Baxi back boiler problems

kken

Our boiler is reeaaally old but we can't afford to replace it. We have just put the heating back on and suddenly, the hot water isn't heating properly (not hot enough) and the radiators are just lukewarm or barely working. Any ideas as i can't afford a new boiler though I know we desperately need one. Really concerned as winter is clearly on its way. We had no issue with the hot water until we switched the heating on. The pilot light does sometimes go out but once relit it fires up and the flame looks OK. 

tacpot12

It sounds as though your pump might have failed. When the boiler is working, but the pump isn't some water can still circulate due to gravity (hot water rises, just as hot air does). If the pump hasn't been used for a while, it may just be seized and a light tap with a small hammer might free it up. Got to be worth a try, but be gentle. If that doesn't work, call an engineer out to see if they can diagnose the problem. 

Can you get a loan to replace the boiler? You will need £3000-£4000. 

FreeBear

Are there any zone valves in the system anywhere ?

I have a Baxi back boiler, so probably a near identical setup. Don't have any zone valves, so when the boiler fire up, the HW tank heats up regardless of the pump running. Even when the pump isn't running, the upstairs radiators will get hot - Do yours ?

If so, it is most likely the pump as per tacpot12's diagnosis. Shop around and you should be able to find a pump for under £50. Not too difficult to fit as long as there are working isolation valves either side of it.

fisherjim

Turn the heating and water controls off, and undo the screw in the middle of the pump motor housing it's about 3/4" dia with a slot for a screwdriver, some water will weep out so put a cloth under it.

Use the a flat screwdriver to see if the impeller shaft is free it should spin easily, this may be enough to free it up and get it going, you could at this stage turn on the heating and see if the pump spins if it does put the inspection screw back and see what happens.

Very possible the system needs a good power flush and possibly a new pump. 

kken

Thanks everyone, I havent a clue where the pump motor housing is unfortunately, wonder if it is in the wall or something. Yesterday, tried bleeding the radiators but tbh they didnt seem to be full of air as water quickly came out! I also tried just having the water on and it got hot almost to same heat as before. Then tried central heating again and the radiators heated better but one in particular (upstairs bedroom) barely warm. Frustrating doesnt come close!! 
Unfortunately, I think that due to extremely poor credit rating, it would be very difficult to get a loan. I think that if i could get it working over the winter and get a second job ( I am a SEN teacher so do long tiring hours!), I could save perhaps for a boiler replacement next year. 
I am so fed up with stuff breaking and not being able to repair/replace. Tbh, think my house need grounding and rebuilding! Would be cheaper option imo! 

FreeBear

kken said: I havent a clue where the pump motor housing is unfortunately, wonder if it is in the wall or something.

Assuming the installation is similar to mine - The back boiler fitted in a fireplace on the ground floor and a gas fire on front - If this is the case, the pipework runs up the side of the chimney breast, most likely boxed in. The heating control is often close to the boiler, and the pump won't be far away - Any cupboard doors or hatches in the vicinity of the boiler ?

Alternatively, the pump and any zone valves may be located in the same cupboard as the hot water tank.

The Baxi back boiler, although old, is a reliable workhorse. Virtually nothing to go wrong, and spares are still available. If you can't isolate the problem with your heating system, it may pay to find a local heating engineer to give your boiler a service and check the rest of the system. Find one who has experience of back boilers and don't be fobbed off with the "Oooo, it's too old and needs replacing" line.

tacpot12

FreeBear said:

kken said: I havent a clue where the pump motor housing is unfortunately, wonder if it is in the wall or something.

Assuming the installation is similar to mine - The back boiler fitted in a fireplace on the ground floor and a gas fire on front - If this is the case, the pipework runs up the side of the chimney breast, most likely boxed in. The heating control is often close to the boiler, and the pump won't be far away - Any cupboard doors or hatches in the vicinity of the boiler ?

Alternatively, the pump and any zone valves may be located in the same cupboard as the hot water tank.

