PIP - challenging length of award

Muttleythefrog

I've just received notice that my PIP has been awarded after paper based review. The decision slightly increases the score of Daily Living (as directed by the paper based assessment report) from previous award but I still receive enhanced Daily Living and standard Mobility. The award is for 3 years which is not surprising as the assessment report suggested review in 2 and I understand they typically add another year to that in decision as the 'assessment year'.

I know some posters here have plenty experience of PIP claims - my question to any and all a simple one. Is it worth asking them to reconsider solely the length of award and ask for longer?

They admit my condition has not improved (curiously they say my needs have not changed yet the descriptors chosen have changed - just the usual idiocy in these letters) and they use an ESA face to face assessment report from last year to aid their decision (as did the paper based assessment) which states improvement is unlikely in the longer term. I wonder what my chances are of getting an extra year added on if I make a simple argument. I would not pursue the matter to tribunal as my personal circumstances at the moment are too difficult and quite frankly I'm too unwell. TIA.. and thanks to those who continue to provide good advice to claimants on these boards.

poppy12345

You can yes, although you can state it's just the length of the award you're requesting and that you're happy with the actual award. However, they will look at the whole award again and not just for length. Before Covid the chances of success at MR were very low, that did increase rather a lot but now the figures are moving back to where they were pre Covid.

You would need to state specifically why you think your award length should have been longer. Others may respond too once they see this.

Spoonie_Turtle

You are within your rights to. Are your mobility difficulties likely to increase and thus be worth reviewing in a few years, or will they stay the same?

There are some interesting threads over on Rightsnet about challenging the length of awards - often referring to those for whom their conditions are either stable, or who have been awarded enhanced DL and mobility and whose only changes will be deterioration (so not worth reviewing because there is no higher award they can be given). If you Google 'challenge pip award length' there should be a few results from RN all together. There's also this page with a link to guidance you might find interesting: https://www.disabilityrightsuk.org/news/2018/august/dwp-publish-new-pip-award-duration-guidance

I'd venture that to ask for just an extra year might be almost as arbitrary as the original 3 years though?

Muttleythefrog

Thanks to the above posters. I've looked at some more posting as advised too. I think I'll leave things as they are. On reflection perhaps there is some small chance they would extend the award and most likely a year if they did. But even if they did that may not be entirely helpful anyway - for this PIP review I largely seemed to get a paper based assessment because of a very helpful fairly recent (earlier last year) ESA f2f assessment report that even stated my daily restrictions regarding activities relevant to PIP. I am due for ESA (now universal credit) review the year before my PIP will end and I wonder if it could be helpful again to PIP if I have to face the horror of a f2f WCA.

Like many a disabled person I guess sometimes you just have to weigh up the personal costs of pursuing these things.. I wasted a vast effort last time asking for reconsideration to get the correct descriptors applied and ironically in this review they've shifted almost into line with the descriptors I argued applied. I face a daily battle getting those around me to understand my illness... I can't take on more in present circumstances.

Seasonal wishes to all.... strange year eh... probably a pretty strange one to come... but as the lyrics of a The Police song went.. 'There has to be an invisible sun'

hello007007

I am a lay person who doesn't know much about this sort of thing but I knew someone who challenged the award period. They said due to the pandemic and the backlog and increase in waiting times and increased demand on the NHS, it was extremely unlikely they would get the help they need in a timely manner and it was also extremely unlikely that their condition was to improve greatly as they had had issues for years. They also said the application process was difficult for them, this time around as they lost paperwork etc... and it was stressful.

They had a 3 year award which was extended to 5 years.

I can't see what you would be losing to ask for a longer period because you have little chance of improvement already. It may have slipped the tribunals mind to think about increase your award term. We are all human.

SteveQ

Muttleythefrog said:

Thanks to the above posters. I've looked at some more posting as advised too. I think I'll leave things as they are. On reflection perhaps there is some small chance they would extend the award and most likely a year if they did. But even if they did that may not be entirely helpful anyway - for this PIP review I largely seemed to get a paper based assessment because of a very helpful fairly recent (earlier last year) ESA f2f assessment report that even stated my daily restrictions regarding activities relevant to PIP. I am due for ESA (now universal credit) review the year before my PIP will end and I wonder if it could be helpful again to PIP if I have to face the horror of a f2f WCA.

Like many a disabled person I guess sometimes you just have to weigh up the personal costs of pursuing these things.. I wasted a vast effort last time asking for reconsideration to get the correct descriptors applied and ironically in this review they've shifted almost into line with the descriptors I argued applied. I face a daily battle getting those around me to understand my illness... I can't take on more in present circumstances.

Seasonal wishes to all.... strange year eh... probably a pretty strange one to come... but as the lyrics of a The Police song went.. 'There has to be an invisible sun'

Was your PIP a conversion from DLA or a new application ?

poppy12345

SteveQ said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Thanks to the above posters. I've looked at some more posting as advised too. I think I'll leave things as they are. On reflection perhaps there is some small chance they would extend the award and most likely a year if they did. But even if they did that may not be entirely helpful anyway - for this PIP review I largely seemed to get a paper based assessment because of a very helpful fairly recent (earlier last year) ESA f2f assessment report that even stated my daily restrictions regarding activities relevant to PIP. I am due for ESA (now universal credit) review the year before my PIP will end and I wonder if it could be helpful again to PIP if I have to face the horror of a f2f WCA.

