Redundancy and furlough pay

TraceyD1976

Hi, My partner was on furlough from his job. All employees received a entering a redundancy consultation letter. 3 weeks later he received a letter on the Friday to say that as of Monday (18th May) he was made redundant and is not required to work
his notice. A few other members of staff have also been made redundant too and the rest have now returned to work. They gave the reason that there wasn’t enough work due to
coronavirus. However in the last 2 weeks the busy has really picked up and its getting busy. He was furloughed for a total of 7 weeks. He had been employed there for 11 years. The calculation for his notice/holiday/redundancy all seem to be correct. What we are wanting to know is, when can he start a new job? As his employment ended immediately as of 18th May, does that mean he can work as of now or has he got to wait till the 11 weeks have passed, as that would be his notice? Or has he got to wait till he is paid out which won’t be until the end of June? The other thing we were wanting advice on was he asked if they could keep him on the furlough scheme instead to see how the business picks up before deciding, or to keep him on furlough until the end of the scheme then make him redundant. The HR dept replied that it was against the law to keep employees on the job retention scheme knowing they do not have a job to return to. Is this correct as surely that was the intention of the scheme, to avoid redundancies? (Considering business has already picked up) Thanks in advance for you help

Jeremy535897

I think the HR department are using an argument that doesn't really hold water concerning furlough, but I can understand that the decision has been made and they want to keep to it. Rehiring after making people redundant was always envisaged under the furlough scheme, but the employer doesn't have to. The real issue is that they are paying him already not to work for 11 weeks, so they can't furlough him for the same period as well.

If his job ended on 18 May he should be able to look for other work. Presumably he will have been told what his rights are when he was made redundant.

sharpe106

Jeremy535897 said:

If his job ended on 18 May he should be able to look for other work. Presumably he will have been told what his rights are when he was made redundant.

The way I read the post is that they are still paying the notice period but they do not want them to attend work, which if that is the case they can in theory call the back in so best to discuss it with them. If the notice period ended on the 18th May as you say should be no issues looking for other work.

TraceyD1976

His letter stated that as of Monday 18th May he will no longer be employed by said company and his position has been made redundant. Also states you will not be required to work your notice, then sets out what his package is and when it will be paid. So we are just confused as to whether he can or cannot find work else where during the 11 wks they are paying for his notice, even though his employment has already ended. 

Jeremy535897

I can't see why he should not be able to look for a job now, but if you feel any doubt just ring the ex employer up and ask.

TraceyD1976

Jeremy535897 said:

I think the HR department are using an argument that doesn't really hold water concerning furlough, but I can understand that the decision has been made and they want to keep to it. Rehiring after making people redundant was always envisaged under the furlough scheme, but the employer doesn't have to. The real issue is that they are paying him already not to work for 11 weeks, so they can't furlough him for the same period as well.

If his job ended on 18 May he should be able to look for other work. Presumably he will have been told what his rights are when he was made redundant.

But couldn’t they have kept him on furlough till the end of the scheme then made him redundant if they felt it was still necessary? They said business had been reduced by 80% which is understandable. However in the last 2 weeks business has greatly increased and it won’t be long until it returns to normal. But HR said this is against the law to do so? I really don’t understand it as surely with business increasing now they’ve shot themselves in the foot as his role will be needed very soon and they will be unable to employ anyone in that position for 1 year (if that’s correct which is what HR have said)

sharpe106

 If I was in that situation I would phone them and check with them. Doubt they would care as it sounds like they do not want them back at all even if there is work for them. 

TraceyD1976

TraceyD1976 said:

Jeremy535897 said:

I think the HR department are using an argument that doesn't really hold water concerning furlough, but I can understand that the decision has been made and they want to keep to it. Rehiring after making people redundant was always envisaged under the furlough scheme, but the employer doesn't have to. The real issue is that they are paying him already not to work for 11 weeks, so they can't furlough him for the same period as well.

If his job ended on 18 May he should be able to look for other work. Presumably he will have been told what his rights are when he was made redundant.

But couldn’t they have kept him on furlough till the end of the scheme then made him redundant if they felt it was still necessary? They said business had been reduced by 80% which is understandable. However in the last 2 weeks business has greatly increased and it won’t be long until it returns to normal. But HR said this is against the law to do so? I really don’t understand it as surely with business increasing now they’ve shot themselves in the foot as his role will be needed very soon and they will be unable to employ anyone in that position for 1 year (if that’s correct which is what HR have said)

No rights were explained apart from he has 1 week to put it in writing to appeal against the decision! 

Jeremy535897

Maybe they could, but they didn't. They explained why. I said their reason was probably not valid, but you can't make your employer furlough you. If his role will be needed, as you say they may have some difficulties, so he can always ask why. He can always appeal the decision to make him redundant, but he needs grounds to do so, like it's unfair. This is an area where he needs legal expertise.

Thrugelmir

The company terminated his employment on the 18th May. Your partner is free to as he wishes. The business wouldn't have made a decision lightly to have reduced the size of it's workforce. Recruitment being an expensive and time consuming business, with no guarantee that the hire will even work out. Going to take many months to return to pre Covid levels of activity.