Tenants in common- paper work after bereavement

xylophone

https://www.land-registry-documents.co.uk/information/joint-ownership-tennants/#:~:text=When a property is held,hold the equity in shares.&text=Upon the death of tenants,via the rules of intestacy.

The OP's mother is now the sole  legal (though not beneficial) owner of the property.
If she still had capacity, she could agree to the re registration of the property into the names of herself and the OP as tenants-in-common or as joint tenants if they preferred.

As things stand, the OP should apply to the CoP as here

https://www.gov.uk/courts-tribunals/court-of-protection

Once she has formal authority as Deputy, she can sell the property.

It seems that she has been bequeathed her father's beneficial interest with no condition as to its being held in trust for her mother - she would therefore be entitled to half the sale proceeds once these have been received.

getmore4less

xylophone said:

https://www.land-registry-documents.co.uk/information/joint-ownership-tennants/#:~:text=When a property is held,hold the equity in shares.&text=Upon the death of tenants,via the rules of intestacy.

The OP's mother is now the sole  legal (though not beneficial) owner of the property.
If she still had capacity, she could agree to the re registration of the property into the names of herself and the OP as tenants-in-common or as joint tenants if they preferred.

As things stand, the OP should apply to the CoP as here

https://www.gov.uk/courts-tribunals/court-of-protection

Once she has formal authority as Deputy, she can sell the property.

It seems that she has been bequeathed her father's beneficial interest with no condition as to its being held in trust for her mother - she would therefore be entitled to half the sale proceeds once these have been received.

That may not be the case, IPDI trust is quite common scenario that would need clarifying.
 
if that is the case then depending on the terms of that trust the capital may need to be retained in the trust as the mother would still have the right to the income from the asset.

Mickey666

Land_Registry said:

sammyjammy said:

The OP says the property was held tenants in common and his fathers share left to him, the son.

Indeed but the share is in his late Father’s beneficial ownership and not the legal ownership. It’s a very important distinction to make and understand

Can you clarify that please?
Mother and Father share the legal ownership of the property as tenant-in-common, which I understand (understood?) means they can pass on their legal ownership to a 3rd party.  Father's will leaves his share of the legal ownership to his son.  Fine.
But you're saying the legal ownership of the property passes to the Mother on Father's death, while the Father's beneficial ownership remains with his estate, which is subsequently passed to his son as per his will.  At some point, that beneficial ownership is registered with LR and only then does the son share the legal ownership of the property as tenants-in-common with the Mother (as the Father originally did).

That would seem to imply that as far as legal ownership is concerned, TIC is no different to JT in that the legal ownership immediately passes 100% to the survivor on death of one of the owners.  The TIC beneficial ownership is then dealt with later.
Is that correct?

getmore4less

Mickey666 said:

Land_Registry said:

sammyjammy said:

The OP says the property was held tenants in common and his fathers share left to him, the son.

Indeed but the share is in his late Father’s beneficial ownership and not the legal ownership. It’s a very important distinction to make and understand

Can you clarify that please?
Mother and Father share the legal ownership of the property as tenant-in-common, which I understand (understood?) means they can pass on their legal ownership to a 3rd party.  Father's will leaves his share of the legal ownership to his son.  Fine.
But you're saying the legal ownership of the property passes to the Mother on Father's death, while the Father's beneficial ownership remains with his estate, which is subsequently passed to his son as per his will.  At some point, that beneficial ownership is registered with LR and only then does the son share the legal ownership of the property as tenants-in-common with the Mother (as the Father originally did).

That would seem to imply that as far as legal ownership is concerned, TIC is no different to JT in that the legal ownership immediately passes 100% to the survivor on death of one of the owners.  The TIC beneficial ownership is then dealt with later.
Is that correct?

AIUI yes ,

The legal owners hold the property on trust for the beneficial owners  just so happens that in many cases they are the same people.

TIC is a bit of a bodge and does not really exist   or should be described as Beneficial tenants in common.



 

Land_Registry

The important distinction is that you can only ever deal with the whole of the legal ownership so always 100%. You can’t split the land, bricks, rooms, etc into shares
The beneficial ownership can though be split as in essence that relates to the value of the 
and, bricks etc in £s and pence. 

TIC is a term that indicates that a trust exists and that may relate to such a % split of the beneficial ownership. 

We register the legal ownership and if required or warranted can register a form A restriction to indicate such a trust exists. 

getmore4less

I found this land reg page very useful for getting to grips with this
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/private-trusts-of-land/practice-guide-24-private-trusts-of-land

xylophone

That may not be the case, IPDI trust is quite common scenario that would need clarifying.

Exactly. Which is why I wrote

It seems that she has been bequeathed her father's beneficial interest with no condition as to its being held in trust for her mother - she would therefore be entitled to half the sale proceeds once these have been received.

Mickey666

Land_Registry said:

The imp the important distinction is that you can only ever deal with the whole of the legal ownership so always 100%. You can’t split the land, bricks, rooms, etc into shares
The beneficial ownership can though be split as in essence that relates to the value of the 
and, bricks etc in £s and pence. 

TIC is a term that indicates that a trust exists and that may relate to such a % split of the beneficial ownership. 

We register the legal ownership and if required or warranted can register a form A restriction to indicate such a trust exists. 

Many thanks (and GetMore4Less) for those clarifications.  Interesting nuances!

catface36

Thank you for all your replies. Seems my situation may be more complex that I had first envisaged ! I think next step will be to apply via court of protection for my mother.
The will states that my father leaves his  share in the property to me not in trust. Guessing once I have deputyship I can sell, and divide house sale as per my fathers will 

xylophone

The will states that my father leaves his  share in the property to me not in trust. Guessing once I have deputyship I can sell, and divide house sale as per my fathers will 

Then the proceeds of sale will be divided equally between you and your mother.