Furlough & Performance Appraisal

Galloglass

Looking at this as a straightforward employment case, if you fail to attend, you could find yourself dismissed. It may be better to attend and ask the question whether the work would be paid work or not? 

Clearly if the employer states it is unpaid, refusal would not be grounds for dismissal as that dismissal would be unlawful (being on furlough). If he says it is paid, and you refuse, there are grounds for instant dismisal with no comeback.

https://www.riaabarkergillette.com/uk/dismissing-employees-2-years-service/

You should not assume or presume the company's relationship with HMRC. You need to get the employer to confirm in writing or verbally (take someone with you) about the payment situation as it will all turn on that.

grumpyoldman1

Gonna-be-debt-free said:

grumpyoldman1 said:

My boss has put me onto furlough but has subsequently asked for volunteers to go into the shop where I work and prep it for re-opening. I have other plans so declined to which he replied you need to consider whether this company is right for you. He then requested I come on for a performance review in amongst some rather derogatory language. I was on probation anyway but surely he cant force me to come in for an appraisal, and further he has said I can bring someone with me, which feels like a disciplinary rather than a performance review. I fear my days are numbered and yet I feel I have done nothing wrong. Do I have a leg to stand on, and whats allowed or not allowed in this current climate?
I like my job but not this situation, its leaving a sour taste. Of course he may just extend the probation period but it's the whole situation and uncertainty that's bothering me.

thanks

When you say you are on probation, do you mean as a new starter?  Reading between the lines if he is suggesting you bring someone in with you then I think you are not going to pass your probation.  I am making no judgement on whether that should be the case or not, but I think you should be prepared.

thanks, definitely prepared, ironically though being on probation why doesnt he just say n the mtg you have failed, instead of going through all of this rigmarole of 'you can bring someone with you, a union rep..' nonsense.
Anyway its 4pm today, so not long.

grumpyoldman1

Galloglass said:

Looking at this as a straightforward employment case, if you fail to attend, you could find yourself dismissed. It may be better to attend and ask the question whether the work would be paid work or not? 

Clearly if the employer states it is unpaid, refusal would not be grounds for dismissal as that dismissal would be unlawful (being on furlough). If he says it is paid, and you refuse, there are grounds for instant dismisal with no comeback.

https://www.riaabarkergillette.com/uk/dismissing-employees-2-years-service/

You should not assume or presume the company's relationship with HMRC. You need to get the employer to confirm in writing or verbally (take someone with you) about the payment situation as it will all turn on that.

thanks very much for this. In all honesty I think its a bit like the wild west out there especially as this is a small time independent clothes retailer.  There is part due process and part taking advantage of the furlough system. So many factors in this that I cant tell which way it will go or even my rights. There is a fairly binary question which will need to be understood, i.e. you cant work if you are furloughed, despite using words like volunteering or training. At the end of the day I think it will come down to the boss and if he is level headed or not about it and is sensible rather than bloody minded, notwithstanding the 'always being available for work piece' which still assumes full pay which isn't on the table.
Time to be philosophical about the outcome I think, no point quoting laws to an employer without the chance of prodding the hornets nest and biting the hand that feeds. I do have principles though.

Galloglass

If they decide to let you go and you have under 2 years service, you cannot go to an Employment Tribunal unless ...

One of the unlesses is where you are asked to do something unlawful such as unpaid work when on furlough. That is why the payment/volunteering question is relevant. However if you were let go [lawfully] its PILON plus accrued holiday pay. May not be much but you will be owed that money.

As regards the can't work [for 3 weeks] when on furlough. If you were furloughed today, you can be brought back tomorrow. It's just they can't claim for the furlough payment and would have to pay you from their own resources. Don't get hung up on how your employer claims monies from HMRC. It is not relevant. What is relevant is whether you get paid or not.

adamp87

I feel your main points are being mixed up with replies here.

You are on furlough. You cannot work so you aren’t breaching anything.

Your employer is asking you to come in to volunteer unpaid whilst on furlough. You have no obligation to do so. I know places like CEX are doing this, and I’m sure there are others.

Again I think a review should be under paid conditions also, so again whilst you are on furlough I wouldn’t be attending.

Under 2 years they can fire you whatever within very few circumstances. So there is that to consider.

Personally I’d be replying that you are on furlough & as such are not allowed legally to work. 

sam8787

You are on Furlough so you don't technically have to go in but then they technically don't have to put you on Furlough do they

grumpyoldman1

Thanks to all for your advice and counsel. strangest meeting ever. Three people including myself, no notes taken, all standing apart on the shop floor. I was the only one in a mask and gloves. Probation extended, no problem with work, here have a verbal warning! Madness.

Gonna-be-debt-free

grumpyoldman1 said:

Thanks to all for your advice and counsel. strangest meeting ever. Three people including myself, no notes taken, all standing apart on the shop floor. I was the only one in a mask and gloves. Probation extended, no problem with work, here have a verbal warning! Madness.

What is the verbal warning for?

adamp87

sam8787 said:

You are on Furlough so you don't technically have to go in but then they technically don't have to put you on Furlough do they

No they don’t but they chose to and therefore there are legal requirements about that around working. It isn’t a get out clause

grumpyoldman1

Gonna-be-debt-free said:

grumpyoldman1 said:

Thanks to all for your advice and counsel. strangest meeting ever. Three people including myself, no notes taken, all standing apart on the shop floor. I was the only one in a mask and gloves. Probation extended, no problem with work, here have a verbal warning! Madness.

What is the verbal warning for?

being disrespectful over a whatsapp message. Trumped up charges but hey ho. A bully has to get the last word doesn't he to save face with his peers.