Continuing payment expired card

rhinoR

This relates to my experience with an insurance company. Apparently visa card rules state that continuing payments can to be taken from a card even though it has expired.
Insurance companies do not make it clear that that when they hold your card details they can be used as a continuing payment.
Insurance companies hold onto your card details even if they have been specifically requested not to and when renewal of your policy comes around they can automatically take the payment even though the card expired six months earlier.
This seems like a totally unfair practice and many other companies will ask you to renew your card should you wish it to be used for continuing payments. Banks take a payment application from the Ins Co without checking if the card is valid as the service is provided by Visa et al. Insurance company word patterns have improved slightly in that some occasionally ask if the card be retained but many of them don't ask but still retain card details for continuing payments.
Dealing over the phone you have no proof that any instruction given has been understood or implemented. The Banks will not undertake a recharge unless there is evidence and the only evidence acceptable is a confirmatory email from the insurance co. The bank suggested that we should stay in the line to the insurance co until the email confirmation is recieved,  ha ha.
If you change policy providers regularly as MSE recommends its imperative you get confirmation and check the cancellation of pre existing policies.
My card had expired and I was surprised that the ins co was able to take a renewal premium without authority.
Unfortunately, I ran with duplicate home polices and the attitude of the Cos and Banks is "thats your problem".
Taking money from expired cards should be stopped and continuous card payments need to be set out more clearly in TnCs
May be a subject MSE could run with.

Sandtree

Almost all insurance companies have it in their T&Cs that by buying the policy by card you give them the right to set up a continuous payment authority and renew the policy automatically unless you tell them otherwise.

The regulators actively support automatic renewal because it has been credited in significantly driving down the amount of people who forget when their renewal dates are, policy lapses and they find themselves driving without insurance etc.

A CPA can be cancelled with your card issuer, though this isnt a fact well known and even some card issuers get funny about doing it you ask them to.

This is all moot anyway because cancelling the payment method doesnt cancel the renewal, it just means the insurance renews anyway, then gets cancelled as no intent to pay and you have to declare for life that an insurance policy has been voided for payment issues. 

The renewal letter/email will have stated that they will renew the policy unless you contact them to advise otherwise... I assume you didnt bother to do this and so have to accept full blame

dunstonh

Apparently visa card rules state that continuing payments can to be taken from a card even though it has expired.

Correct. CPAs can disregard the expiry date.

Insurance companies hold onto your card details even if they have been specifically requested not to and when renewal of your policy comes around they can automatically take the payment even though the card expired six months earlier.

Correction: any company can hold onto your card details with a CPA and the expiry date doesnt matter (as already mentioned).  It is not just insurance companies.  

This seems like a totally unfair practice and many other companies will ask you to renew your card should you wish it to be used for continuing payments. Banks take a payment application from the Ins Co without checking if the card is valid as the service is provided by Visa et al. 

How is it unfair?  It reduces costs and lowers premiums.  

If you change policy providers regularly as MSE recommends its imperative you get confirmation and check the cancellation of pre existing policies.

You mean follow the instructions that the insurer gives you in the renewal letter in the bit that tells you what to do next if you do or do not wish to proceed with your renewal  

My card had expired and I was surprised that the ins co was able to take a renewal premium without authority.

Your lack of knowledge does not make it wrong.  

Taking money from expired cards should be stopped and continuous card payments need to be set out more clearly in TnCs
May be a subject MSE could run with.

That would increase costs for everyone in all businesses that use CPAs.  Why would MSE want to run with something that increases costs to consumers?

The only time you are likely to have a problem with a CPA with an insurer is if you do not read the renewal letter and follow instructions.     

MalMonroe

 I once bought a magazine subscription on a credit card, paid it off and then the card expired. When it came time to re-subscribe I'd decided not to bother but the company sent me an email to let me know my card had expired. They weren't able to get anything out of it because it had expired. I wasn't aware that companies are allowed to take money from a closed account and agree with the OP, it shouldn't be allowed. What if the cardholder has died? It's ridiculous. 

[Deleted User]

If the cardholder had died then any outstanding debt would be settled from the estate as normal.

If you no longer need a subscription, cancel it. Don't rely on cards expiring or on you dying as a means of cancellation. Now that really is ridiculous.

dunstonh

. What if the cardholder has died? It's ridiculous. 

Then it would not be taken as the account would be closed.

You are mixing up account with expiry date on the card.