The Baxi back boiler, although old, is a reliable workhorse. Virtually nothing to go wrong, and spares are still available. If you can't isolate the problem with your heating system, it may pay to find a local heating engineer to give your boiler a service and check the rest of the system. Find one who has experience of back boilers and don't be fobbed off with the "Oooo, it's too old and needs replacing" line.

This is correct, there is very little to go wrong so it is quite easy to keep these boilers soldiering on, however at some point something is going to go wrong that can't be fixed, so you need to start saving for its replacement, once this issue is fixed. 

As has been suggested the pump is going to be close to the boiler, or possibly the hot water cylinder, as it needs electrical power to operate it - they can be found in odd places, but mostly they will be somewhere where they can be accessed for replacement. If you can find it yourself, it will save the engineer time, and of course time is money.

I agree that running an old house does sometimes feel like you are painting the Forth Road Bridge; it's never long before something else needs fixing. Unfortunately new boiler's aren't a lot better. We had a new boiler last year and now have to pay £60 a year to have it serviced to maintain the warranty. I doubt it will last more than 20 years and will need at least a couple of fans and a pump in that time. 

You need to start saving for such costs; the way to do it is to setup a standing order to pay £10/month to a separate bank account the day after you get paid. Once this money has gone from your account, you won't miss it - you will subtly adjust your spending patterns. Only use this money to pay for household repairs.

 

FreeBear

tacpot12 said: there is very little to go wrong so it is quite easy to keep these boilers soldiering on, however at some point something is going to go wrong that can't be fixed,

Had this discussion when my boiler was last serviced. About the only part that could possibly make a Baxi uneconomical to repair would be the boiler assembly. If that starts to leak, a second hand spare may be the only option as it is no longer available new unless someone has some very old stock kicking around.

Niv

FreeBear said:

tacpot12 said: there is very little to go wrong so it is quite easy to keep these boilers soldiering on, however at some point something is going to go wrong that can't be fixed,

Had this discussion when my boiler was last serviced. About the only part that could possibly make a Baxi uneconomical to repair would be the boiler assembly. If that starts to leak, a second hand spare may be the only option as it is no longer available new unless someone has some very old stock kicking around.

You can pick them up on ebay often very cheaply. Obviously no guarantee, but a vary viable option for many. I loved my baxi back boiler  - one of the few things I miss from my old house.

Niv

kken said:

Our boiler is reeaaally old but we can't afford to replace it. We have just put the heating back on and suddenly, the hot water isn't heating properly (not hot enough) and the radiators are just lukewarm or barely working. Any ideas as i can't afford a new boiler though I know we desperately need one. Really concerned as winter is clearly on its way. We had no issue with the hot water until we switched the heating on. The pilot light does sometimes go out but once relit it fires up and the flame looks OK. 

When was the last time you had it serviced? I found that when mine was serviced after a few missed years it improved dramatically - so much in fact that the gas flow had to be reduced.
As others have said it is likely to be the pump or a zone valve.
My pump was next to the hot water tank in the airing cupboard.
It will probably look something like this:
https://www.toolstation.com/dab-evo-vs-bronze-hot-water-circulating-pump/p44443 
They are often a burgundy colour.

couriervanman

kken said:

Thanks everyone, I havent a clue where the pump motor housing is unfortunately, wonder if it is in the wall or something. Yesterday, tried bleeding the radiators but tbh they didnt seem to be full of air as water quickly came out! I also tried just having the water on and it got hot almost to same heat as before. Then tried central heating again and the radiators heated better but one in particular (upstairs bedroom) barely warm. Frustrating doesnt come close!! 
Unfortunately, I think that due to extremely poor credit rating, it would be very difficult to get a loan. I think that if i could get it working over the winter and get a second job ( I am a SEN teacher so do long tiring hours!), I could save perhaps for a boiler replacement next year. 
I am so fed up with stuff breaking and not being able to repair/replace. Tbh, think my house need grounding and rebuilding! Would be cheaper option imo! 

Turn all the others off and see what happens......and maybe try balancing all or just the warm one.....just google it very easy to do