Pip for carer with anxiety and depression

Frances123

I'm the carer of a son with moderate to severe learning difficulties, epilepsy and autisim.
I've had anxiety and depression for years, I took an overdose 2 years ago and spent a couple of nights in an icu ward.
I take meds, but for the past few months have been feeling not good at all and I dont know what to do as any counselling or cbt I've had in the past has not helped at all.
I've made a telephone appointment with my gp and was thinking I should apply for pip for myself...but the thought of just saying how sad and miserable I feel makes me think I would be wasting my time and theirs not to mention the stress of it all when feeling like this.
I just wanted opinions as to is it worth trying for mental health problems...especially as being a carer I cook and launder and look after my son...even though I dont bother taking care of myself.
Any experiences or opinions on this would be good to know.
Thanks

poppy12345

There's lots of people that claim PIP for mental health reasons. Whether you're entitled to anything will depend on how your conditions affect you against the PIP descriptors. The only person that will know that is yourself.

Doing some research to know what the descriptors mean and what the criteria is will definitely help. This link is a good place to start.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/personal-independence-payment-assessment-guide-for-assessment-providers/pip-assessment-guide-part-2-the-assessment-criteria

If you do decide to apply when you fill in the forms then i'd advise putting as much information as possible about how your conditions affect you. Then add a couple of real life examples of what happened the last time you attempted that activity for each descriptor that applies to you.

As for your condition getting worse in the past few months, that totally understandable due to current circumstances. I did hear on the radio a few days ago that mental health has increase 250% since lockdown began.

Frances123

Thanks Poppy
I think a lot of how my condition affects me is going to be on the 'anything else you need to tell us" 
Eg yes I can prepare a meal but dont eat anything but a slice of cake or a bar of chocolate for weeks at a time...Can I ask do you think they read all the added info?
Also, I've been referred for a carers assessment to see if there's any help or support they can provide, would this be something to include with a pip claim, along with gp letters?

poppy12345

Please do have a read of the guide i posted in the link. For example. You said, you only eat things like cake or chocolate for weeks on end. Under taking nutrition the guide i posted states this...

The defined term ‘taking nutrition’ refers solely to the act of eating and drinking and so the quality of what is being consumed is irrelevant for the purposes of daily living activity 2. Therefore, if for any reason a claimant elects to have a bad or restricted diet, makes dietary choices or chooses to avoid certain foods as part of dietary requirements, they’re nevertheless ‘taking nutrition’ to an acceptable standard and therefore will not score under activity 2.

This doesn't mean that you won't score points for other descriptors though.

Yes the carers assessment may help. Letters from a GP aren't always helpful but send them anyway. The reason they aren't always helpful is that they rarely state exactly how your conditions affect you daily. They will only state basic information.

Frances123

Thanks again Poppy.
Wow...so I can tell my gp a slice of cake is an acceptable standard of nutrition...lol
Yes I will go through the details on your link.
Thank you very much for taking the time.

Spoonie_Turtle

Frances123 said:

Thanks Poppy
I think a lot of how my condition affects me is going to be on the 'anything else you need to tell us" 
Eg yes I can prepare a meal but dont eat anything but a slice of cake or a bar of chocolate for weeks at a time...Can I ask do you think they read all the added info?
Also, I've been referred for a carers assessment to see if there's any help or support they can provide, would this be something to include with a pip claim, along with gp letters?

If you need prompting or reminding to eat often enough then yes you can score points. I mean if you eat a chocolate bar or slice of cake in place of every meal, that's a separate issue, but if you're clearly not eating enough due to the effects of your condition(s) - including lack of appetite or motivation - then that is not to an acceptable standard

The quality of nutrition may come more under preparing and cooking food - if you cannot motivate yourself to prepare and cook for yourself then you can score points (e.g. if you could muster the energy/motivation for beans on toast or a microwave meal but not for an actual meal once a day, that would not be to an acceptable standard). Motivation to care for your son and motivation to care for yourself are very different things.

Once you've familiarised yourself with the descriptors and basic concepts of PIP, there's more in-depth information at https://pipinfo.net/ including case law about the details of what counts under each activity. 

Whether the DWP or assessor read all the evidence or not, send as much as is relevant. If you have to appeal it then the tribunal panel will certainly consider all the evidence.

Frances123

Thanks Spoonie..
I've had a look at that site...loads of good advice.
Does anyone know what kind of evidence as such can be helpful in these cases?
Apart from a gp letter, which as mentioned, only gives diagnosis and meds taken...
Can I ask to be referred to someone who can provide more detail as to how I'm affected?
Spent a month writing and then re writing my sons pip forms and he got awarded enhanced for both mobility and care ...was told they'd be in touch again in ten years, which was such a relief....So want to make sure I can provide as much info as possible....while missing out the unnecessary stuff.
Thanks again, Spoonie.

Spoonie_Turtle

Frances123 said:

Thanks Spoonie..
I've had a look at that site...loads of good advice.
Does anyone know what kind of evidence as such can be helpful in these cases?
Apart from a gp letter, which as mentioned, only gives diagnosis and meds taken...
Can I ask to be referred to someone who can provide more detail as to how I'm affected?
Spent a month writing and then re writing my sons pip forms and he got awarded enhanced for both mobility and care ...was told they'd be in touch again in ten years, which was such a relief....So want to make sure I can provide as much info as possible....while missing out the unnecessary stuff.
Thanks again, Spoonie.

