan from her and without her help you wouldn't have been able to pay that rent upfront, which enabled you to move house quickly. Good luck with the move, if you haven't moved already.

Thanks Poppy.  Not moved just yet.  Still at the stage of signing Tenancy Agreement and then my sister imminently paying over the advance rent.

My sister looks after me when my illness (which is fluctuating) gets really bad and she said she, of course, would do a letter and wants to explain how important it is that I stay near my medical support/continuity of care from my local surgery and that I would not have been accepted for any tenancy without her help, which is the case. 

Interestingly, the letting agents around my area, when I have been looking, have all said that they are not allowed by law (because of recent court cases) to refuse me as an applicant for any of their properties.  They cannot advertise 'no DSS'   This is because it indirectly discriminates against women and the disabled (who in the main are the main beneficiaries of housing benefit/UC housing costs).  I fall into both categories, as it happens.  However, landlords do have a choice to refuse to let to you, even if you apply, if you fail affordability reference checks.  Basically, they calculate the monthly rent x 30 to give a figure which should be at the minimum level of a gross annual income.  Obviously, housing benefit income taken together with other out of work benefits and even PIP, could never match that gross figure - so you instantly fail affordability checks - even if, as in my case, I can afford the weekly rent with a couple of £s top up from my other benefit income based on my 1 bed LHA entitlement.  That's why they suggest having a guarantor and/or get a loan to pay some/all of the rent up front to secure a tenancy.  My sister's income fluctuates and so she could not be a guarantor, but she could dip into her savings to help me.

But, thank you for your reassuring words.  

calcotti

Noor711 said:... if you fail affordability reference checks.  

Nonsense isn't it. If you are getting housing benefit you know you have that income whereas someone in job can lose it at short notice!

Noor711

calcotti said:

Noor711 said:... if you fail affordability reference checks.  

Nonsense isn't it. If you are getting housing benefit you know you have that income whereas someone in job can lose it at short notice!

How does anybody rent on out of work benefit and housing benefit without a guarantor/borrowing to pay all rent up front?

Not to mention, they used to advertise 'no DSS' all over the place.  They can't do it at letting agents or the online portals anymore - but private landlords via certain online letting agents do it.  There's a stigma attached to those on benefits.  I basically ignored any properties advertised as being 'suitable for a professional' as that is code for 'no DSS'.