Ripple Energy wind farm?

QrizB

barker77 said:

Another noddy question sorry. I pay 40% tax. I assume I would do the same on this which might then make it not worth doing? 

Others might know better but I don't think there's any tax to pay on the bill credit that's paid. This is why you're limited as to how much capacity you're allowed to buy; there's no "profit" in it, you're just joining a co-operative that will supply your wholesale electricity for the duration of the project.

Reed_Richards

The credit might be deemed to be a form of dividend paid to shareholders.  Different taxation rules apply to share dividends: https://www.gov.uk/tax-on-dividends

QrizB

Reed_Richards said:

The credit might be deemed to be a form of dividend paid to shareholders.  Different taxation rules apply to share dividends: https://www.gov.uk/tax-on-dividends

Here's a post (and the immediately following ones, including video of the AGM and comments from the Ripple CEO) on a different forum that explains Ripple's own take on the tax question:

https://camelot-forum.co.uk/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?p=5552&sid=14137a41867436b9fd168b133542b1ac#p5552

charlescoker

I like to do the maths myself but I can’t see anywhere what the other costs of the electric bill actually are anywhere excluding the hole sale price that Ripple costs at 2p Kw
my electric quotes have doubled in last few weeks all based on the huge spike in wholesale cost 
if one assumes an increase from 17 (10 p other and 7p wholesale cost) to 33 is all wholesale increase and the increase is due to a wholesale increase from around 7p to 23p then should I expect to be paying only 12p per KW going forward 
if this is so then the savings are now significantly higher than originally envisaged shoukd prices remain so inflated

Petriix

charlescoker said:

I like to do the maths myself but I can’t see anywhere what the other costs of the electric bill actually are anywhere excluding the hole sale price that Ripple costs at 2p Kw
my electric quotes have doubled in last few weeks all based on the huge spike in wholesale cost 
if one assumes an increase from 17 (10 p other and 7p wholesale cost) to 33 is all wholesale increase and the increase is due to a wholesale increase from around 7p to 23p then should I expect to be paying only 12p per KW going forward 
if this is so then the savings are now significantly higher than originally envisaged shoukd prices remain so inflated

It doesn't work like that. You're just buying part of a wind turbine and collecting an equivalent share of its operating profit as a credit on your bill. The running costs of the turbine (and admin etc) will likely remain fairly static and low, while the electricity generated will sell for whatever the going wholesale price is.

This has no effect on the price you pay for your energy. You still have to pay whatever rate your supplier sets. But your share of the Ripple profits will be credited to your balance and reduce the amount you pay.

QrizB

charlescoker said:

I like to do the maths myself but I can’t see anywhere what the other costs of the electric bill actually are anywhere excluding the hole sale price that Ripple costs at 2p Kw ...

Ofgem's most recent infographic is here but it's not particularly illuminating:
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/infographic-bills-prices-and-profits

The best I can tell is that wholesale costs at the time were 29% of the roughly £600 average electricity bill, so £175 for 2900kWh or just under 6p/kWh (before VAT). Hence Ripple saying they would save their members 4p/kWh, £116/yr for the same average 2900kWh consumer.

Wholesale costs are currently averaging around 18p/kWh (that's the value I'm currently expecting to see used for the April cap calcs) so Ripple WT1 savings could be 16p/kWh, 4x the previous and £464/yr. However customers bills will have gone up by that much so the net effect will be to keep bills at current levels.

This assumes I understand the Ripple financial model and that's far from certain. Ripple WT1 is due to start generating in February so we'll find out how it works in practice in the second quarter of next year.

Anyone signing up now for Ripple WT2 won't start to benefit until late 2022, unless they can move the project dates forward. I don't even know where they have planned to build it; does anyone know?

Verdigris

I don't even know where they have planned to build it; does anyone know?

Somewhere in Scotland.

barker77

Another noddy q sorry. Has octopus or anyone else guaranteed that they will sell ripple energy as I worry could be left with a supplier that is otherwise much more expensive etc 

Verdigris

Ripple were talking about having arrangements with more suppliers, but that was before the present debacle, so they may not exist any more.

barker77

Is it the case then that no one might end up selling their electric? Or am I worrying without case