Landlord didn't pay Council tax.

ste1234

macman said:

Unless the flat was an HMO, it should be assessed separately for CT, as should the other flat. It's the occupier who is liable, not the LL.
If the flats are not banded, then the LL has never re-registered them as two separate dwellings, and is possibly collecting more CT from the two flats within the rent than they are paying out. You should never had signed a TA with such a clause. The LL can write whatever nonsense he wants in the contract, but it doesn't remove the statutory requirement that makes the occupier liable for CT.

I know I'm liable and have to pay, the Council have made this pretty clear. My question is can I get the money off the landlord that I have already paid?

"You should never had signed a TA with such a clause."- Council tax being included in the rent? Agreed, Lived in a HMO before and thought the rules were the same, especially when stated in the contract.

ste1234

NameUnavailable said:

Just deduct the CT from your next rent instalment/s.

"I have not lived in the property for a year.."

ste1234

theoretica said:

ste1234 said:

Thanks for the responses.

On the front page of the tenancy agreement it has the rent amount and states "the above rent includes Council tax, Water and broadband but not electric, gas and TV Licence (to be paid separately)".

This was agreed before I moved in and the front page of the agreement was changed (I assume) to the above, before I signed.

On another page it states "the tenant is to pay any and all Council tax or any tax replacing it, payable in respect of the property, which the tenant is obliged to pay under any enactment and to indemnify the landlord in respect of any Council tax, which (during the tenancy) the landlord becomes obliged to pay under any enactment because the tenant ceases to live at the property".

Taking those things together it looks like you, the tenant, should have paid the council tax, but you should have paid less rent to the landlord by that amount as the rent included council tax.

Agreed, certainly will do it that way in the future.

ARH_2

ste1234 said:

macman said:

Unless the flat was an HMO, it should be assessed separately for CT, as should the other flat. It's the occupier who is liable, not the LL.
If the flats are not banded, then the LL has never re-registered them as two separate dwellings, and is possibly collecting more CT from the two flats within the rent than they are paying out. You should never had signed a TA with such a clause. The LL can write whatever nonsense he wants in the contract, but it doesn't remove the statutory requirement that makes the occupier liable for CT.

I know I'm liable and have to pay, the Council have made this pretty clear. My question is can I get the money off the landlord that I have already paid?

"You should never had signed a TA with such a clause."- Council tax being included in the rent? Agreed, Lived in a HMO before and thought the rules were the same, especially when stated in the contract.

Yes, you can get the money off the landlord.  The very first response on this thread gave the process you might need to go through to get them to pay you. 

1. Pay the council what you owe them.
2. Ask the landlord nicely to reimburse you
3. If they don't, send a letter before action
4. If they don't pay up, https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/web/mcol/welcome

ste1234

Thanks ARH, that's what I'm going to do.

Robbo66

Irrespective of what the contract says the occupier of the property is responsible for paying the council tax so that's why the council has sent you the demand. You will need to make a separate claim against the Landlord for breach of contract to recover the money.

macman

It's not so simple. If the OP has received a demand for CT from the LA, then is that demand for the whole property? It must be so, because the OP said that the individual flat itself is not banded. If the OP is to take on responsibility for CT, then each flat must be registered, valued and a banding allocated by the VO. 
The likelihood is that the LA will then seek to recover the lost revenue since conversion into 2 flats took place from the LL.

ste1234

macman said:

It's not so simple. If the OP has received a demand for CT from the LA, then is that demand for the whole property? It must be so, because the OP said that the individual flat itself is not banded. If the OP is to take on responsibility for CT, then each flat must be registered, valued and a banding allocated by the VO. 
The likelihood is that the LA will then seek to recover the lost revenue since conversion into 2 flats took place from the LL.

The Council said that the house was not banded but has been now. The letters they have sent state "first floor flat". No mention of the other flat.

greatcrested

ste1234 said:

macman said:

It's not so simple. If the OP has received a demand for CT from the LA, then is that demand for the whole property? It must be so, because the OP said that the individual flat itself is not banded. If the OP is to take on responsibility for CT, then each flat must be registered, valued and a banding allocated by the VO. 
The likelihood is that the LA will then seek to recover the lost revenue since conversion into 2 flats took place from the LL.

The Council said that the house was not banded but has been now. The letters they have sent state "first floor flat". No mention of the other flat.

So we are back to where we started!

* pay the CT

* claim off LL

* sue LL if he does not re-imburse

ste1234

greatcrested said:

ste1234 said:

macman said:

It's not so simple. If the OP has received a demand for CT from the LA, then is that demand for the whole property? It must be so, because the OP said that the individual flat itself is not banded. If the OP is to take on responsibility for CT, then each flat must be registered, valued and a banding allocated by the VO. 
The likelihood is that the LA will then seek to recover the lost revenue since conversion into 2 flats took place from the LL.

The Council said that the house was not banded but has been now. The letters they have sent state "first floor flat". No mention of the other flat.

So we are back to where we started!

* pay the CT

* claim off LL

* sue LL if he does not re-imburse

Agreed!