Small claims court - general advice please

firmaten

Hi All,

Just a start of a thread as I’m being taken to court with respect to a PCN, and would appreciate some general advice. To maintain a level on anonymity I won’t be stating anything too specific here.

Alleged infringement: c.2017

Ticket amount: (< 60 pence)

Amount being requested: £160 (plus court and legal fees)

Reasoning for not getting ticket: Weren’t aware a ticket was required. Two people read the sign and understood that to be the case. While in the cold light day you can see a charge is applied, we feel like the sign is deliberately laid out to cause an element of confusion.

What has been done so far.

• After a receiving a “letter of claim” from the law firm in 2017, I followed advice on the PCN sticky and asked the law firm for specifics, site plans, intention on protections freedoms act etc.
• Subsequent to that I was provided some information and advised the case was on hold until other information was provided by the client (parking firm). That is the last I heard.
• Fast forward to 2020, a different law firm issued a letter before claim. After reminding them of the history they stated the case was on hold.
• Now more recently, out of the blue, I have been issued a county court claim form.
• A defence has been filed in line with the PCN court claim sticky and I have been issued with a questionnaire.

 Questions

• Is it legal for two different legal firms to have pursued me?
• Do I have any defence on the grounds of them stating it was on hold and awaiting further information from the client? – and not being able to get the information requested.
• Do I have any defence with respect to there correspondence? It’s been all over the place and recently they have sent totally incorrect information about a judgment having been made?
• Evidence – it feels like any decent defence in relation to signage is going to be tricky to get. The ticket was issued near on 3+ years ago, the signage has all changed and I’m a bit concerned about getting evidence from the parking company on time. Is there anything I can do here?
• The defence on the signage feels weak, while as stated, this is what happened, I’m a little concerned a perfectly presented picture of the signage at the time (if they have it), might not go in my favour. I have a witness at the time, just wondering if there is any point of involving them?
• SAR – is there any point of issuing it at this stage?
• Questionnaire states this is suitable for small claims track – is this ok?

Thanks in advance and appreciate you taking a look.

Redx

1) yes , two or twenty two , doesn't matter how many

2) no

3) try for historical Google pictures , or ones on the net where other victims have posted them , plus a SAR to the DPO at the PPC. Bear in mind you will receive their Exhibits plus witness statement a few weeks before the hearing anyway !! Study them carefully when they arrive

4) get other witness statements signed , see if they will attend court with you to corroborate their account and yours

5) SAR ? Definitely do it asap

6) read the Newbies FAQ sticky thread near the top of the forum , second post , for filling in the DQ

KeithP

Not much point in trying to answer most of your questions - you have filed a Defence already.

Guidance on how to answer every question on your Directions Questionnaire can be found in Bargepole's 'what happens when' post linked from the second post of the NEWBIES thread.

What exactly did you file as a Defence?

firmaten

Thanks both.

KeithP - I used the template defence from the sticky outlined here - I also appended the Southampton judgement.

With respect to points 17 and 18. I removed the POFA point as don't think that could be relied upon.

The defence was along the lines that it was a dark/rainy night and due to the bad signage it wasn't clear a ticket was required at the site.

nosferatu1001

Why couldn't it? Was the driver revealed?
no "along the lines of" - show us exactly what you put in place at para 17 and 18. 

Why not point out the signs have changed
meanung they were not fit for purpose before 

firmaten

thanks nosferautu1001 - the driver has not been revealed. Re: POFA I read sections 8 and 9 and could not see anything that was obviously non compliant. I removed the whole section .

With respect to the signs - good point. The only indication I can see of them having changed is that they now look new and the charges are different. I don't know if they are signifcantly different from before as I don't have the picture of the sign from 3+ years ago (yet).

So points 16 and 17 - just became one brief point unfortunately (as I was in a rush to get the defence in - delay getting letter). I parapharsed it above as I didn't want to reveal too much given open audience. It merely stated the date, weather conditions and due to poor signage is was not clear a ticket was required. Also gave an indication given the nominal cost of the ticket that it was not intentional to avoid paying.

Umkomaas

the driver has not been revealed. Re: POFA I read sections 8 and 9 and could not see anything that was obviously non compliant. I removed the whole section  .

In 2017 not that many PPC had their NtKs PoFA-compliant. 

Which PPC?  You might have just frittered away a major defence point.  Can you let us see a redacted copy of the NtK, both sides. Please leave any dates showing. 

firmaten

Thanks Umkomaas - redacted NTK attached.

(The dates are the same year)

Umkomaas

The section which starts in red font 'Please be warned' is not PoFA-compliant. It's not the 'Issue Date of this Notice' that meets the requirements, but the 'Date Given' (which is anything but the 'Issue Date). That's a real Ace card thrown in the bin, but you might be able to rescue it with a well constructed WS around the point and the development of a good understanding of PoFA and the ability to argue the finer points of the Act in front of a Judge. 

Redx

firmaten said:

With respect to points 17 and 18. I removed the POFA point as don't think that could be relied upon.

What you think is not relevant !!

It's what a judge thinks after weighing up all the evidence that matters

If POFA comes up in their WS and exhibits then bring it up yourself as Umkomaas says

nosferatu1001

As above

you made a common mistake in not understanding g the difference between issued and given.