Freeholders delaying response - Consent for structural alterations

creativefate

We purchased a Leasehold ground floor flat just before Xmas last year. The Freeholder owns the flat upstairs. The Garden is in the lease. 
We wish to extend, into the garden and reconfigure the dated kitchen and bathroom. So did our next door neighbours in the flat next door, meaning we have saved costs and time on lots of aspects. The next door neighbours are Freeholders of their Ground floor flat and so don't require consent from FH as we do. Basically, it feels like our FH is delaying consent through lack of contact and communication through his solicitor. It's now been 4 months. We are trying so hard to be patient, but there is never any information unless we prompt our solicitor to prompt the FH. There is never any feedback after they have spoken to FH and I am now being accused of being impatient I am frustrated at the lack of communication about progress and timeline. The FH is planning to sell in the new year, and I believe he is holding out until he can pass to a new FH and delay us even further. The neighbours are digging their foundations already and and are ready to start building. The Plans are for one big build and so we are concerned that the delays with our FH could potentially scupper the whole build, for them and us. 
Our FH has always refused to speak to us about it and although we understand that he is entitled to go via solicitor and are happy for this to happen, we feel he is being unreasonable by delaying response times and dragging things out. I have outlined the timeline of events below. Hence the MASSIVE post , Sorry about that!

So, in August this year, we approached the FH and asked permission. He said, as expected, he would need to speak to his solicitor. This is as we expected.(
14/9 I invite the FH down to chat through our ideas with him regarding size, width etc, also asked if he had any concerns. He didn't even apologise for not turning up, but, as expected, said he would need plans to send to his solicitor. We had plans drawn up by Architect. 
24/9 - SENT plans to FH solicitor.
2/10 - FH solicitor CONFIRMS RECEIPT, requesting funds for account of £650 with very vague explanation to reason. We have expected ,and accepted happily, to pay his solicitor, surveyor and admin costs regarding documents and just wanted some clarification as to what this sum covered.

8/10 - APPOINT a solicitor who requests, on our behalf, a clearer breakdown of costs and timeline, there is NO RESPONSE from the FH solicitor.
21/10 - Our solicitor starts to look into our lease and the FH title, advising us not to pay FH solicitor yet. 
4/11 - ASK our Solicitor to contact FH Solicitor and he leaves a telephone message,  as NO RESPONSE to original request for information. (1 MONTH SINCE REQUEST)
7/11 - RESPONSE from FH Solicitor with explanation that was just a vague as the first. (4 weeks since request)
8/11 - PAY FH solicitors to move things forward.
11/11 - PHONE BOTH SOLICITORS TO REQUEST GENERAL IDEA OF TIMELINE. GET TOLD OFF by both solicitors for  (Whoops) Warning from my solicitor that if I continue to push them, my requests will be put at bottom of pile and so will take even longer!!

17/11 END OF PP OPPORTUNITY FOR COMMENTS AND OBJECTIONS. FH has commented, claiming that he will need access to the rear of his property (from our garden?) and so he is concerned that width won't give him access via current gate. 
17/11 - EMAIL our solicitor, asking him to put solution to FH solicitor, in anticipation of them raising it as an issue. We are happy to cover cost of new fence and gate through to our garden from HIS GARDEN rather than the current access from COMMUNAL AREA , meaning we don't have to narrow our build. 
18/11 - RESPONSE from our solicitor, who has left another message with FH solicitor when he couldn't get through to her again. Advised that a week and a half , since payment isn't enough time to expect a response. (Even though we held off payment on his advise)
19/11 - RESPONSE from FH solicitor (via our solicitor) that she will be speaking to FH on 20/11 (Now another 2 weeks since we last heard from them). NO CONTACT ABOUT CONVERSATION.
26/11 - RESPONSE from FH solicitor with photos illustrating the concern about access, that were taken at the start of SEPT !! Now our solicitor asks us if we want him to put forward the solution the we asked him to do 10 days ago! He is happy to grant full consent if he can have this access, making our build narrower. 
27/11 - GAIN FULL PP - OUR solicitor finally contacts FH solicitor with suggested proposal regarding access. Our solicitor suggests that he will contact FH solicitor in 1-2 weeks and that he will contact us next week!!
3/12 -  A week has nearly passed ... we still haven't heard from our solicitor OR the FH solicitor to even know if she has put the solution to the FH, let alone what his response is. If he is happy to grant consent for access, this is what our solution offers, so why is it taking so long to get a response???

4 months on and we are wondering why it has taken so long to discuss this concern, when we could have chatted about it on 14/9

Any Advice about this situation would be most welcome. We are really nice people and good  neighbours, who just need a little more room and want this to end amicably. 

anselld

It sounds like your solicitor is a significant part of the problem.
However, you have only got PP a week ago so you have not really lost much time (yet).  Perhaps it would be a good time to impress on your solicitor that PP has been just granted and the opportunity to proceed is now and how does he suggest concluding the matter promptly.

creativefate

Yes, it does feel like this. He seems to be leaving a lot of time between correspondence and isn't really seeking information from them about their intentions. He keeps warning me off being impatient but the lack of progress is frustrating. Thank you for your comment. I fear we are in too deep now to go for another solicitor?

creativefate

anselld said:

It sounds like your solicitor is a significant part of the problem.
However, you have only got PP a week ago so you have not really lost much time (yet).  Perhaps it would be a good time to impress on your solicitor that PP has been just granted and the opportunity to proceed is now and how does he suggest concluding the matter promptly.

