Downsides to Smart Meters in 2021?

itisgeorge

Hi all,

We moved a few years back and our property still had PAYG meters which we're now looking to change as its expensive and a pain to keep topping up. The current meters  (electricity and gas) are with British Gas. It's been fun trying to actually get in touch with BG but eventually I had luck with Twitter, and they're saying that installing a normal meter isn't possible anymore and that they'd have to be smart meters. I quote "...you have stated in one of your conversations that you don't want a smart credit meter? Unfortunately it would be a smart meter that would be fitted.".

First of all surely this isn't accurate? I was of the understanding that I could have an old meter if I wanted.
Secondly are there really any downsides to having smart meters now? Sounds like I'm going to need reasons if I need to argue my case. From my limited research I know there were issues with the first gen ones but they seem to have been ironed out now.

Appreciate your time reading this.

Cheers,
George

Gerry1

For many years, both the Secretary of Sate and Ofgem have stated that you don't have to have smart meters. This is what Ofgem said:-

But they've quietly changed it in the last month to a more authoritarian and somewhat contradictory and unclear policy:-

Try switching to a smaller supplier such as Avro who are likely to be more helpful as well as cheaper.

Brewer20

I've been doing a few comparisons just lately, some tariffs seem to offer that particular one if you have a smart meter installed as part of the switch. So I don't know if this is really the case, I suppose if they only offer you the smart meter take it. Other than that switch supplier's to one that maybe ATM doesn't insist on smart meters.
I'm trying to resist any reason to have them installed, but if it comes I'll most likely have to conform.
One thing I'll say, I'll still keep a log of all usage as I do now and record monthly for comparison.

niktheguru

This question keeps getting asked.
When smart meters are installed and work, they're great. I really don't see why it is a big deal not to have a smart meter, such as in your situation when you are going from a pre-pay meter. Just make sure you get a smets2 one.  

There are a lot of myths around smart meters.
- They don't automatically save you money. some of the marketing suggests this and its tosh. The in home display just shows people when energy is being used in a diagrammatical way, which can help inform people and potentially change behaviours, but it doesn't automatically save you money.
- The companies wont remotely stop your meter/energy and all the conspiracy theories the anti-smart people will tell you. (perhaps they have the functionality to, but this doesn't ever happen)

I would say just get a smart meter, lifes too short to argue for a dumb meter that will inevitably be changed again to a smart meter in the future!

BedrockFred

niktheguru said:

This question keeps getting asked.
When smart meters are installed and work, they're great. I really don't see why it is a big deal not to have a smart meter, such as in your situation when you are going from a pre-pay meter. Just make sure you get a smets2 one.  

There are a lot of myths around smart meters.
- They don't automatically save you money. some of the marketing suggests this and its tosh. The in home display just shows people when energy is being used in a diagrammatical way, which can help inform people and potentially change behaviours, but it doesn't automatically save you money.
- The companies wont remotely stop your meter/energy and all the conspiracy theories the anti-smart people will tell you. (perhaps they have the functionality to, but this doesn't ever happen)

I would say just get a smart meter, lifes too short to argue for a dumb meter that will inevitably be changed again to a smart meter in the future!

Your opinion but I would say life isto short to accept a smart meter
Never had one never want one should my dumb meter go faulty then I will argue the case for it to be replaced by another dumb meter
I can see absolutely no reasons to have a smart meter
Doesn't ever happen ..............yet

Xbigman

If its a choice between a dumb PAYG or a SMART credit meter I'd take the smart one every time. It would be the one smart meter in the country that would definitely save the homeowner money.

As to the OP's question. Yes you can refuse a smart meter, and BG can refuse you a credit meter. There's pretty much only one way out if you want rid of PAYG.


Darren

[Deleted User]

itisgeorge said:

Hi all,

We moved a few years back and our property still had PAYG meters which we're now looking to change as its expensive and a pain to keep topping up. The current meters  (electricity and gas) are with British Gas. It's been fun trying to actually get in touch with BG but eventually I had luck with Twitter, and they're saying that installing a normal meter isn't possible anymore and that they'd have to be smart meters. I quote "...you have stated in one of your conversations that you don't want a smart credit meter? Unfortunately it would be a smart meter that would be fitted.".

First of all surely this isn't accurate? I was of the understanding that I could have an old meter if I wanted.
Secondly are there really any downsides to having smart meters now? Sounds like I'm going to need reasons if I need to argue my case. From my limited research I know there were issues with the first gen ones but they seem to have been ironed out now.

Appreciate your time reading this.

Cheers,
George

From The Energy Ombudsman’s Website:

Quote: We wouldn’t expect an energy supplier to change a smart meter to a traditional meter without good reason. And as the energy industry moves towards a smart and flexible system, manufacturers are less likely to produce traditional meters. This means energy suppliers may not have any traditional meters in stock.

If the energy company does not have any traditional meters available, and there are exceptional circumstances which mean the smart functionality should be removed, a suitable alternative would be to have the smart meter installed with the smart functions turned off. By doing this the meter will act like a traditional meter but by having the smart functions switched off the consumer will miss out on the benefits offered by smart meters.

