LBC - Defence Help

wrestling231

Hello 
I have received a LBC with the following details.
- Claimants representatives; Gladstone solicitors. 
- location - Seymour Grove Retail Park
- Issuer- ES parking enforcement ltd 
- Incident Date - 31/08/2018
- NTK sent on the 24/09/18 For £100 (initially went to my leasing company on the 06/09/18)
- Final demand sent on the 06/03/2020 for £125
The image attached shows the sign of the private parking area and they have images of me leaving the parking area (SAR requested)
A couple of points for defense;
- unclear signs and too high up for people to read.
- They have taken  creepy pictures of me leaving the site (surely the attendant could have advised me not to leave the site, possible negligence on the parking attendants behalf)
- Final Demand payment of £125, £25 over the original amount charged.
- The NTK does not give the full address details of the incident location; only the name of the retail park; "Seymour grove retail park. Manchester " no postcode given. 
- I left the site (couple of mins) to shop in the local corner next to the retail park and then went back into Iceland within the retail park to continue to shop. (CCTV footage requested from iceland). 
- My wife and child remained in the car while I went to the local shop (I was there for a mere 5mins). I then went back to the car, to collect my wife and kids and we then went to iceland together within the retail park. 
- The NTK delivered through post on the 24/09/18 does not  specify the maximum additional costs they may seek to recover. A generic statement is used; 
"Should the parking charge remain unpaid after 28 days of this notice being sent, additional charges arising from the debt recovery and/or court action may be incurred".
I have emailed gladstones asking them to delay the case by 30 days and I am awaiting a response. 
I have also emailed ES parking enforcement ltd for a clearer sign of the parking T&C's.
I have emailed the local councilor in Trafford to advise of this issue and she has dealt with this in the past and the parking site has had negative press before hand. 
https://www.kategreen.org/latest-news/2019/03/29/update-on-private-parking-operators/
https://news4trafford.co.uk/2018/11/16/car-park-enforcement-officers-face-backlash-from-residents-in-old-trafford/
Any help/feedback much appreciated.

Redx

Any defence ( no S) will rely on the core terms , plus the fact that it's difficult to set boundaries etc in cases like these , so I don't think any have succeeded

Pictures are taken in public places everyday , so I wouldn't expect anything to come of it as far as your indignation is concerned

Which parking company is involved ? ES Parking ?

Who issued the LBC ?

Did the LBC give you 30 days notice and also include financial forms ?

D_P_Dance

Have you received  a PCN for leaving site?   Have you read the newbies threads?I

Nine times out of ten these tickets are scams, so consider complaining to your MP., it can cause the scammer extra costs and work, and in some cases, cancellation. 

Parliament is well aware of the MO of these private parking companies, many of whom are former clampers, and on 15th March 2019 a Bill was enacted to curb the excesses of these shysters. Codes of Practice are being drawn up, an independent appeals service will be set up,

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many DVLA's date base more rigorously policed, persistent offenders denied access to the DVLA database and unable to operate.

Hopefully life will become impossible for the worst of these scammers, but until this is done you should still complain to your MP, citing the new legislation.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2019/8/contents/of these Private Parking Companies.

Just as the clampers were finally closed down, so hopefully will many of these Private Parking Companies.

wrestling231

Redx said:

Any defence ( no S) will rely on the core terms , plus the fact that it's difficult to set boundaries etc in cases like these , so I don't think any have succeeded

Pictures are taken in public places everyday , so I wouldn't expect anything to come of it as far as your indignation is concerned

Which parking company is involved ? ES Parking ?

Who issued the LBC ?

Did the LBC give you 30 days notice and also include financial forms ?

correct ES parking 
and it was gladstone solicitors.
30 days notice has been given and no financial forms included. it gives a generic letter on ways to pay and the breakdown of the court costs should it go to court

Umkomaas

it gives a generic letter on ways to pay and the breakdown of the court costs should i take it to court. 

In case of any misunderstanding, it will be ES/Gladstones who take it to court, not you. 

D_P_Dance

AFAIAA, there is no law which forbids photography in these places.  Please answer my question. in post number 3. 

Fruitcake

As far as I am aware it is not illegal or unlawful to take pictures of people in a public place. 
In some circumstances, private property is still classed as a public place where the public have access to it. A public house or a privately owned car park would fall unto this category.

The laws concerning indecency are complicated and you would need to consult a legal professional on the subject, but I believe that even an image of a topless pre-pubescent child is not considered indecent, so I doubt you will get anywhere if all the people in the scammer's images are fully clothed.

As for scammers taking pictures of people to enforce a leaving site parking event, defining the site boundary either by words or a map or both is crucial to their case, as would be proving the images of random people were occupants of a specific vehicle.

D_P_Dance

I very much doubt that a "leaving site" claim could survive a well argued defence that such was not an unfair term under CRE.  x

beamerguy

You have already highlighted that the same happened before and reached the press.

You should be talking to the landowner about the contract he has with PPC, or the press should ask ?  It will no doubt be for car park management.   That means cars and not people. 
Are they allowed by the landlord to do surveillance ?  Surveillance as performed by the Police, HMRC and Works and Pensions and councils ?

The question is what happened to your pictures ?   The parking weasels cannot be trusted .
You have more questions than have been answered

Gladstones no doubt have added a fake $60

Coupon-mad

Check on the Local Authority Planning Portal to try to find that car park if it was redeveloped in recent years.  Sometimes you find that retail parks are actually required to let locals shop off site.

Easy enough to defend. Read the template defence thread to get the hang of the arguments.

wrestling231

beamerguy said:

You have already highlighted that the same happened before and reached the press.

You should be talking to the landowner about the contract he has with PPC, or the press should ask ?  It will no doubt be for car park management.   That means cars and not people. 
Are they allowed by the landlord to do surveillance ?  Surveillance as performed by the Police, HMRC and Works and Pensions and councils ?

The question is what happened to your pictures ?   The parking weasels cannot be trusted .
You have more questions than have been answered

Gladstones no doubt have added a fake $60

so i requested a SAR and they have 8 images of me in the picture ...locating the landowner has not been easy. i have complained to the local mp today. and i am awaiting a response.