Powerline with WiFi

fred246

I didn't upgrade them I just put them directly into the wall socket. The utility is called tpPLC. If the connection between 2 adapters is less than 50MBPS the line between them is red. Above 50 it is green. So when I had them on the 4 gang type connections the speeds were 70 to 100MBPS. After plugging them into the sockets directly speeds are 150 to 200mbps. I thought you wouldn't notice a difference because I have a 38MBPS internet connection but you do. Webpages load noticeably quicker. In reality it must only be milliseconds difference and I wouldn't pay for the difference. There are lots of powerline adapters at 1200MBPS now. Can't be many 1200MBPS internet connections. Are they noticeably quicker? People must have them although I wouldn't pay to upgrade.

wongataa

missile said:

wongataa said:

missile said:

fred246 said:

I use a tplink utility that shows you all the speeds between the powerline adapters. It does increase the speed by plugging directly into the socket. All our sockets are doubles so it's easy to plug the adapter in one and have a multiple adapter on the other one. Our broadband is 38mps so I thought increasing from 70 to 150 wouldn't help but it makes a notable difference. All the adapters are 200mbps and I have them all running at over 150mbps.

I don't understand how your adapter can give faster download than your router speed?

Speeds quoted for powerline adaptors (and Wi-Fi) are half duplex.  This means the actual speed you can get is half the quoted number.  The speeds quoted are also the max possible and in the real world you are likely not to reach them.

Fred246 had 70mbps adaptors and an internet speed of 38.  70/2 is 35 so less than 38 and if we assume the adaptors were not reaching the max possible speed (almost certainly) then they would running even slower than their internet connection.  Fred246 upgraded to 150mbps adaptors and 150/2=75 which is comfortable above 38 and allows a decent headroom for the adaptors not reaching their max speed and still not dropping below the internet connection speed.

It is perfectly understandable that upgrading the powerline adaptors in this situation increased the internet speed at the computers on the other end of them.  The speed at the router would be unaffected.

That went over my head. 
I would suggest, the speed (as measured by a speed test on the router) is the maximum which could possibly be obtained via a powerline adapter.

I'll try to make it simpler.

Speeds quoted for powerline adaptors are twice as high as is actually possible for technical & marketing reasons.  You need to have that number to see what is possible and you won't reach the maximum speed.

In the example given by Fred246 their internet speed was faster than half the speed of the powerline adaptor - the powerline adaptor was incapable of passing the full internet speed through to any computer attached to it. Fred246 bought faster powerline adaptors which do not throttle the internet speed so any computers attached to them saw faster internet speeds.

getmore4less

The speed between the adaptors is independent of the speed of the outbound connection from the router(your broadband speed)

The speed measured between the adaptors is all the traffic that flows through them for all devices in the local network.
depending what's connected there may be other traffic that never goes out to the internet like broadcast packets.

Also the speed measure is the raw speed not the actual data  that has multiple overheads attached to it to make it work and secure.

People use higher rated powerline to make the local network quicker for things like file transfers or local streaming.


To check speed through the powerline and broadband  use external speed test when there is not a lot else going on in your local network 

wongataa

fred246 said:

I didn't upgrade them I just put them directly into the wall socket. The utility is called tpPLC. If the connection between 2 adapters is less than 50MBPS the line between them is red. Above 50 it is green. So when I had them on the 4 gang type connections the speeds were 70 to 100MBPS. After plugging them into the sockets directly speeds are 150 to 200mbps. I thought you wouldn't notice a difference because I have a 38MBPS internet connection but you do.

That is because you have to half the speed number the powerline adaptor says to see what the connection is (and take a bit off for overheads).  50/2 = 25 which is less than 38.  The adaptors were throttling your internet speed until you moved them so they could provide more bandwidth.

There are lots of powerline adapters at 1200MBPS now. Can't be many 1200MBPS internet connections. Are they noticeably quicker? People must have them although I wouldn't pay to upgrade.

People use home networks for more than just the internet.  Higher speeds are beneficial on any network, not just internet access.

Biggus_Dickus

Prompted by this thread I’ve run some extensive speed tests using Speedtest.net;...my broadband is Virgin fibre 100M (108Mbps). It’s not an exact science as even with my fairly stable broadband the speed tests vary slightly but I reckon the results are consistent enough to draw some general conclusions.

Powerline adaptor on a 1metre Ethernet cable and plugged directly into a mains socket: 66Mbps-73Mbps download

Powerline adaptor on a 1metre Ethernet cable & a 4 metre extension lead:  60Mbps-68Mbps

Powerline adaptor on a 4metre Ethernet cable & a 4 metre extension lead: 58Mbps-66Mbps

Powerline adaptor on a 4metre Ethernet cable & a 0.75metre extension lead: 61Mbps-69Mbps

Powerline adaptor on a 1metre Ethernet cable & a 0.75metre extension lead: 62Mbps-70Mbps

If I run the above tests with the Powerline adaptor on a different ring main to the router all the speeds reduce by 5% or so. (my consumer unit is a newish RCD type)

Using a cheap ‘mains double adaptor’ plugged directly into the mains socket made zero difference to the speeds so one would need to consider whether the extra cost of the  powerline adaptor  ‘pass-through’ feature is really necessary and worth the extra premium.