If the energy supplier does have traditional meters in stock, it would be up to the individual supplier to decide whether they will replace a smart meter with a traditional meter. The installation and removal of meters costs money. If the energy company agrees to replace a working smart meter, it is entitled to charge you the costs for doing so. Unquote

The same logic would apply to the replacement of a meter that has reached its end-of-life.

niktheguru

BedrockFred said:

niktheguru said:

This question keeps getting asked.
When smart meters are installed and work, they're great. I really don't see why it is a big deal not to have a smart meter, such as in your situation when you are going from a pre-pay meter. Just make sure you get a smets2 one.  

There are a lot of myths around smart meters.
- They don't automatically save you money. some of the marketing suggests this and its tosh. The in home display just shows people when energy is being used in a diagrammatical way, which can help inform people and potentially change behaviours, but it doesn't automatically save you money.
- The companies wont remotely stop your meter/energy and all the conspiracy theories the anti-smart people will tell you. (perhaps they have the functionality to, but this doesn't ever happen)

I would say just get a smart meter, lifes too short to argue for a dumb meter that will inevitably be changed again to a smart meter in the future!

Your opinion but I would say life isto short to accept a smart meter
Never had one never want one should my dumb meter go faulty then I will argue the case for it to be replaced by another dumb meter
I can see absolutely no reasons to have a smart meter
Doesn't ever happen ..............yet

Completely agree that everyone is entitled to an opinion but you haven't actually given any reasoning.

I understand that if you have a perfectly working standard meter and don't want a smart meter as you don't think it'd benefit you then why change something if it aint broke, that's fair enough.

But I was speaking with regards to the OP's post. He/she currently has a pre-payment meter and wants a credit meter. It would make sense for it just to be a smart meter. Firstly because suppliers have their obligations regarding smart metering which isn't going to change (yes, not a great reason), but secondly its not going to detriment the customer having a smart meter rather than a dumb meter, even if say for whatever reason the smart metering didn't work it could still be used as a dumb meter.

Probably more importantly if renting, smart meters can be easily used in pre-payment as well as credit mode, without having to change meters anymore, which makes it much more advantageous for landlords and tenants.

Plus why spend time arguing for a dumb meter, whilst on a expensive pre-payment tariff, when they are offering a new meter which will potentially make your new bill more accurate.
(and yes, i've had a smart meter (SMETS1), and it currently works as a dumb meter. I actually quite liked the convenience of having a smart meter, just in case i forgot a meter reading on occasion, and reducing the risk of companies taking my meter read and still providing estimated readings!! (which some companies still do!)) 
I would ask for the OP's question.....what is the advantage of a standard meter?

BedrockFred

As you said they can cut of your supply and saying they have not done it yet there is always a first
I agree with you a smart meter is better than a pre payment meter due to cost of supply, 
I am not a landlord I don't rent and this house will never be owned by a landlord so that is no advantage to me at all
What next will these smart meters be able to do in the future, I can see absolutely no advantage at all for me, no cost saving which what the smart meter people are trying to suggest
I can control my usage without a little gadget sitting in my room, and sure as hell if I told my wife to turn off the washing machine or cooker because the gadget says its costing xx amount I know what I would be told lol

But I suppose this is for another thread 
Big brother is watching smart meters are a step along the way

niktheguru

BedrockFred said:

As you said they can cut of your supply and saying they have not done it yet there is always a first
I agree with you a smart meter is better than a pre payment meter due to cost of supply, 
I am not a landlord I don't rent and this house will never be owned by a landlord so that is no advantage to me at all
What next will these smart meters be able to do in the future, I can see absolutely no advantage at all for me, no cost saving which what the smart meter people are trying to suggest
I can control my usage without a little gadget sitting in my room, and sure as hell if I told my wife to turn off the washing machine or cooker because the gadget says its costing xx amount I know what I would be told lol

But I suppose this is for another thread 
Big brother is watching smart meters are a step along the way

Haha, fair enough.
With everyone homes becoming smart its just a matter of time. :-)

[Deleted User]

BedrockFred said:

As you said they can cut of your supply and saying they have not done it yet there is always a first
I agree with you a smart meter is better than a pre payment meter due to cost of supply, 
I am not a landlord I don't rent and this house will never be owned by a landlord so that is no advantage to me at all
What next will these smart meters be able to do in the future, I can see absolutely no advantage at all for me, no cost saving which what the smart meter people are trying to suggest
I can control my usage without a little gadget sitting in my room, and sure as hell if I told my wife to turn off the washing machine or cooker because the gadget says its costing xx amount I know what I would be told lol

But I suppose this is for another thread 
Big brother is watching smart meters are a step along the way

Smart meters have not been well sold to the General Public. The true savings come from reductions in tariffs in future years: that is, they will be lower than they would have been without smart meters. Today, the Country has 000s of large/medium/small generators ranging from power stations and wind farms to small PV arrays on home roofs. To work, the Grid has to be in balance and this is where the smart grid comes into play. For example, my electricity smart meter continually monitors the voltage to my home. If the voltage to my home exceeds the upper and lower voltage limits, the DNO will be notified. The DNO can then identify the likely fault without having to send out an investigation team when damage has been done. This is where the savings are to be made which should result in lower tariff increases. In time, we will see more and more smart meter only tariffs with higher prices for non smart meter homes. Ofgem has already agreed that this is fair on all customers. No doubt some people will hold out but I doubt that it will be that many - particularly, if the only way that they can get a non smart replacement meter is to pay for it.