Help - protecting my elderly vulnerable grandma from fraud

hmolly

Hello,

Not sure if this is the right place for this, but I need some advice for my mum and grandma.

Some background: my grandma is 84 and my mum has lasting POA for her (including financial affairs). We think she may have dementia but I’m not sure if it’s been formally diagnosed. She lives alone after her husband died earlier this year. Around this time, my mum was helping her sort out some things and whilst looking through her bank statements we found out she’d been taking out LOADS of insurance policies, services, payments for things she didn’t need (e.g. five set of insurance for a 30 year old fridge!!); basically, she’s been scammed by a load of awful companies and has been making loads of payments over the phone to people who were pressuring her. My mum was really upset and we managed to cancel her cards, cancel everything she’d signed up to and got some money back. Her bank were quite unhelpful in the beginning, but now my mum has full control over her financial affairs and regularly monitors her bank accounts, gets notified if she sets up any DDs etc. My grandma lives ~2 hours away from her so she can’t be there on a day to day basis.

I spoke to my mum today and she’s really upset again, as she found out that my grandma has made yet another series of payments over the phone (despite my mum telling her repeatedly not to do so, under any circumstances). My mum is pretty switched on with things like this but I can tell it is really wearing her down, especially when the scam calls keep coming - she signed her up for one of those cold call blocking services, so not sure what more we can do there. I suggested we set her up with a new bank account and a prepaid debit card with a limit so she can’t give out her card details over the phone but like many people of her generation she likes to go to the shops and pay for her shopping in cash, pay for her paper with a cheque book etc, and I think she’d be really unhappy if we take away that aspect of her freedom.

Is there anything else we can do to help her manage her money and stay safe? I know my mum is reaching the end of her tether and I don’t really know what else to suggest.

Thank you!

Placitasgirl

I'm sorry to hear of your situation; it's incredibly similar to the one I found myself in with my dear Dad just over a year ago. Dad suffers from Alzheimer's disease which was officially diagnosed just after Mum died almost 6 years ago. He remained in their Housing Association flat but he too became a target for scam callers. In on week he purchased four warranties for a washing machine that was only 3 months old and came with a 2 year warrantee. As you say, I found it rally wearing and very upsetting having to put notes next to his phones telling him that if it was somebody he didn't know personally he must tell them to call me (I have/had LPA for his financial affairs too). That didn't work at all and we got to the point where I'm sure these hateful people knew Dad lived alone and was "vulnerable" as the number of calls he was receiving became ridiculous and it felt like he was easy prey. 

Finally I got in touch with his bank and they cancelled his debit card, replacing it instead with a cashpoint card which could only be used at an ATM and not to purchase goods physically or online. As LPA I had a debit card for Dad's account and we'd use that or draw cash when I took him to do his shopping. Perhaps Mum could discuss a weekly limit for cash withdrawals with Gran's bank; enough for her shopping and a small contingency fund but not enough that it would be a risk to carry around or keep at home? In my experience once Dad's bank understood the scale of the issue and his illness they were extremely sympathetic and very helpful indeed. 

We then bought a call blocker for his phone line from Amazon. This little device (it cost around £20) simply plugged into his phone but could be programmed with any numbers which should be allowed through. We set up all friends/relatives numbers so they would continue as before but any numbers not "approved" were blocked. These callers got a message saying that their call couldn't be connected. We could also block overseas calls. 

I also moved Dad's landline (and TV package) to BT who provided a much better privacy/call screening service than Virgin Media who he'd been with before. 

These steps really helped us to tackle the scam callers (although not all were scams; some were "legitimate" domestic appliance insurance companies, but they kept calling even after Dad had purchased a warranty he didn't need from them, or, I believe passed his details onto "other" companies who then called and tried to sell to him again) and gave me some peace of mind that we were doing all we could to keep Dad safe from these calls whilst he lived alone. A short time later Dad suffered a stroke and this, along with the progression of his illness led to him moving to a care home, where I'm pleased to say he's happy, healthy, thriving and away from these evil companies and their incessant calls. 

I hope this may have been of some help and wish you and your Mum all the very best on your journey with Gran. 

SeaVixen

Placitasgirl has covered quite a lot of useful points! All of those are well worth looking into, as the easiest option would be to stop these calls getting to your Gran. 

There are a few things you could teach your Gran that would help as well, though I appreciate it much of this will depend on her health, and may not be appropriate. 
Does your gran acknowledge that some of these payments were unnecessary? It would be helpful to differentiate if she is paying because she thinks she thinks she needs the service they are providing, or if she's paying because they're pressuring her - so she gives in to make them go away. 

If it's the former, maybe it's worth having a list of everything she currently pays for (including various insurances, who they are with, and when they run out) so that if she gets a call through she can at least see what she already has. This would let her keep her sense of agency and give her confidence that she does not need what they are selling. 

Would she be up for a system where she takes the information down that these companies give her, and then discusses them with your mum before making a payment? This would remove her sense of agency, however it could be a welcome defence for her to say "My daughter makes these decisions for me. I need to speak to her." While this is announcing that she is vulnerable, if she's strong willed enough to stick to her guns - including putting the phone down if necessary -  it might help. Even if this system isn't in place, you could ask her to say that. If it's a service she genuinely needs, she'll be able to call them back.

gettingtheresometime

We have an internet based phone system & you can forward calls to another number.

if your nan had something similar any time someone rang your nan's number your mum could receive the call but in the meantime your nan could have access to a phone to make calls

Keep_pedalling

The obvious first step is to get her phone number changed, 

ouraggie

Re the appliance cover, we have had similar experiences with OH's mum. She's with BT and every couple of days I log into her online account and go through the list of calls she has recently received and made. So far I have blacklisted and blocked 79 scam callers without her knowing (appliance cover, Vanquis, PPI, accident claims, wordsearch prize draws etc etc). I reckon there is definitely a "mugs list" and her name is well and truly on it.
 Also, I have spotted that if she gets a call which she misses, she often dials the number back to see who it was! Have now started training her to just make a note of the number and give it to me to look up for her. 
She also phones 118 to get numbers and is charged lord knows how much for that. And don't get me started on the speaking clock!!
Every now and then a scammer gets past my beady eye and she gets stung. Most recently she was sold a call blocker phone for £120. Same phone was £34.99 in Argos. Every time this happens I say to her " If THEY come to YOU with whatever it is they've got, do not buy it." Slowly she is getting the message. 
It is both frustrating and heartbreaking, though. 

whiteguineapig

I think it's an age thing, my dad always rushed to answer the phone even when I put all of our names in, he always answered the unknowns as well.
He seemed to think it was disrespectful (?) to ignore someone that was ringing him.