Brother-in-law died, no will, no up to date paperwork, no state pension, loads of bills!

Bobbysoxx29

Hi all, thanks for all your brilliant help but now I fear I will have to ask you again.
 It was BIL funeral yesterday and with only 9 mourners it was a quiet but dignified affair. Now we have received word from the landlord that even though the clutter has gone, the house is still a mess (carpets are filthy(need removing), cobwebs everywhere and curtains/blinds need replacing. He is expecting us to sort all this out for him which would be out of our own pockets as the estate is insolvent.  We have paid for his funeral and the house clearance ourselves and have notified the 4 creditors ( rent, electric/gas, water and council tax) that if they wish to administer the Estate they are welcome to. The landlord has said he will get his solicitor to look at the few documents we have and become the administrator of the estate. 
Now what do we do about the state of the house, are we liable for it's state now or can we expect him to try to sue us?

naedanger

Bobbysoxx29 said:

Hi all, thanks for all your brilliant help but now I fear I will have to ask you again.
 It was BIL funeral yesterday and with only 9 mourners it was a quiet but dignified affair. Now we have received word from the landlord that even though the clutter has gone, the house is still a mess (carpets are filthy(need removing), cobwebs everywhere and curtains/blinds need replacing. He is expecting us to sort all this out for him which would be out of our own pockets as the estate is insolvent.  We have paid for his funeral and the house clearance ourselves and have notified the 4 creditors ( rent, electric/gas, water and council tax) that if they wish to administer the Estate they are welcome to. The landlord has said he will get his solicitor to look at the few documents we have and become the administrator of the estate. 
Now what do we do about the state of the house, are we liable for it's state now or can we expect him to try to sue us?

I wouldn't clean the house. 

If the landlord wishes to sue you then obviously he can. But you could point out that you have already paid for some expenses out of your own pocket, including the funeral, which I think is a prior claim than any other debts. So even if he won (which I suspect is unlikely) and forced you to administer the estate he would be very unlikely to see any money returned to him as you expect the estate is insolvent with some debts that would rank ahead of any claim from him.

EDIT If the landlord wants to administer the estate then fine. If he does submit your claim for the funeral costs and any other expenses you have personally incurred.

kazwookie

The LL cannot go for 'betterment' of the property, how long did he live there for? The LL needs to prove the condition of the property when he moved in.

If the LL gets funny, ask for an upto date gas certificate etc

Personally I would tell the LL to go away, do not have any more contact with him, you are not responsible for the lease the deceased signed.

Bobbysoxx29

He had lived there since 2010 and I believe he moved in as it was. He was a pub landlord and all the pub stuff he took with him was in amongst the clutter.

74jax

Were you guarantor on the lease at all?  If not then it's like asking Joe Bloggs down the road to pay for a new carpet - nothing to do with you at all.

Bobbysoxx29

No we weren't guarantors. We had only seen him twice in 10 years. He very much did his own thing.

lincroft1710

Bobbysoxx29 said:

( the username is a ruse, I am female!)

Not really a ruse, bobby socks were hosiery items worn by teenage girls in the USA in the 1940s and bobbysoxxer was a term for a teenage girl at that time

Keep_pedalling

I would simply write to the landlord informing him the you have discovered this his estate is insolvent and that you are not administer it. Clearing the flat is not intermeddling and even if it was with nothing in the estate there is nothing to distribute to his creditors so he cannot chase you for it.

The landlord will be able to use the secured deposit to pay for at least some of the required repairs.

sixtyfoothigh

This is what I wrote to my mother in laws creditors. In case you want to adapt something similar to the landlord. I've either had no replies - or the few that have replied have said "no it's fine, we can't be bothered with the hassle of administrating, we're writing it off". One person wrote back and said "can we see a current bank statement" and I said "I found a November one in her flat, but don't have access to her account now, see attached" and then they said "we'll write off".
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I'm writing to inform you that NAME passed away on the DATE (Account ref with you: INSERT REF NUMBER). Please find attached death certificate. 

Based on our initial enquiries it looks likely that the estate is insolvent and no-one will be administering it. We knew in the days prior to her passing that she had around £400 in her bank account and no other assets (no house/car etc), plus based on the limited paperwork we could see in her property she had debts we estimate between £3-6k. It could be more/less than this, but the paperwork was massively incomplete. We did find paperwork that seemed to relate to your company so we're unsure if she owed you money. As a courtesy I'm writing to any potential creditors that we can find details for to make them aware of the situation.

I believe creditors are legally able to take on the administration of the estate should they wish to, and after taking necessary steps to secure the estate, we are now holding any documents found in safe-keeping should any creditor wish to act as the administrators. If the estate was administered then the reasonable funeral costs we will be paying have been recorded and will be the first call on the estate (priority 2 debt) - which as you can imagine will be in excess of the ca. £400 in her estate (and leave £0 for her priority 5 debts - such as that owed to yourselves). I'm assuming COMPANY REDACTED won't wish to take on the additional expense/liability risks associated with administration of an insolvent estate, and you are more likely to consider write off - but do let me know if you need any further information from me to help you decide if you would like to administer the estate (e.g. copies of info relating to funeral costs/other debts).

Please let me know if you have any questions.

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I set up an anonymous email address to do that. But I'm assuming the landlord already has your contact details, so that might not be necessary.

Bobbysoxx29

Thanks again everyone. I've just received a 2 minute long video from the landlord showing us the state of the house now the clutter has gone. I'm assuming he wants us to clean it up properly. He has already been in touch with one of BIL sisters to ask when we are going back to help him clean it up. Do we say its not negotiable and it's up to him now.