Like many a disabled person I guess sometimes you just have to weigh up the personal costs of pursuing these things.. I wasted a vast effort last time asking for reconsideration to get the correct descriptors applied and ironically in this review they've shifted almost into line with the descriptors I argued applied. I face a daily battle getting those around me to understand my illness... I can't take on more in present circumstances.

Seasonal wishes to all.... strange year eh... probably a pretty strange one to come... but as the lyrics of a The Police song went.. 'There has to be an invisible sun'

Was your PIP a conversion from DLA or a new application ?

Going by previous comments and threads from the OP it was a review of an existing PIP award.

Muttleythefrog

hello007007 said:

I am a lay person who doesn't know much about this sort of thing but I knew someone who challenged the award period. They said due to the pandemic and the backlog and increase in waiting times and increased demand on the NHS, it was extremely unlikely they would get the help they need in a timely manner and it was also extremely unlikely that their condition was to improve greatly as they had had issues for years. They also said the application process was difficult for them, this time around as they lost paperwork etc... and it was stressful.

They had a 3 year award which was extended to 5 years.

I can't see what you would be losing to ask for a longer period because you have little chance of improvement already. It may have slipped the tribunals mind to think about increase your award term. We are all human.

Time has passed for reconsideration request now. Good to hear this though... perhaps elements of a strategy to argue for similar in the future. I figured chances were a reconsideration would not change anything and that an appeal might to my benefit but I had bigger issues on my plate that having that hanging over me... plus my next Work Capability Assessment is scheduled the year before my PIP award runs out which may make it useful evidence for PIP review as timely evidence as happened this time. But yes we're all human... I've had to chalk this one up as a battle I cannot afford to engage due to others more pressing.

Muttleythefrog

SteveQ said:

Muttleythefrog said:

Thanks to the above posters. I've looked at some more posting as advised too. I think I'll leave things as they are. On reflection perhaps there is some small chance they would extend the award and most likely a year if they did. But even if they did that may not be entirely helpful anyway - for this PIP review I largely seemed to get a paper based assessment because of a very helpful fairly recent (earlier last year) ESA f2f assessment report that even stated my daily restrictions regarding activities relevant to PIP. I am due for ESA (now universal credit) review the year before my PIP will end and I wonder if it could be helpful again to PIP if I have to face the horror of a f2f WCA.

Like many a disabled person I guess sometimes you just have to weigh up the personal costs of pursuing these things.. I wasted a vast effort last time asking for reconsideration to get the correct descriptors applied and ironically in this review they've shifted almost into line with the descriptors I argued applied. I face a daily battle getting those around me to understand my illness... I can't take on more in present circumstances.

Seasonal wishes to all.... strange year eh... probably a pretty strange one to come... but as the lyrics of a The Police song went.. 'There has to be an invisible sun'

Was your PIP a conversion from DLA or a new application ?

It was a review of existing award and ultimately I got some more Daily Living points than previous but award stays same... a year shorter in duration though which I felt challengeable in evidence terms.

Perhaps in the end though not going through those processes was the right decision... I've been able to make progress on other matters that gives me a ray of hope for this year.

poppy12345

Muttleythefrog said:

hello007007 said:

I am a lay person who doesn't know much about this sort of thing but I knew someone who challenged the award period. They said due to the pandemic and the backlog and increase in waiting times and increased demand on the NHS, it was extremely unlikely they would get the help they need in a timely manner and it was also extremely unlikely that their condition was to improve greatly as they had had issues for years. They also said the application process was difficult for them, this time around as they lost paperwork etc... and it was stressful.

They had a 3 year award which was extended to 5 years.

I can't see what you would be losing to ask for a longer period because you have little chance of improvement already. It may have slipped the tribunals mind to think about increase your award term. We are all human.

Time has passed for reconsideration request now.

That's not exactly correct. With good reason you do actually have 13 months, even if DWP don't accept your reason for being late it will just mean your MR request didn't change the decision so you request the Tribunal. HMCTS will not refuse you an appeal because you were outside the 1 month to request it.

Muttleythefrog

poppy12345 said:

Muttleythefrog said:

hello007007 said:

I am a lay person who doesn't know much about this sort of thing but I knew someone who challenged the award period. They said due to the pandemic and the backlog and increase in waiting times and increased demand on the NHS, it was extremely unlikely they would get the help they need in a timely manner and it was also extremely unlikely that their condition was to improve greatly as they had had issues for years. They also said the application process was difficult for them, this time around as they lost paperwork etc... and it was stressful.

They had a 3 year award which was extended to 5 years.

I can't see what you would be losing to ask for a longer period because you have little chance of improvement already. It may have slipped the tribunals mind to think about increase your award term. We are all human.

Time has passed for reconsideration request now.

That's not exactly correct. With good reason you do actually have 13 months, even if DWP don't accept your reason for being late it will just mean your MR request didn't change the decision so you request the Tribunal. HMCTS will not refuse you an appeal because you were outside the 1 month to request it.

Very true... but I just can't see me revisiting the matter now. Despite the 'wide of reality' judgements I often get from the DWP I have always been entirely honest with them to give them best chance of getting things right... and an excuse for late reconsideration almost certainly would come with an element of dishonesty. The next year should be a dramatic one of change for me anyway... either my plan A works or my plan B does... one is likely to lower my experienced disabilities and the other eliminates them all.