Bank Fraud/Scam - Help

markkelly112

In Dec 2019, I made an overseas payment to the value of over £10k through my Lloyds business bank for goods purchased. In January it came to my attention that it was a scam/fraud and this was raised immediately with my bank as a fraud/case who then investigated further. Lloyds then liased with the overseas bank (HSBC) who then informed Lloyds that all they could do was ask the payee to return the funds back to me for which they refused. HSBC were not able to put any kind of freeze on the money as no crime had taken place even through this was fully raised as a scam/fraud case through my own bank (Lloyds) plus reporting this to the UK & Hong Kong police.

On the 28th February I received a final letter from Lloyds to say they wasn’t able to help me any further and they would not be returning any funds. Lloyds informed me that because the beneficiary bank (HSBC) were not able to recover my money, Lloyds were not able to return the money back to me,.

All I have received from Lloyds is a £50 apology payment which I took as an insult. I just think that neither bank wants to be held responsible for this sum of money and both sides are passing the buck to each other. 

Any help or advice would be much appreciated.

Thank you

eskbanker

markkelly112 said:

I just think that neither bank wants to be held responsible for this sum of money

Seems fair enough to me, neither bank is responsible for your loss, based on what you've posted....

You could sue the recipient if you know your way around Hong Kong law?

born_again

Well given that it was a month later then all the funds will have long gone from the account.

Sadly when making banking payments rather than card payments you lose a lot of protection.

jonesMUFCforever

born_again said:

Well given that it was a month later then all the funds will have long gone from the account.

Sadly when making banking payments rather than card payments you lose a lot of protection.

A Business to Business transaction does not have consumer protection.

bradders1983

You got £50 more than they actually had to give you, tbh.

John_

The banks have done nothing wrong here; you expecting them to make you good is like expecting Royal Mail to compensate you had you posted a chèque to a scammer for the same amount. They made the payment exactly in line with your instructions.

The person responsible is the fraudster, and they are who you need to go after, which is unfortunately going to be difficult.

Although in some cases there is consumer (not business) protection for fraud via a bank account, it’s generally worth viewing a transfer as being about the same as sending cash via a courier in terms of protection.

mab3000

From what you have said, I am assuming a complaint was raised with Lloyds and you have received the response saying the complaint was not upheld? If so did you take your complaint to the Financial ombudsman service (FOS)? That would have been your next step, but if the “final response” letter you said you received on the 28th Feb was relating to a complaint, if you haven’t taken the complaint to the FOS already then it’s too late as out of the 6 month timescale. 

However like others have said LLoyds or HSBC haven’t done anything wrong, and it’s highly unlikely the FOS would rule in your favour. You are better off  focusing your time and efforts on trying to get the funds back from the fraudster through relevant legal channels. 

markkelly112

At present it's currently with the FOS so no decision or feedback has been given as of yet.
As this is overseas transaction (Hong Kong), can anyone recommend or point me in the right direction of who might be able to help me to try and recover this debt for me?

Thank You

John_

markkelly112 said:

At present it's currently with the FOS so no decision or feedback has been given as of yet.
As this is overseas transaction (Hong Kong), can anyone recommend or point me in the right direction of who might be able to help me to try and recover this debt for me?

Thank You

Do you have a name and address for the person who you believe scammed you?

If so you’ll need to pursue them through the HK legal system. If not, I don’t really see where you can even start.

jonesMUFCforever

markkelly112 said:

At present it's currently with the FOS so no decision or feedback has been given as of yet.
As this is overseas transaction (Hong Kong), can anyone recommend or point me in the right direction of who might be able to help me to try and recover this debt for me?

Thank You

What are the odds of winning the lottery - 1 -in 45 million?
Those are better odds than you have any chance of getting a penny back of your money (or your business' money) - it is gone - I'm afraid you will have to accept this.

MEM62

markkelly112 said:

I just think that neither bank wants to be held responsible for this sum of money and both sides are passing the buck to each other. 

Neither bank are responsible and your expectation that they compensate you for your losses is unrealistic.  The banks are not responsible for you not doing due diligence in respect of your suppliers.