You're very welcome, that site (and its partner site for ESA) have given me the confidence that it is worth applying for myself

Have you seen any specialists recently? If not, when you were discharged from treatment before (you said it didn't help) did any letters that they wrote explain that it's not helped? Ideally if you have something explaining that then you can say on the form that's why you've not seen any for however long. When you next see your GP you can ask for a referral and if you've not seen anyone by the time you do your application then you can at least say you're waiting for an appointment. If you've then seen someone by the time you get to having a PIP assessment you can add that information and any evidence to your claim.

You can also explain that whatever specific emotions as a result of the depression and/or anxiety are the reason you've not sought help for however long - I don't want to put words in your mouth but if you can identify exactly what's prevented you, it's most likely that whatever factors you identify are symptoms of the illnesses.

PIP aside, I hope that some help will come from your GP appointment and the carers assessment - with other professionals on your side I hope they can help you access services that will actually be of benefit to you.

I think I forgot in my previous post but the Citizens Advice Bureau website also has a good guide for filling in the form with good questions to help think of everything relevant https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/benefits/sick-or-disabled-people-and-carers/pip/help-with-your-claim/fill-in-form/

[You might find mental health-specific PIP guides out there as well if you want to Google 'PIP anxiety depression' but I can't point you in any more specific directions.]

poppy12345

Frances123 said:

Can I ask to be referred to someone who can provide more detail as to how I'm affected?

Due to current conditions this may not be possible. In my area the waiting lists are just ridiculous and there's currently no face to face appointments for anything.

My daughter has ASD, a learning disability and social anxiety disorder. She's a student and attends (did) a special school for those with learning disabilites. She has 8 hours of support a week plus extra for travel training so she can go to 1 place by herself. She was doing so well.... then lockdown happened and she lost absolutely everything. All her support, college, her daily visits from her sister. All she had was myself (mother) she locked herself in her bedroom for 3 weeks and only came out for food. Then she started humming and rocking back and fore, in amongst other things which isn't normal for her. Generally walking around like she was on a totally different planet.

I rang her GP for help and he rang me back within 20 minutes, he has regular contact with me and always speaks to me and not her because she never speaks on the phone. He referred her to the Community learning disabilites team who contacted me 24 hours later. During that phone call i was told that it would be telephone appointments for the foreseable future, not great for someone that never speaks on the phone to anyone, including me. It's a complete nightmare because there's little help out there right now for those that desperately need it.  I can only assume that this could be what you may face when requesting the referral, especially if it's for evidence reasons.

You can write a diary of how your conditions affect you daily. Do you have any family members that could write a letter of support for you? This as well as any other evidence you have will be useful.

Last but not least please don't send huge amounts of evidence because this isn't useful, less is often more. Go through all the evidence that you have and if it's not related to how your conditions affect you then think to yourself "is that going to be useful"

Giving 2-3 real life examples for every descriptor that applies to you will be the most useful thing you can do when filling out the form.

This is the PIP2 form that you will receive. Maybe worth taking a look to prepare yourself of what the questions will be on the form, so you can be 1 step ahead when they do arrive. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/713118/pip2-how-your-disability-affects-you-form.pdf

Good luck.

Frances123

Thanks for your advice and thoughts Spooney...not sure any support can be given, my son refuses any support workers or respite,so dont know what else they can do. After I took the overdose a couple of years ago the psychologist who spoke to me before discharging said he would refer me for a carers assessment but i cancelled it as i knew it would be "here's some funding for a holiday" which i wouldn't be able to take and wasn't going to solve anything...sounds ungrateful, I know but ....
With the counselling I was just talking and crying and not finding any point to it. I know a lot of people find talking and getting things off their chest helpful but I dont find this helps me.
The CBT was two sessions with someone who just looked like he'd rather be anywhere else then there...which proved true as he informed me on the third visit he'd be leaving the service and I could be assured that I would be on the top of the waiting list....I'd waited 6 months for that! 
I didnt get in touch again as I wasnt wanting to eat, bathe, go out or talk to anyone and the simple exercises set just seemed overwhelming....sorry for going on..lol
Poppy, feel for what you and your daughter are having to go through, I know with my son everything is balanced on such a fine line and the smallest thing can be a huge upset and something like what your daughter has had to go through can have such catastrophic effects on wellbeing and peace of mind. I know what it's like to see real progress and then have it thwarted, so you feel back to square one...Best wishes for you both going forward...
The help from people like you and spooney makes such a difference, thankyou.

Margaret_100

Just a couple of points to add. It is true many GP letters are not as helpful as they might be but if you have an understanding G P do ask them to explain in the letter how your condition affects your ability to look after yourself and leaving the house. Despite the present situation some GPs are not as busy as usual so it maybe a good time to get some useful help. You may need to pay for the GP letter. You can request a copy of your record from the GP which if free, this may or not be helpful to send to the DWP, if you obtain one look at it first to see if you think it would add usefull evidence.
If after looking at all the suggestions above you have more specific questions you can speak to Citizens advice, unfortunately they are not operating  face to face but are still available by phone; find the relevant telephone number here:- https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/