Joint accounts and probate

Swipe

My father passed away and the majority of the savings accounts are in joint accounts in both names, apart from 4 solely in his name. The house is in both their names as joint tenants so will pass directly to my mother. Nothing has been agreed yet but the solicitor will probably be applying for probate. Do all these accounts and the house form the value of the estate regarding the solicitors fee or is the valued estate in question regarding probate just the total value of the sole accounts?

Keep_pedalling

There is a good chance probate is not required. If those 4 accounts are cash accounts and are below the bank’s limit for releasing the assets without the need for probate it won’t be required.

Even if probate is required this is such a simple estate that you can easily do it yourselves no need to appoint solicitors. 

xylophone

This looks like a very simple estate.  If probate is required, you could do it yourself?
https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/family/guide-to-probate/

Swipe

Thanks. One of the accounts is just over £51k in Leek United Building Society and they want probate over £20K. There are also a few Lloyds bank shares (probably not worth much now though) My 80 year old mother is the named executor along with the solicitor unfortunately, not me or I'd do it myself. Is there any way around this?

I've checked the other 3 accounts and they all fall under the institutions probate limits. Does this mean that the value of the estate is just £51k plus the few hundred quid of Lloyds shares? So if she appoints the solicitor, they won't be taking a percentage of the total value of the whole estate i.e. house, joint accounts and sole accounts?

Alternatively, could I ask the solicitor to act as an executor but in a supervisory role, leaving me to do the majority of the administration myself?

badger09

Swipe said:

Thanks. One of the accounts is just over £51k in Leek United Building Society and they want probate over £20K. There are also a few Lloyds bank shares (probably not worth much now though) My 80 year old mother is the named executor along with the solicitor unfortunately, not me or I'd do it myself. Is there any way around this?

I've checked the other 3 accounts and they all fall under the institutions probate limits. Does this mean that the value of the estate is just £51k plus the few hundred quid of Lloyds shares? So if she appoints the solicitor, they won't be taking a percentage of the total value of the whole estate i.e. house, joint accounts and sole accounts?

Alternatively, could I ask the solicitor to act as an executor but in a supervisory role, leaving me to do the majority of the administration myself?

You could ask the solicitor either to Renounce (give up the Executor role completely) or to Reserve Powers. I've no idea whether they will do either, but definitely worth asking. If they won't, you'll find that your mother, with your help! will probably end up doing most of the work anyway.

As far as valuing the estate goes, you have to include your late father's share of all the joint assets, even though they pass to your mum (so won't incur IHT). If the solicitor is proposing to work on a %fee basis, I would be working very hard to persuade them to Renounce if at all possible.

Swipe

badger09 said:

Swipe said:

Thanks. One of the accounts is just over £51k in Leek United Building Society and they want probate over £20K. There are also a few Lloyds bank shares (probably not worth much now though) My 80 year old mother is the named executor along with the solicitor unfortunately, not me or I'd do it myself. Is there any way around this?

I've checked the other 3 accounts and they all fall under the institutions probate limits. Does this mean that the value of the estate is just £51k plus the few hundred quid of Lloyds shares? So if she appoints the solicitor, they won't be taking a percentage of the total value of the whole estate i.e. house, joint accounts and sole accounts?

Alternatively, could I ask the solicitor to act as an executor but in a supervisory role, leaving me to do the majority of the administration myself?

You could ask the solicitor either to Renounce (give up the Executor role completely) or to Reserve Powers. I've no idea whether they will do either, but definitely worth asking. If they won't, you'll find that your mother, with your help! will probably end up doing most of the work anyway.

As far as valuing the estate goes, you have to include your late father's share of all the joint assets, even though they pass to your mum (so won't incur IHT). If the solicitor is proposing to work on a %fee basis, I would be working very hard to persuade them to Renounce if at all possible.

Thanks for that. I've yet to have that conversation with the solicitor. I was a bit miffed with Leek united having such a low probate threshold until I saw, in typical fashion, Nationwide requires it for over just £5k

xylophone

There are also a few Lloyds bank shares (probably not worth much now though) 

 Registrar would likely require probate.

 You could ask the solicitor to renounce.

https://www.getprobate.com/can-i-remove-a-solicitor-acting-as-executor-of-a-will/#:~:text=Ethically%20a%20solicitor%20should%20agree,continue%20to%20act%20as%20Executor.

That said, your comment about the value of the estate indicates that you would need to read up......

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/inheritance-tax-return-of-estate-information-iht205-2011

Read the notes in the above carefully.

Keep_pedalling

Swipe said:

badger09 said:

Swipe said:

Thanks. One of the accounts is just over £51k in Leek United Building Society and they want probate over £20K. There are also a few Lloyds bank shares (probably not worth much now though) My 80 year old mother is the named executor along with the solicitor unfortunately, not me or I'd do it myself. Is there any way around this?