Our solicitor is aware that PP has been granted   and the need to move quickly, which is why we were trying to solve this meanwhile and hope it all tied together at the same time.   In the latest email,  I sent him on Monday, I asked him to message them to ask if there is any reason as to why a response couldn't be decided by the end of day, tomorrow. Also to let me know of any reason as to why he felt it unreasonable to ask this of them. I have had no response to my email so far. So frustrating.

eddddy

TBH, it sounds to me like the freeholder is the problem. You say the freeholder owns the flat upstairs - do they live there?

Why don't they just discuss this with you - instead of insisting that all communication is via solicitors? That's slow and very expensive.

In due course, there could be a chunk of changes required to the lease (depending on how the lease is structured at the moment).

For example, if the freeholder is currently responsible for repairs and maintenance to the building, who will be responsible for repairs and maintenance of the extension? Is there a need to recalculate service charge percentages, based on the new relative sizes of the flats.

And new lease plans will probably be required.

Also, if you're cutting holes in the freeholder's external wall as part of the extension, the freeholder might want their own structural engineer to check the calculations, and their own surveyor to oversee the work etc... And you'd need to pay for them, and you'd need to pay for the legal work to change the leases.

AdrianC

creativefate said:

We purchased a Leasehold ground floor flat just before Xmas last year. The Freeholder owns the flat upstairs. The Garden is in the lease. 
We wish to extend, into the garden and reconfigure the dated kitchen and bathroom. So did our next door neighbours in the flat next door, meaning we have saved costs and time on lots of aspects. The next door neighbours are Freeholders of their Ground floor flat and so don't require consent from FH as we do.

Is this a block of flats, or two flats in a converted house (semi?), and next door is in that different house?

If it's a different building, then their situation really is irrelevant to yours. If that is the case, then your upstairs neighbour owns the entire building and you have the leased right to reside in part of it. That does not include the right to modify the building itself, which they own.

It's very unlikely they really are freeholders of just their flat. If they're a joint freeholder of the same block as you, then they still require permission from the same freeholder as you - they simply have a bit of a say in whether that's given or not.

creativefate

AdrianC said:

creativefate said:

We purchased a Leasehold ground floor flat just before Xmas last year. The Freeholder owns the flat upstairs. The Garden is in the lease. 
We wish to extend, into the garden and reconfigure the dated kitchen and bathroom. So did our next door neighbours in the flat next door, meaning we have saved costs and time on lots of aspects. The next door neighbours are Freeholders of their Ground floor flat and so don't require consent from FH as we do.

Is this a block of flats, or two flats in a converted house (semi?), and next door is in that different house?

If it's a different building, then their situation really is irrelevant to yours. If that is the case, then your upstairs neighbour owns the entire building and you have the leased right to reside in part of it. That does not include the right to modify the building itself, which they own.

It's very unlikely they really are freeholders of just their flat. If they're a joint freeholder of the same block as you, then they still require permission from the same freeholder as you - they simply have a bit of a say in whether that's given or not.

Its a house converted into 2 flats. We are aware the he owns the exterior walls, which is why we need to seek permission. We have done everything by the book.
Yes, next door is in a separate building, although they are the freeholders of theirs.. It was convenient for both of us to build at the same time regarding Party wall etc. 

creativefate

eddddy said:

TBH, it sounds to me like the freeholder is the problem. You say the freeholder owns the flat upstairs - do they live there?

Why don't they just discuss this with you - instead of insisting that all communication is via solicitors? That's slow and very expensive.

In due course, there could be a chunk of changes required to the lease (depending on how the lease is structured at the moment).

For example, if the freeholder is currently responsible for repairs and maintenance to the building, who will be responsible for repairs and maintenance of the extension? Is there a need to recalculate service charge percentages, based on the new relative sizes of the flats.

And new lease plans will probably be required.

Also, if you're cutting holes in the freeholder's external wall as part of the extension, the freeholder might want their own structural engineer to check the calculations, and their own surveyor to oversee the work etc... And you'd need to pay for them, and you'd need to pay for the legal work to change the leases.

Yes, the Freeholder lives upstairs ... with his mother and brother in a 2 bed flat. Go figure. He has refused to talk about it on any occasion that I have politely approached him. It's expensive for us and purposely slow to suit him.
Its really affecting how we live on a day to day basis as we are having to creep round, keep music down and feel like we are being watched from above. We have also had our post tampered with and his mother commenting racist remarks in the communal area outside our door. Not directed at us, but that language and outlook disgusts me. We are trying so hard to be patient, but its starting to wear me down. We are happy to cover all costs of lease changes, have paid for his solicitor and are happy to pay for a surveyor and structural engineer. We share repairs and maintenance costs but would be happy to maintain the exterior of the new extension. It's only 3.5 metres square. We don't know what else we can do.