Bank Lied to Prevent Me Closing Account - What Rules or Legislation Does This Breach?

peskydaisydoodle

Malthusian said:

As Sailtheworld says, that ship has sailed. If he doesn't have your permission to allow other people to handle his affairs you need to wind up your handling of his affairs and then leave him to it.

Handling his affairs and voluntarily making it more difficult for both of you by not completing a Power of Attorney is the worst of both worlds. 

To get really philosophical, if somebody has no proof of identity then they don't legally exist.

Getting a passport is not acquiring proof of identity, it's just converting the proof of identity you already have (the documents that you give the Passport Office) into a form that more people will accept without further checks.

The practical point I'm making is that it's fine to have no passport or other commonly accepted proof of ID, you just don't get to complain it makes your life more difficult. It's like refusing to own a tin-opener.

Thanks - but your answer appears to have no bearing on the original question. He doesn't need my permission to do anything - I obviously worded that wrong. I think it's a bit of a stretch to say I'm making anything more difficult by not having POA. Now that the Bank have forced the issue, he will soon have a Bank Account - but it won't make life any easier as it's simply a minor adjustment. I guess the debit card will act as a piece of ID so that's fine.  As for handling his affairs, allowing someone to have their benefits paid into ones bank account doesn't really constitute handling their affairs. It's basically just providing a vehicle for them to have their money transported in. You can do it for a friend, a cousin, a neighbour - it doesn't follow that you have to take on POA for them. The only reason a problem has arisen here is because the bank wanted the account to be closed prior to them closing the branch. I was happy to oblige but they didn't like the fact that I was going to withdraw the funds and close the account - which I was perfectly entitled to do (unless someone can enlighten me otherwise?). They wanted me instead to ensure a Bank Account was opened in my son's name for them to transfer the funds into before the account was closed. I have been gullible in trusting the bank when they said that they had found a solution - they had not found a solution, just a way to stop me withdrawing the funds. Why? I have no idea. You say a person cannot complain if they don't have ID and their life is made difficult as a result - so if a person has no ID they lose their basic rights? This problem was unforeseen because I myself did not expect the Bank to behave in a manner which would lead to difficulty. He does have ID - he was able to make a benefits claim with the ID he has. The fact that he doesn't have ID to open a Bank Account is neither here nor there because he did not particularly want - or need - to open a Bank Account at this current time in his life. The DWP are happy to pay benefits into any 3rd party account. If the benefit was paid into an account in my own name there would never have been an issue. There was never an issue with the ITF account either - until I said I was going to close it - although the Bank had indicated some uneasiness on several occasions. If they were so uneasy, then they should have asked me to close it years ago - they didn't. There is a similarl account in my name ITF for my older son - that didn't change over either but they've raised no concerns regarding that one - perhaps because there is no money in it (surely an ideal opportunity for them to close it then). The Bank dissuaded me from closing the account by dangling a false carrot - they deliberately misled me and convinced me that closing the account was not the best option and that they had a better solution. That solution turned out to be a complete fabrication. The fault is mine for believing them - because if I had trusted my instincts and closed the account, an ID issue would not have arisen, and the funds would now be sitting in a different account rather than in the form of an unbanked cheque. If my son decides in the future he wants to learn to drive, he will get a provisional license. If he wants to go abroad he will get a passport. If he wants a mortgage he will have all the relevant ID in place. It is up to him to decide when he wants to do these things. He did not need a bank account to claim benefits but the Bank have forced a situation where he now has to have one - despite there being no legal requirement. We could easily have avoided this by i) arranging for the benefits to go into a different account and ii) closing the ITF account. I didn't come here for a discussion about ID......I wanted to know if anyone could explain why a Bank might take issue with me closing a Bank Account which was my in name in trust for my son - bearing in mind that I have, over the past several years, made regular withdrawals from it. The balance was down to £1000 when I indicated I was going to close it, which is insignificant compared to the amount that has previously been withdrawn  - I just don't get why it's caused a load of trouble in its final days. I've banked with them for 25 years but will be closing the accounts I hold with them. My husband has already switched away due to the recent events and our daughter's account will follow soon, so I fail to see what they've achieved other than a very disgruntled customer. 

Cus

Do you mind me asking, what are you hoping to get from the bank by making a complaint?
Based on what you have written, my opinion is that you deserve an apology for the insinuation from the bank that you were going to do or have done something 'wrong'...

ColdIron

Paragraphs please, your posts are unreadable

colsten

peskydaisydoodle said:

 I guess the debit card will act as a piece of ID so that's fine.

No debit card will act as a 'piece of ID'. Neither will the bank account  the debit card is attached to.

Proof of ID usually requires a photo ID. 

peskydaisydoodle

Cus said:

Do you mind me asking, what are you hoping to get from the bank by making a complaint?
Based on what you have written, my opinion is that you deserve an apology for the insinuation from the bank that you were going to do or have done something 'wrong'...