I've checked the other 3 accounts and they all fall under the institutions probate limits. Does this mean that the value of the estate is just £51k plus the few hundred quid of Lloyds shares? So if she appoints the solicitor, they won't be taking a percentage of the total value of the whole estate i.e. house, joint accounts and sole accounts?

Alternatively, could I ask the solicitor to act as an executor but in a supervisory role, leaving me to do the majority of the administration myself?

You could ask the solicitor either to Renounce (give up the Executor role completely) or to Reserve Powers. I've no idea whether they will do either, but definitely worth asking. If they won't, you'll find that your mother, with your help! will probably end up doing most of the work anyway.

As far as valuing the estate goes, you have to include your late father's share of all the joint assets, even though they pass to your mum (so won't incur IHT). If the solicitor is proposing to work on a %fee basis, I would be working very hard to persuade them to Renounce if at all possible.

Thanks for that. I've yet to have that conversation with the solicitor. I was a bit miffed with Leek united having such a low probate threshold until I saw, in typical fashion, Nationwide requires it for over just £5k

It is highly unlikely that a solicitor would use percentage charging on an estate like this ( you would have just cause for a complaint if they did) and it is much more likely that they would agree to renounce.

If, as likely , you mother’s will was written at the same time then she really should get a new one drawn up appointing her children as executors.

As for Nationwide, until recently they did require you to get their form signed off by a solicitor if the amount exceeded £5k and they required probate if the amount exceeded £20k but that was changed last year the new limit is £50k and no solicitor required at all.

JGB1955

I am currently dealing with my late fathers share in Lloyd’s.  The Registrars (Equiniti) have a Small Estates service whereby you can sell a shareholding up to £10,000 without probate.

Frogletina

Swipe said:

badger09 said:

Swipe said:

Thanks. One of the accounts is just over £51k in Leek United Building Society and they want probate over £20K. There are also a few Lloyds bank shares (probably not worth much now though) My 80 year old mother is the named executor along with the solicitor unfortunately, not me or I'd do it myself. Is there any way around this?

I've checked the other 3 accounts and they all fall under the institutions probate limits. Does this mean that the value of the estate is just £51k plus the few hundred quid of Lloyds shares? So if she appoints the solicitor, they won't be taking a percentage of the total value of the whole estate i.e. house, joint accounts and sole accounts?

Alternatively, could I ask the solicitor to act as an executor but in a supervisory role, leaving me to do the majority of the administration myself?

You could ask the solicitor either to Renounce (give up the Executor role completely) or to Reserve Powers. I've no idea whether they will do either, but definitely worth asking. If they won't, you'll find that your mother, with your help! will probably end up doing most of the work anyway.

As far as valuing the estate goes, you have to include your late father's share of all the joint assets, even though they pass to your mum (so won't incur IHT). If the solicitor is proposing to work on a %fee basis, I would be working very hard to persuade them to Renounce if at all possible.

Thanks for that. I've yet to have that conversation with the solicitor. I was a bit miffed with Leek united having such a low probate threshold until I saw, in typical fashion, Nationwide requires it for over just £5k

I can beat that easily.
Coventry Building Society sent me a letter asking for the sealed grant of representation and signed instructions for a sole account which held £0.57p.

badger09

Frogletina said:

Swipe said:

badger09 said:

Swipe said:

Thanks. One of the accounts is just over £51k in Leek United Building Society and they want probate over £20K. There are also a few Lloyds bank shares (probably not worth much now though) My 80 year old mother is the named executor along with the solicitor unfortunately, not me or I'd do it myself. Is there any way around this?

I've checked the other 3 accounts and they all fall under the institutions probate limits. Does this mean that the value of the estate is just £51k plus the few hundred quid of Lloyds shares? So if she appoints the solicitor, they won't be taking a percentage of the total value of the whole estate i.e. house, joint accounts and sole accounts?

Alternatively, could I ask the solicitor to act as an executor but in a supervisory role, leaving me to do the majority of the administration myself?

You could ask the solicitor either to Renounce (give up the Executor role completely) or to Reserve Powers. I've no idea whether they will do either, but definitely worth asking. If they won't, you'll find that your mother, with your help! will probably end up doing most of the work anyway.

As far as valuing the estate goes, you have to include your late father's share of all the joint assets, even though they pass to your mum (so won't incur IHT). If the solicitor is proposing to work on a %fee basis, I would be working very hard to persuade them to Renounce if at all possible.

Thanks for that. I've yet to have that conversation with the solicitor. I was a bit miffed with Leek united having such a low probate threshold until I saw, in typical fashion, Nationwide requires it for over just £5k

I can beat that easily.
Coventry Building Society sent me a letter asking for the sealed grant of representation and signed instructions for a sole account which held £0.57p.

I know what my instructions would have been