Take care when applying for the severely mentally impaired person Council Tax Discount

Icequeen1

CIS said:

madcarer said:

Just spoke to Blackpool Council Tax team. I had major problems getting through security, as they have now said that I’m not on the Council Tax bill but the person that I care for is now liable for 75% of the Council Tax!!! I have one email telling me that I have been awarded 25% Carers allowance, and a second saying that I have been awarded the 25% single occupancy. Now they maintain that you get either one or the other but not both! 

And that is certainly incorrect - s6(3) of the LGFA 1992 prevents a joint tenant who is SMI from being held liable with a tenant who is nor SMI.

The correct situation is that you are both disregarded - SMI and Carer respectively - to give a 50% 'double disregard' and you fall liable as the 'non-SMI' tenant.

Believe me when I say many council's do not train their staff properly for basic issues such as this - I've worked in council tax for the best part of 20 years (for a council and currently as an independent advisor) and the situation is no better than it was when I first started.

CIS - this is helpful - are there any requirements about who qualifies as a 'live in carer' - can it be a family member/spouse who lives there anyway? 

CIS

calcotti said:

Icequeen1 said: I think in that case though there is still a minimum of 50% to be paid (see https://www.gov.uk/council-tax/who-has-to-pay)

I didn’t know the minimum 50% rule.

  This is because the maximum reduction due to council tax disregards is 50%, unless it's a case where an exemption applies (such as students or SMI).

CIS

Icequeen1 said:

CIS said:

madcarer said:

Just spoke to Blackpool Council Tax team. I had major problems getting through security, as they have now said that I’m not on the Council Tax bill but the person that I care for is now liable for 75% of the Council Tax!!! I have one email telling me that I have been awarded 25% Carers allowance, and a second saying that I have been awarded the 25% single occupancy. Now they maintain that you get either one or the other but not both! 

And that is certainly incorrect - s6(3) of the LGFA 1992 prevents a joint tenant who is SMI from being held liable with a tenant who is nor SMI.

The correct situation is that you are both disregarded - SMI and Carer respectively - to give a 50% 'double disregard' and you fall liable as the 'non-SMI' tenant.

Believe me when I say many council's do not train their staff properly for basic issues such as this - I've worked in council tax for the best part of 20 years (for a council and currently as an independent advisor) and the situation is no better than it was when I first started.

CIS - this is helpful - are there any requirements about who qualifies as a 'live in carer' - can it be a family member/spouse who lives there anyway? 

In this case, apart from the qualifying benefit requirements, the legislation requires

(b)     resident in the same dwelling as the person to whom he is providing care;
(c)     providing that care for at least 35 hours a week on average; and
(d)     not a disqualified relative of that person.

Where a disqualified relative is,

(1)     For the purposes of paragraph 3 above, a person is a disqualified relative of another if—
(a)     he is the spouse of the other or they live together as husband and wife; or
(aa)     he is the civil partner of the other or they live together as if they were civil partners;
(b)     he is the parent of the other, who is a child below the age of 18 years.

calcotti

CIS said:

calcotti said:

Icequeen1 said: I think in that case though there is still a minimum of 50% to be paid (see https://www.gov.uk/council-tax/who-has-to-pay)

I didn’t know the minimum 50% rule.

  This is because the maximum reduction due to council tax disregards is 50%, unless it's a case where an exemption applies (such as students or SMI).

Thanks for that, I hadn’t appreciated the difference between an exemption and a disregard,

calcotti

Icequeen1 said:

CIS said:

madcarer said:

Just spoke to Blackpool Council Tax team. I had major problems getting through security, as they have now said that I’m not on the Council Tax bill but the person that I care for is now liable for 75% of the Council Tax!!! I have one email telling me that I have been awarded 25% Carers allowance, and a second saying that I have been awarded the 25% single occupancy. Now they maintain that you get either one or the other but not both! 

And that is certainly incorrect - s6(3) of the LGFA 1992 prevents a joint tenant who is SMI from being held liable with a tenant who is nor SMI.

The correct situation is that you are both disregarded - SMI and Carer respectively - to give a 50% 'double disregard' and you fall liable as the 'non-SMI' tenant.

Believe me when I say many council's do not train their staff properly for basic issues such as this - I've worked in council tax for the best part of 20 years (for a council and currently as an independent advisor) and the situation is no better than it was when I first started.

CIS - this is helpful - are there any requirements about who qualifies as a 'live in carer' - can it be a family member/spouse who lives there anyway? 

See the third post in this thread.

tomtom256

Does the fact that you are joint tenant, point away from you being a live in carer factor in to the councils decision.

I would have thought a sole tenancy in the name of the person you care for and then declare that you are a live in carer, would have  been the best option, to prevent the joint liability aspect?

calcotti

tomtom256 said:

Does the fact that you are joint tenant, point away from you being a live in carer factor in to the councils decision.

I would have thought a sole tenancy in the name of the person you care for and then declare that you are a live in carer, would have  been the best option, to prevent the joint liability aspect?

I don’t think being a joint tenant has any bearing. No doubt CIS will be able to confirm.

CIS

calcotti said:

tomtom256 said:

Does the fact that you are joint tenant, point away from you being a live in carer factor in to the councils decision.

I would have thought a sole tenancy in the name of the person you care for and then declare that you are a live in carer, would have  been the best option, to prevent the joint liability aspect?

I don’t think being a joint tenant has any bearing. No doubt CIS will be able to confirm.

It doesn't for the amount of any disregard discount (which is still 50% - 2 x 25%) however it could affect the CTR side and thus any help towards the council tax that may be due, depending on the age/financial situation of the tenants,. In this case, unless there's a large income difference between the two parties, I don't think it will make too much difference at the end of the day.

madcarer

Thank you everyone, I sent an email to the Council Tax department with the link you provided to the gov.uk site link to council tax/who has to pay  The Council have now decided that we are entitled to the 50 % double disregard.

calcotti

madcarer said:

Thank you everyone, I sent an email to the Council Tax department with the link you provided to the gov.uk site link to council tax/who has to pay  The Council have now decided that we are entitled to the 50 % double disregard.

Good, I trust they have backdated it too. Thanks for posting back.