An apology would be good because it's been a very unpleasant and time-consuming experience - and an explanation of why the account was blocked rather than converted to an adult account like the staff member had said was going to happen. I also hope that the telephone conversation in which the staff member will be heard to give me completely inaccurate and misleading advice will come to light - if only to prove that I did not 'misinterpret' what she told me. I'd also like to know why it is they can't transfer the money directly to me or write a cheque in my name only - when for the past 20-odd years I was the only person making transactions on the account. 

phillw

colsten said:
Proof of ID usually requires a photo ID. 

Often it does, but all banks have different requirements and some people are unlikely to have a drivers license or passport. 

After reading through the thread I can't decide whether the person who told you the incorrect details made a genuine mistake, or whether they wonder if your son actually existed and went down a route that would force you to prove it. You may gave triggered an anti money laundering warning in their system, which they aren't allowed to tell you about & so may panic and make up something instead.

Raising a complaint is unlikely to go very far if they've been telling you that you've been operating the account outside the terms. You might get a "sorry, here is £30". 

Unless he is mentally impaired then it's about time he dealt with his own banking as you could be open to legal problems. If he doesn't have capacity then you need to apply to the court of protection.

colsten

phillw said:

colsten said:
Proof of ID usually requires a photo ID. 

Often it does, but all banks have different requirements and some people are unlikely to have a drivers license or passport. 

Banks aren't the only ones requiring proof of ID. And yes, I do realise not everyone has a DL or a passport. It is a fact of life, though, that proving your ID with either of them is generally the easiest, least hassle-prone method.

phillw

colsten said:
Banks aren't the only ones requiring proof of ID. And yes, I do realise not everyone has a DL or a passport. It is a fact of life, though, that proving your ID with either of them is generally the easiest, least hassle-prone method.

Maybe pre-covid, it took me a couple of goes to get natwest to accept the photo of my drivers license. If they'd accepted some form of government issued letter then it would be much easier to photograph that.

peskydaisydoodle

phillw said:

colsten said:
Proof of ID usually requires a photo ID. 

Often it does, but all banks have different requirements and some people are unlikely to have a drivers license or passport. 

After reading through the thread I can't decide whether the person who told you the incorrect details made a genuine mistake, or whether they wonder if your son actually existed and went down a route that would force you to prove it. You may gave triggered an anti money laundering warning in their system, which they aren't allowed to tell you about & so may panic and make up something instead.

Raising a complaint is unlikely to go very far if they've been telling you that you've been operating the account outside the terms. You might get a "sorry, here is £30". 

Unless he is mentally impaired then it's about time he dealt with his own banking as you could be open to legal problems. If he doesn't have capacity then you need to apply to the court of protection.

Ahhhhhh now that is starting to make sense - so it is possible that they simply weren't allowed to tell me what was happening?

As for being told I was operating the account outside their terms - I kept offering to close it and she kept saying she would try to find an alternative and eventually I said the time had come where I had to close it as the branch was closing in any case.

The member of staff had been quite lazy about the whole thing - she would appear from her office now and then for a brief discussion and would then tell me she was going to look into the possibility of other forms of id for him and get back to me. She never did because she would forget about me until my next visit.

There is absolutely no way she was mistaken in what she told me - she told me a stream of lies about how she had found a solution - and when, days later I went into the branch to confirm that everything was still in hand and that no further action was required from me, she lied again. I was so convinced by the spiel she gave me, that when I received a letter to say the ITF account would close 8 weeks later, I genuinely believed that was just a formality - that it was just the ITF part dropping off of the account so that the account officially became my son's.

I'm kicking myself for being so gullible - but I've been dealing with this member of staff for years and had no reason to suspect she would be telling me anything other than the truth. Even when the cheque arrived in the post I assumed there had been a genuine mistake - it wasn't until she denied that our conversations had taken place - and that it was confirmed to me that what I said I had been offered as a solution could never, ever have come to fruition, that I realised I had been completely taken in. 

The account for my son is in hand  and will all be sorted out it the next week or so - providing the assistant manager is correct in telling me I only need to provide a written statement from myself confirming that my son lives at my address, a letter confirming his NI number, and as a backup, a letter from the benefits agency. 

Thankyou for your input - it is the first answer I've had that points toward a possible explanation of why the bank staff behaved in the manner they did. 

binao

As we travel along life's road we meet many problems,  more so at this time.

You may be right and end up with £30, as previously posted, and lots of self satisfaction. Will it be worth all the energy, and sleeplessness.

When you come up  against rules and regs, just find an easy way to comply and win.

Your son is probably entitled to a bus pass. No need to use it, but it's  photographic ID.

Open a  joint account for the  cheque.  Just look for simple solutions to problem's.

Have you considered water co,  council tax etc help, that you may well be eligible for.

Good luck.

(Please compare reading my post and other posts to yours).