Trade Union Joining Yes No?

questricky8

Hi All, I work in retail for a big chain. I don't work in the big supermarket I work in the the smaller stores that are in the train stations that employs about 15-20 people in the store. I have been debating whether or not to join a trade union. My company recognes usdaw. My query is if I join will I have to notify my manager? If I dont will my manager find out?  Because I am not sure how my manager will react if I tell him that I am joining a union. Secondly, if I join will the membership fee be took out my monthly wages automatically? Lastly, how often do you often meet your union reps? Sorry if they sound stupid questions however this is my first job.

I am thinking of joing a trade union for better pay and disciplinary procedures that may arise in the future. It be good to have someone represent me rather than be on my own.

Comms69

You dont have to tell your manager
You can pay fees by direct debit
Only meet the rep when you need to

Good reason to join a union. (you can join any one you like, doesnt have to be USDAW)

Mickey666

Jsacker said:

Comms69 said:

You dont have to tell your manager
You can pay fees by direct debit
Only meet the rep when you need to

Good reason to join a union. (you can join any one you like, doesnt have to be USDAW)

Just to add to this, even if the employer finds out they cannot treat you unfairly based on the fact that you are a member etc: https://www.gov.uk/join-trade-union/trade-union-membership-your-employment-rights

True.  Legally.  But they'll know that already.

The fact is, there are good employers and bad employers.  The good ones are good enough that you don't need to join a union for the reasons stated and the bad ones won't care too much for legal niceties anyway, apart from not getting caught.  If a bad employer doesn't like an employee for some reason it's not too difficult to get rid of them in practice.  Besides, who would want to work for a bad employer anyway - better off finding another job.

Savvy_Sue

Mickey666 said:

The fact is, there are good employers and bad employers.  The good ones are good enough that you don't need to join a union for the reasons stated and the bad ones won't care too much for legal niceties anyway, apart from not getting caught.  If a bad employer doesn't like an employee for some reason it's not too difficult to get rid of them in practice.  Besides, who would want to work for a bad employer anyway - better off finding another job.

But even a good employer may sometimes start a disciplinary against an employee, or the employee may wish to raise a grievance, and I'm with the OP, in that situation I'd rather have union representation than not.

Mickey666

True, but a good employer would only start a grievance procedure against an employee with very good reason, most likely an open and shut case, because of the risks involved.  Besides, an employee is entitled to have someone else sit in on any such procedures, even a solicitor if necessary.  I’m just pointing out there are other options than union membership.

gwynlas

If you intend staying in the job long term it is definetly worth joining if you plan to work there less than two years the employer can fire you whatever.

theoretica

As the company recognises a union you may find it worth being a member as the route to get your voice heard, and to give the union a higher number of members and a more powerful voice in negotiations.  When the employer needs to consult with employees, they only need to talk to a recognised union and not to any non-members individually. 

If there are issues bothering you (and even a good employer will have some less good aspects) the union is a good route to see if colleagues agree with you and explore raising the issue without you personally being a nuisance.

Nothanks

Mickey666 said:

“a good employer would only start a grievance procedure against an employee with very good reason, most likely an open and shut case, because of the risks involved” - This is a pretty optimistic viewpoint. Also depends on size of organisation, most big employers have great policies, all it takes is one bad manager. 

.  “Besides, an employee is entitled to have someone else sit in on any such procedures, even a solicitor if necessary.” - A solicitor doesn’t have the right to attend an internal meeting. Only a union rep or work colleague. 

Full disclosure - I am a union rep so obviously I’m biased but just a couple of points for clarity from my perspective:

Nothanks

gwynlas said:

If you intend staying in the job long term it is definetly worth joining if you plan to work there less than two years the employer can fire you whatever.

Except in cases of discrimination or victimisation (“automatically unfair”) where your rights start from day one of employment. 

nicechap

Mickey666 said:

True, but a good employer would only start a grievance procedure against an employee with very good reason, most likely an open and shut case, because of the risks involved.  Besides, an employee is entitled to have someone else sit in on any such procedures, even a solicitor if necessary.  I’m just pointing out there are other options than union membership.

In my experience, most organisations do not allow solicitors to sit in on disciplinary procedures, only union reps or colleagues.  And, even good employers have poor managers who may initiate disciplinary procedures incorrectly.

John_

I can see the benefit of them, but any hint of fixed pay scales, collective pay negotiation or the like and I’d run a mile.
I believe that I should be paid what I am worth, not what the average employee at my grade is, and I’d also be uncomfortable with the idea that the slackest performing member of staff gets treated the same as the most productive.