Conclusion:

A 4metre extension lead drops the speed by about 8%.

A 0.75 metre extension lead drops the speed by about 4%.

A 4metre Ethernet cable drops the speed by about 4%.

Keep your extension lead and Ethernet cables as short as possible!...and don’t pay a premium for ‘pass-through’ if you don’t really need it.

P.S. these tests were performed in my house using my HP Win-10 laptop and cables;...they should not be taken as indicative of the results you will get. Your experience may be totally different.

poppy10_2

Biggus_Dickus said:

Keep your extension lead and Ethernet cables as short as possible!...

Unless you are using extremely poor quality and old (pre 5e) ethernet cables, the length should not make any difference to transmission, unless you are talking 20metres plus

Takmon

Biggus_Dickus said:

Nebulous2 said:

Hi folks - we’re moving to an old house with thick walls. I’m going to be setting up a turbo for my bike in the garage and need WiFi. The signal in the garage is poor to non-existent. It looks like a Powerline system would be best, I’d prefer one with WiFi and there are limited sockets so passthrough would also be good. Any suggestions? 

I’m going up this weekend and intend checking to ensure the garage is on the same ring as the socket where the router lives, which I understand is needed. 

Not necessarily;...I have powerline adaptors (TP-Link) communicating quite happily across different ring main circuitry.

I have an almost new consumer unit and they run perfectly,...fast and very stable.,...and they worked equally well on the old style ‘fused’ consumer unit.

I have seen posts where people have reported problems, but purely on a personal level I haven’t encountered any.

P.S. you may find this article useful.

https://homenetworkgeek.com/do-powerline-adapters-need-to-be-on-the-same-circuit/#Do_Powerline_Adapters_Work_on_Different_Ring_Circuits

I was going to say that powerline adapters certainly aren't fast and your post showing the results of your testing is very slow considering that my network with Ethernet cables is 12 times faster than your best result. Powerline adaptors should always be a last resort, even a test over Wi-Fi gave results that are over 7 times faster.

fred246

A quick Google search reveals power line adapters running at 2400mbps. No point for the majority of users. There is no point telling people who are 100% happy with them that they should not be using them. People don't want wires trailing all over their house.

Biggus_Dickus

Takmon said:

Biggus_Dickus said:

Nebulous2 said:

Hi folks - we’re moving to an old house with thick walls. I’m going to be setting up a turbo for my bike in the garage and need WiFi. The signal in the garage is poor to non-existent. It looks like a Powerline system would be best, I’d prefer one with WiFi and there are limited sockets so passthrough would also be good. Any suggestions? 

I’m going up this weekend and intend checking to ensure the garage is on the same ring as the socket where the router lives, which I understand is needed. 

Not necessarily;...I have powerline adaptors (TP-Link) communicating quite happily across different ring main circuitry.

I have an almost new consumer unit and they run perfectly,...fast and very stable.,...and they worked equally well on the old style ‘fused’ consumer unit.

I have seen posts where people have reported problems, but purely on a personal level I haven’t encountered any.

P.S. you may find this article useful.

https://homenetworkgeek.com/do-powerline-adapters-need-to-be-on-the-same-circuit/#Do_Powerline_Adapters_Work_on_Different_Ring_Circuits

I was going to say that powerline adapters certainly aren't fast and your post showing the results of your testing is very slow considering that my network with Ethernet cables is 12 times faster than your best result. Powerline adaptors should always be a last resort, even a test over Wi-Fi gave results that are over 7 times faster.

Powerline adaptors may be the last resort for you but they certainly aren’t for me. It really depends on individual circumstance and requirements.

Wi-Fi in my house is fine if I’m using my laptop in my front room where my router is situated (consistent 108Mbps download) but it’s very ropey in most other parts of my house. If Wi-Fi was adequate throughout my house I certainly wouldn’t use powerline adaptors or dedicated point to point Ethernet cabling. Wi-Fi is superb and ideally would be my weapon of choice but Wi-Fi has its limitations,..certainly in my house.

I can get my powerline adaptors running 73Mbps download and that’s in quite a remote part of my house where the Wi-Fi can be down to a very iffy 20Mbps;.. so 73Mbps via powerline adaptors is not particularly slow in terms of my Virgin fibre broadband absolute maximum download speed which is 110Mbps.

If your broad band is delivering a blistering 876Mbps! download that’s great for you but that’s a speed which is of little additional value to me and it’s also a speed that I have no desire to pay for!

Powerline adaptors work perfectly for my needs;...discrete, cheap, very stable and fast enough for a remote PC and several 4K-Smart TV’s running Netflix and all that gubbins.

That being said, Powerline adaptors aren’t everyone’s cup of tea and I fully appreciate they are anathema to some people. However, as in all things it’s “horses for courses”

 

 

 

Takmon

fred246 said:

A quick Google search reveals power line adapters running at 2400mbps. No point for the majority of users. There is no point telling people who are 100% happy with them that they should not be using them. People don't want wires trailing all over their house.

There are no powerline adaptors that are anywhere near capable of running at 2400Mbps and if you look at real world tests i haven't seen any that can actually transfer data at even a quarter of that speed.